Going sick on strike days

[Woody Guthrie]

The official RM position


2.6 Sick absence and Other time off (Special Leave)
2.6.1. Sick absence that begins prior to industrial action

Normal procedures apply. For those employees already on self-certificated or medical certificated sick absence, it should be regarded as continuing absence. E.g. if the self-certified period runs out then request a medical certificate (fit note). If the employee does not provide a certificate, then the absence will be considered as industrial action.
If the employee subsequently provides a medical certificate to cover the absence, the sick absence should be regarded as continuing until the final certificate expires.
If an employee is already on certificated sick absence on the first day of industrial action such absence should be regarded as continuing until the final medical certificate expires.
Please note references to sick absence also apply to Other time off (special leave).

2.6.2. Sick absence that is advised on the day (or the first day) of industrial action

Whether absence will be regarded as sickness absence will depend on the exact timing of the notification by the employee.
When notification is received before the day of the industrial action in the office, employees will be treated as being absent from work due to sickness absence.

When notification is received on the day of the industrial action the employee will be regarded as taking part in the industrial action and be reported as such. Managers have discretion in exceptional circumstances (e.g. hospitalisation or sudden incapacity).

If an employee off sick attends a picket, they are regarded as joining the action and pay should be stopped for the duration of the industrial action. This would apply even if they had a medical certificate covering the absence. This should be recorded in the Industrial Action Log.

Royal Mail sick pay will only be paid where there is appropriate certification and the employee’s absence is necessary and due to genuine illness.

If managers become aware of employees stating that they intend taking sick absence instead of taking industrial action, the manager should seek guidance and support from the People Case Advice Team. Managers will be required to hold an informal discussion with the relevant employees.

Following industrial action if managers have previously held informal discussion or now have reason to believe that sick absence is not genuine or necessary then they should meet with the employee and make a decision regarding payment of Royal Mail sick pay. Managers should again seek guidance and support from the People Case Advice Team.

[DaveF14]

One of the four strike days is my day off anyway so if i was "sick" on one of the other ones I'd only lose two days money in all. Course, this wouldn't work if you're already on an absence sticky wicket.

And you wonder why one of the things they want to change is the sick pay. It's people like you that ruins it for genuine people.

Very very true. This is an issue I have with the union. They support people on the sick way too much. Sickness patterns, Saturdays off. Puts strain and stress on colleagues, having to cover and switch duties constantly. Some people take the piss. Its obvious and one thing Royal mail should tighten up on.

[LaggyBand]

One of the four strike days is my day off anyway so if i was "sick" on one of the other ones I'd only lose two days money in all. Course, this wouldn't work if you're already on an absence sticky wicket.

And you wonder why one of the things they want to change is the sick pay. It's people like you that ruins it for genuine people.

Very very true. This is an issue I have with the union. They support people on the sick way too much. Sickness patterns, Saturdays off. Puts strain and stress on colleagues, having to cover and switch duties constantly. Some people take the piss. Its obvious and one thing Royal mail should tighten up on.

It’s impossible to start questioning genuineness of sick absent of some specific evidence supporting that without things getting very messy, much safer to assume it’s all genuine perhaps coupled with some positive reward for going long periods with no sick.

Obviously given the current situation this is likely not the first idea Dave or Terry will put forward at the table..

[aiden01]

One of the four strike days is my day off anyway so if i was "sick" on one of the other ones I'd only lose two days money in all. Course, this wouldn't work if you're already on an absence sticky wicket.

And you wonder why one of the things they want to change is the sick pay. It's people like you that ruins it for genuine people.

Very very true. This is an issue I have with the union. They support people on the sick way too much. Sickness patterns, Saturdays off. Puts strain and stress on colleagues, having to cover and switch duties constantly. Some people take the piss. Its obvious and one thing Royal mail should tighten up on.

What do you want union to do penalise us all with a new agreement on rm' s terms. why are you straining an stressing ffs.

[k979aaa]

One of the four strike days is my day off anyway so if i was "sick" on one of the other ones I'd only lose two days money in all. Course, this wouldn't work if you're already on an absence sticky wicket.

And you wonder why one of the things they want to change is the sick pay. It's people like you that ruins it for genuine people.

Very very true. This is an issue I have with the union. They support people on the sick way too much. Sickness patterns, Saturdays off. Puts strain and stress on colleagues, having to cover and switch duties constantly. Some people take the piss. Its obvious and one thing Royal mail should tighten up on.

Even RM presume absence is genuine that is why they have a procedure conduct code just because you are blessed with good health why assume others are as fortunate I know someone who has been bitten 15 times in 20 years by dogs. By the way your union subs are for representation which is the same as going to court with a solicitor are you suggesting we have kangaroo courts without representation?

[POSTMAN]

The official RM position


2.6 Sick absence and Other time off (Special Leave)
2.6.1. Sick absence that begins prior to industrial action

Normal procedures apply. For those employees already on self-certificated or medical certificated sick absence, it should be regarded as continuing absence. E.g. if the self-certified period runs out then request a medical certificate (fit note). If the employee does not provide a certificate, then the absence will be considered as industrial action.
If the employee subsequently provides a medical certificate to cover the absence, the sick absence should be regarded as continuing until the final certificate expires.
If an employee is already on certificated sick absence on the first day of industrial action such absence should be regarded as continuing until the final medical certificate expires.
Please note references to sick absence also apply to Other time off (special leave).

2.6.2. Sick absence that is advised on the day (or the first day) of industrial action

Whether absence will be regarded as sickness absence will depend on the exact timing of the notification by the employee.
When notification is received before the day of the industrial action in the office, employees will be treated as being absent from work due to sickness absence.

When notification is received on the day of the industrial action the employee will be regarded as taking part in the industrial action and be reported as such. Managers have discretion in exceptional circumstances (e.g. hospitalisation or sudden incapacity).

If an employee off sick attends a picket, they are regarded as joining the action and pay should be stopped for the duration of the industrial action. This would apply even if they had a medical certificate covering the absence. This should be recorded in the Industrial Action Log.

Royal Mail sick pay will only be paid where there is appropriate certification and the employee’s absence is necessary and due to genuine illness.

If managers become aware of employees stating that they intend taking sick absence instead of taking industrial action, the manager should seek guidance and support from the People Case Advice Team. Managers will be required to hold an informal discussion with the relevant employees.

Following industrial action if managers have previously held informal discussion or now have reason to believe that sick absence is not genuine or necessary then they should meet with the employee and make a decision regarding payment of Royal Mail sick pay. Managers should again seek guidance and support from the People Case Advice Team.

Woody where is this from and can you send me the doc it's in.
The thing is their WTLL which I put in the' RMC : Strike-Picketing Q&A's' thread I'm sure it's different.
But I can't check as the links to the

[POSTMAN]

The official RM position


2.6 Sick absence and Other time off (Special Leave)
2.6.1. Sick absence that begins prior to industrial action

Normal procedures apply. For those employees already on self-certificated or medical certificated sick absence, it should be regarded as continuing absence. E.g. if the self-certified period runs out then request a medical certificate (fit note). If the employee does not provide a certificate, then the absence will be considered as industrial action.
If the employee subsequently provides a medical certificate to cover the absence, the sick absence should be regarded as continuing until the final certificate expires.
If an employee is already on certificated sick absence on the first day of industrial action such absence should be regarded as continuing until the final medical certificate expires.
Please note references to sick absence also apply to Other time off (special leave).

2.6.2. Sick absence that is advised on the day (or the first day) of industrial action

Whether absence will be regarded as sickness absence will depend on the exact timing of the notification by the employee.
When notification is received before the day of the industrial action in the office, employees will be treated as being absent from work due to sickness absence.

When notification is received on the day of the industrial action the employee will be regarded as taking part in the industrial action and be reported as such. Managers have discretion in exceptional circumstances (e.g. hospitalisation or sudden incapacity).

If an employee off sick attends a picket, they are regarded as joining the action and pay should be stopped for the duration of the industrial action. This would apply even if they had a medical certificate covering the absence. This should be recorded in the Industrial Action Log.

Royal Mail sick pay will only be paid where there is appropriate certification and the employee’s absence is necessary and due to genuine illness.

If managers become aware of employees stating that they intend taking sick absence instead of taking industrial action, the manager should seek guidance and support from the People Case Advice Team. Managers will be required to hold an informal discussion with the relevant employees.

Following industrial action if managers have previously held informal discussion or now have reason to believe that sick absence is not genuine or necessary then they should meet with the employee and make a decision regarding payment of Royal Mail sick pay. Managers should again seek guidance and support from the People Case Advice Team.

Woody where is this from and can you send me the doc it's in.
The thing is their WTLL which I put in the 'RMC : Strike-Picketing Q&A's' thread I'm sure it's different.
Especially 2.6.2 which said no pay.
But I can't check as the links to the WTLL pages is broken.

[eastie]

I went into my office today ( Wed) after seeing a specialist with a letter stating I will be off sick for 2 weeks and the COM said that as my sick starts from tomorrow being my 1st day sick I will not be intitled to pay on Thursday or Friday.
Should I be paid for these two days or not ?.
I am not trying to swing it as the appointment today was given to me 4 weeks ago

[Tman]

He's talking bollix and yes you should be paid.

[aiden01]

I went into my office today ( Wed) after seeing a specialist with a letter stating I will be off sick for 2 weeks and the COM said that as my sick starts from tomorrow being my 1st day sick I will not be intitled to pay on Thursday or Friday.
Should I be paid for these two days or not ?.
I am not trying to swing it as the appointment today was given to me 4 weeks ago

Sue the c--t if unpaid fs.

[Woody Guthrie]

Woody where is this from and can you send me the doc it's in.
The thing is their WTLL which I put in the 'RMC : Strike-Picketing Q&A's' thread I'm sure it's different.
Especially 2.6.2 which said no pay.
But I can't check as the links to the WTLL pages is broken.

Managing IA People Guidelines - 15.08.22_[51490].docx

[POSTMAN]

Woody where is this from and can you send me the doc it's in.
The thing is their WTLL which I put in the 'RMC : Strike-Picketing Q&A's' thread I'm sure it's different.
Especially 2.6.2 which said no pay.
But I can't check as the links to the WTLL pages is broken.

Managing IA People Guidelines - 15.08.22_[51490].docx

Fecks sake, already had that and posted it, made it into a sticky now.
Cheers

[Bird]

My office has just announced that anyone going sick on strike days - genuine or not - will need to provide a sick note on the first day. Basically saying you’re not allowed to self-sick. If you don’t provide one you will lose your pay. Very harsh if genuine sick, how do you get a doctors appointment (miraculous) and then a sick note and then get it in to work all on the same day if you can’t get out of bed?

Is this happening elsewhere? And does anyone know if it’s actually legal?

[parforthewalk]

My office has just announced that anyone going sick on strike days - genuine or not - will need to provide a sick note on the first day. Basically saying you’re not allowed to self-sick. If you don’t provide one you will lose your pay. Very harsh if genuine sick, how do you get a doctors appointment (miraculous) and then a sick note and then get it in to work all on the same day if you can’t get out of bed?

Is this happening elsewhere? And does anyone know if it’s actually legal?

He talking bollocks, direct him to the you gov webpage re' sickness/sick pay & tell him to read it out loud on the shop floor

[Bird]

Yeah I assumed it was just a Scare tactic but I didn’t know if it’s a national one or just my place being assholes