Pay Rise ?

[stevejm]

Changing the subject. What sort of pay rise is CWU proposing to the board? Negtiations is in the final stage and no figure has been mentioned once.

They never tell you what’s being negotiated. All we know is they are talking about an above inflation rise (where have I heard that before?) A deal over 3 years- so how on earth can they know what the inflation figure will be in the future?

Did I misread Martin Walsh's post? I am sure he stated that the CWU have rejected several above-inflation pay offers - if that is true they could care less about the remuneration for their members and prefer to pander to new entrants needs in order to get more of them to join the Union and therefore increase Union subscription income.

[stevejm]

I intend to reject any deal that includes a multi year pay deal. I want a decent 1 year pay deal. Given the state of the world we have no idea what economic situation we could find ourselves in next year and we shouldnt be locking ourselves into anything.

I will consider cancelling my union membership if they don't get an inflation equaling pay rise. If everybody would do this they would soon change their negotiating strategies.

[TopperGas]

Pay rise be more then 4 per cent?.

Doesn't look like it. The Union, without consultation, have rejected several above inflation pay-rises. My take is that instead of getting everyone an above inflation rise or even an inflation matching pay-rise they would prefer to accept a lower pay-rise for all in return for improved conditions for new entrants and better VR terms. What this means in practice is a huge rise for new entrants and a paltry rise for legacy staff and a reluctance by RM to offer VR as it would have become more expensive.

I can't see that being the case on two counts, 1) any deal will have to be voted though and legacy staff out number new entrants and 2) the CWU can't really afford to lose legacy staff on mass. What I sense will happen is the CWU will portrait the deal has being great for new entrants until they read the small print of the deal.

[RuralVan]

Hmm just under 3 months now until Autumn (meteorologicly) now and September is always the favourite for when we get our payrise. Get your bets on September.

[hero22]

What percentage of new entrants are union members? Has to be a lower percentage than that of legacy staff.
Legacy staff have paid more into CWU coffers than new entrants since the last pay negotiations in 2022. MUCH MORE!
And yet the whole thrust of negotiations is to secure a massive upgrade in t&c for new entrants. Why? Could it be that long term the CWUs viability at RM depends on gaining new entrant members?
As for improving VR terms and conditions, that sounds good on paper, but the realty is that the more expensive it is for RM to offer VR then the less they'll be inclined to use it to reduce numbers.
Personally, I'd be happy to receive a slightly above inflation pay rise. A bad move to reject that. Let new entrants gain equal terms over a 3/4 year period.

Don't be so selfish, new entrants are already on 5k per year less than you for a full time contract for doing the exact same job!! Your suggestion is to equal your pay with the new entrants over 4 years?? So you're happy with the new entrants being on less than you for 4 years just so you get a pay rise. Don't be silly

Ideally everybody would get a pay-rise equivalent to inflation and new entrants would get parity, but that doesn't seem attainable.
It is quite normal in many different jobs for more experienced workers to get paid better.
In fact, when I joined 8 years ago, it took 12 months to gain parity which is far sooner than in other jobs.
The fact is you knew the T&C when you joined and you accepted them.
It possibly came as a shock to find you were doing the same work for less than legacy staff. But as I explained above, this is quite normal.
What isn't normal is than until now there is no path to parity. And that is what the Union is fighting for.
But what doesn't sit well with me is that I should have worse T&C, which is what will happen if I receive a below inflation pay-rise, or no pay-rise at all.
What in effect you are saying is that you want parity with legacy workers conditions [imo nothing wrong with that] and you could care less if legacy workers have to forego an inflation matching pay-rise in order for you to achieve that immediately; compromise for you is unacceptable (such as waiting 4 years or maybe a shorter period) - you want it all now - despite accepting and knowing your T&C when joining!
Legacy workers are not responsible for your inferior T&C - the company is. You should direct whatever ire you have towards them and also the Union for accepting those terms when they had the ballot for a strike to reject the proposals of RM in 2022.
Are you a Union member? I hope so. But if not, why not?

I didnt blame legacy workers for our inferior T&C did I? I just think its silly that you think that they should shaft the new entrants just to get a good pay rise for yourself and its selfish. Your point about us being on lower pay because we are less experienced is quite stupid to be honest considering this is an unskilled job so experience shouldnt make a difference, I dont see any other unskilled jobs paying based from experience?
Were you happy when you joined 8 years ago and getting less pay than your colleagues? Be honest

Took most of us 12 months to gain pay parity, not to mention many of us started on 24 hour contracts and it took years to
Work our way up to full time. Thats what i signed up for when i started , so not sure why any of the new starts took the job if they think its unfair. Lot of the new ones seem to think they instantly deserves pay parity, whatever holidays they want and a duty of their choice.

Can you explain what the difference in pay was for you back then? I'm sure its not as big of a difference as it is now
12 months is very different to the 4 years you are suggesting and its already been 3.
So you believe you should be earning more money than somebody doing the exact same job just because you have been a postman for longer? Very strange

It was a couple of pounds per hour i believe until it equalled after a year. I didn’t suggest the 3-4 year period , someone else did. Do you feel that you should also be on an equal contract length with longer term staff straight away ? What about a duty pick, would that also be fair to hand out straight away ? The legacy staff as there called did not get things handed to them on a plate. Many spent days without pay not so long ago to get a fair pay deal so forgive me if im not dripping with sympathy for those who happily accepted the job then suddenly think they deserve more.

Maybe the new contract staff should get the union, assuming your all paid up members to organise some strike action to implement the changes you want to see.

[Rommagic]

Maybe we know today instead of end of the week but I doubt it.

[Ren Hoëk]

I intend to reject any deal that includes a multi year pay deal. I want a decent 1 year pay deal. Given the state of the world we have no idea what economic situation we could find ourselves in next year and we shouldnt be locking ourselves into anything.

I will consider cancelling my union membership if they don't get an inflation equaling pay rise. If everybody would do this they would soon change their negotiating strategies.

I 100% will be cancelling. It is the only reason Iv kept my subs up as they have completely failed me on every issue I have had in the last couple of years. Iv had to sort everything myself and im no stranger to the area and div reps. I was a rep and got shafted. Once you look behind the curtain you realise what a bunch of amateurs they are.

[qwerty2]

I intend to reject any deal that includes a multi year pay deal. I want a decent 1 year pay deal. Given the state of the world we have no idea what economic situation we could find ourselves in next year and we shouldnt be locking ourselves into anything.

I will consider cancelling my union membership if they don't get an inflation equaling pay rise. If everybody would do this they would soon change their negotiating strategies.

I 100% will be cancelling. It is the only reason Iv kept my subs up as they have completely failed me on every issue I have had in the last couple of years. Iv had to sort everything myself and im no stranger to the area and div reps. I was a rep and got shafted. Once you look behind the curtain you realise what a bunch of amateurs they are.

Use your cwu subs by putting it in your lump sum booster (you can do it on the app) - RM have to put money in as well

[Ren Hoëk]

I intend to reject any deal that includes a multi year pay deal. I want a decent 1 year pay deal. Given the state of the world we have no idea what economic situation we could find ourselves in next year and we shouldnt be locking ourselves into anything.

I will consider cancelling my union membership if they don't get an inflation equaling pay rise. If everybody would do this they would soon change their negotiating strategies.

I 100% will be cancelling. It is the only reason Iv kept my subs up as they have completely failed me on every issue I have had in the last couple of years. Iv had to sort everything myself and im no stranger to the area and div reps. I was a rep and got shafted. Once you look behind the curtain you realise what a bunch of amateurs they are.

Use your cwu subs by putting it in your lump sum booster (you can do it on the app) - RM have to put money in as well

Already do. Il find another use for it. Perhaps just save it up and once a year stick it on red.

[Chelseablue]

If this comes in and it is the cluster f it seems , 28 years of union fees will stop

[Rommagic]

Today's the day.

[Ren Hoëk]

Today's the day.

We just need a little bit more time. Please be patient...

[Rick91]

Anyone find it a bit of a coincidence that the deal is due to be concluded the same week the former board officially stepped down? It's almost as if a deal had already been reached, possibly weeks ago, and they've just been waiting on the new board/owners to ratify it.

[qwerty2]

Today's the day. testing new biscuits

[BenacreNick]

I wouldn't hold your breath Rommagic, why not let everything takes it's natural course. You will know when it's all sorted out.