If you are voting NO - PLEASE SHARE - 'VOTE NO' LEAFLET

[miles_peters]

The GREEN agenda is a smoke screen to stitch everyone up. Next winter and summer when the lump sums are long gone will you be happy with what's expected of you with more to come in 2 years time?

[seaside]

In our terms and conditions, is anything at all being improved in this deal, or even staying the same.seems like everything is going to be worse.

[aiden01]

In our terms and conditions, is anything at all being improved in this deal, or even staying the same.seems like everything is going to be worse.

Pay obviously

[Ppat98]

The GREEN agenda is a smoke screen to stitch everyone up. Next winter and summer when the lump sums are long gone will you be happy with what's expected of you with more to come in 2 years time?

Whether it happens this year or the next 2 year's. RM will get all their change's through. Some of you guys are acting as though things will stay the same. Delay the inevitable sure but they will push things through especially being in such a dire financial situation. They have all the excuses they want to change the business model. If they were rolling in cash, it would be a difficult sell. The debt pile isn't pretty so they will get the changes through.

It's a s**t job anyway. You lot are acting like your saving some precious jewel. Used to be decent when we could drop our left over mail & packet's at the post office. Slowly gotten worse. Now clock in & clock outs. Bollocks to it. Nothing to save anymore.

[LouBarlow]

you will still be delivering in the dark, apparently being attacked non-stop by dogs and muggers

Don't moan then when it happens, and you run out of sick pay. You obviously never delivered late at night in pitch dark.

When I started we were out delivering in the dark. In the morning. Funnily enough I managed to avoid serious injury from both dogs and muggers during these years.

I can understand people being annoyed at changes to finish times, for legitimate reasons, such as childcare, but offering up ridiculous health and safety scenarios isn’t helpful.

[tonyt450]

About flexing, I saw Andy furey on an interview with the angry postman on YouTube say flexing is only at the start of the day not the end?

[timbo1234]

Everyone needs to be reminded of something.

We are only being asked if we agree with this deal. Yes or No. That's all. Nothing more, nothing less.

No one is being asked what happens if the deal is rejected. That is up to the CWU and Royal Mail. A rejection of this deal could force them to, finally, start listening to their members/employees. And then coming up with a better solution. They had an year and an half to do it. They didn't, and that's why we are here.

There's always shills trying to spin the reality. They slither out from under their rocks in every vote and election when the result is not the planned. This vote is on the deal. And we are only being given two options. That will decide our future.

What a very simplistic view. How do you reject an offer when the people who negotiated it are recommending acceptance? Are you expecting these same people to come up with something better ? A yes vote moves us on . We learn from mistakes and live to fight another day. A no vote is a leap into the unknown. We have no plan, RM will react accordingly, the workforce will be divided and we do what exactly? Strike, work to rule. RM have been right up for this dispute since day one. Voting no will play right into their hands. We are dealing with a ruthless employer who had a slash and burn agenda from the start. I am not happy with the deal but I am pragmatic.

[Slim2none]

Timbo,
John is correct. If this is a simplistic view thats because it is a simple ballot. "Do you accept the proposed agreement or not?"

We are not being balloted to sort out the future of the company. Period. Your opinion on how best to perform your daily duties is neither requested or required. So what leads you to believe anyone is listening to your thoughts of what will happen with RM in the future.

Whilst we're at it, let's just clear this up shall we. This is not yet an agreement. It is, at this stage, a proposal. Nothing has been agreed. It has been recommended by our representatives but it has not been agreed. So there's that.

If anyone wants me to get involved in ideas of how best to turn around the fortunes of this company going forward....well that's going to involve a massive pay increase and a completely different set of t&c's for me, or you or whoever takes that job. That's t&c's that will be unaffected by this proposal by the way!

Our ballot is for the proposal that's been presented. Unless of course you have been given the go ahead to be the new CEO, CFO, COO of RM or GS of CWU? If not, then you, me and everyone else is voting on the proposal that has been put in front of us. End of.

[Geordiepapa]

In our terms and conditions, is anything at all being improved in this deal, or even staying the same.seems like everything is going to be worse.

Pay obviously


And not a lot of positive change there!

[hans solo]

you will still be delivering in the dark, apparently being attacked non-stop by dogs and muggers

Don't moan then when it happens, and you run out of sick pay. You obviously never delivered late at night in pitch dark.

When I started we were out delivering in the dark. In the morning. Funnily enough I managed to avoid serious injury from both dogs and muggers during these years.

I can understand people being annoyed at changes to finish times, for legitimate reasons, such as childcare, but offering up ridiculous health and safety scenarios isn’t helpful.

It’s not ridiculous
When you started early you were out delivering before people were up
It got lighter as the day moved on.
We’re now going backwards
People will be tired and exhausted in darkness and freezing wet conditions
It is a h&s issue which has not been addressed at all
Has the CWU done a study into later and longer workloads
Where’s the results of their studies
Has the h&s executive been asked about guidance
I don’t think so of it would out there

[LouBarlow]

you will still be delivering in the dark, apparently being attacked non-stop by dogs and muggers

Don't moan then when it happens, and you run out of sick pay. You obviously never delivered late at night in pitch dark.

When I started we were out delivering in the dark. In the morning. Funnily enough I managed to avoid serious injury from both dogs and muggers during these years.

I can understand people being annoyed at changes to finish times, for legitimate reasons, such as childcare, but offering up ridiculous health and safety scenarios isn’t helpful.

It’s not ridiculous
When you started early you were out delivering before people were up
It got lighter as the day moved on.
We’re now going backwards
People will be tired and exhausted in darkness and freezing wet conditions
It is a h&s issue which has not been addressed at all
Has the CWU done a study into later and longer workloads
Where’s the results of their studies
Has the h&s executive been asked about guidance
I don’t think so of it would out there

I’m not sure what you are getting at now? Your working day will still be the same in terms of duration. Only in the busier days you will be doing more indoor work not outdoor so how does exhaustion and being cold factor into it? Seasonal variation doesn’t mean more walking. Changing your start time doesn’t mean more walking.

People legitimately have a grievance with later starts for lifestyle reasons i.e. childcare etc but being out in the dark isn’t comparable.

[seaside]

I also think a 40 minute break, split into two 20 minutes break is not much if you are working over 8 hours in a day, where can you go for something hot to eat, in 20 minutes. Some of our office posties want the 20 minutes break at the end of the duty.

[Timetomoveon]

Probably should add that you will be doing all of those if you vote no too.

Can at least say we didnt vote in or agree with the sell-out.

That matters more to some people, you know.

100%

[timbo1234]

Timbo,
John is correct. If this is a simplistic view thats because it is a simple ballot. "Do you accept the proposed agreement or not?"

We are not being balloted to sort out the future of the company. Period. Your opinion on how best to perform your daily duties is neither requested or required. So what leads you to believe anyone is listening to your thoughts of what will happen with RM in the future.

Whilst we're at it, let's just clear this up shall we. This is not yet an agreement. It is, at this stage, a proposal. Nothing has been agreed. It has been recommended by our representatives but it has not been agreed. So there's that.

If anyone wants me to get involved in ideas of how best to turn around the fortunes of this company going forward....well that's going to involve a massive pay increase and a completely different set of t&c's for me, or you or whoever takes that job. That's t&c's that will be unaffected by this proposal by the way!

Our ballot is for the proposal that's been presented. Unless of course you have been given the go ahead to be the new CEO, CFO, COO of RM or GS of CWU? If not, then you, me and everyone else is voting on the proposal that has been put in front of us. End of.

I know what a yes vote brings. A no vote does what then? You have no idea forward apart from RM and CWU will have to work it out somehow, somewhere, sometime between some people. I don't vote for an outcome and a future I have no control over. End of. Don't want any of the jobs by the way - but at least I get a say in the CWU ones.

[Slim2none]

Timbo,
John is correct. If this is a simplistic view thats because it is a simple ballot. "Do you accept the proposed agreement or not?"

We are not being balloted to sort out the future of the company. Period. Your opinion on how best to perform your daily duties is neither requested or required. So what leads you to believe anyone is listening to your thoughts of what will happen with RM in the future.

Whilst we're at it, let's just clear this up shall we. This is not yet an agreement. It is, at this stage, a proposal. Nothing has been agreed. It has been recommended by our representatives but it has not been agreed. So there's that.

If anyone wants me to get involved in ideas of how best to turn around the fortunes of this company going forward....well that's going to involve a massive pay increase and a completely different set of t&c's for me, or you or whoever takes that job. That's t&c's that will be unaffected by this proposal by the way!

Our ballot is for the proposal that's been presented. Unless of course you have been given the go ahead to be the new CEO, CFO, COO of RM or GS of CWU? If not, then you, me and everyone else is voting on the proposal that has been put in front of us. End of.

I know what a yes vote brings. A no vote does what then? You have no idea forward apart from RM and CWU will have to work it out somehow, somewhere, sometime between some people. I don't vote for an outcome and a future I have no control over. End of. Don't want any of the jobs by the way - but at least I get a say in the CWU ones.

It is not in my remit as a postal worker to put any ideas forward to resolve this. If you have voted in any election at anytime, then I'm afraid you have voted for an outcome and future you have no control over. You , like the rest of us are powerless once the result is returned. I'm not saying you did, but if you had voted for the conservatives I'm sure you had no control of the current state of affairs of the party and country. Unless of course, you have the power to control those outcomes, which obviously you don't.

So yeah, crack on and explain all the control you feel you have currently and how you can see into the future to predict how RM will honour the "agreement" and feel free to demonstrate how the current CWU leadership will stop RM steam rolling over anything and everything as they see fit. Crack on and use that crystal ball of yours to tell us in all absolute certainty what that yes vote brings in the future. Don't come at me with the basics either...make a stand and tell me exactly how you see a yes vote playing out 18 months from now. I promise I'll read it through. Just please don't come back at me with the same old "what's your plan B" nonsense.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. We all have a vote to use as we choose. How you choose to vote is your choice & I have no issue with that in any way. End of.