who is very concerned about our future?

[Chelseablue]

We seem to be helpless as these badly done revisions go through , another £4 plus wasted on union fees. Surely its all gonna come to a head and implode !

[Marshamp11]

I am going to go off topic but how on earth people can cope earning 17-18k? I mean is this a figure after tax? Do you guys live somewhere up north in a pretty remote location or a small town, where rent for a 1bed flat is like £400?

yes, ( but its a 3 bed house for £400 not a flat)

Wow I cannot believe that it is still possible to rent a 3bed house for £400. Postman wage must be going a long way there.

Obviously prices have risen since I moved in, but within a 10 mile radius theirs these kind of things around me.

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/ ... el=RES_LET

That would be around £1400 a month in my neck of the woods.

[denhamhoop]

I am going to go off topic but how on earth people can cope earning 17-18k? I mean is this a figure after tax? Do you guys live somewhere up north in a pretty remote location or a small town, where rent for a 1bed flat is like £400?

yes, ( but its a 3 bed house for £400 not a flat)

Wow I cannot believe that it is still possible to rent a 3bed house for £400. Postman wage must be going a long way there.

Obviously prices have risen since I moved in, but within a 10 mile radius theirs these kind of things around me.

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/ ... el=RES_LET

That would be around £1400 a month in my neck of the woods.

Lucky you this is what's available in my area https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/ ... el=RES_LET

[greengiant]

Wow, I thought our depot was a mess.

We panic if one parcel is left over, we havent failed a job yet all through the last 2 years.

How many letters are left in frames for days on end or forgotten about in trays below the frame? Just a few years ago you'd be quizzed by management if you so much as left one tiny little letter accidentally in the back of a frame slot, nowadays folk just take bundles of mail for a walk, bring them back untouched, and launch complete bundles of D2Ds still with the walk label attached in to the yorks of "excess" D2D.

[Smir]

I am going to go off topic but how on earth people can cope earning 17-18k? I mean is this a figure after tax? Do you guys live somewhere up north in a pretty remote location or a small town, where rent for a 1bed flat is like £400?

yes, ( but its a 3 bed house for £400 not a flat)

Wow I cannot believe that it is still possible to rent a 3bed house for £400. Postman wage must be going a long way there.

Obviously prices have risen since I moved in, but within a 10 mile radius theirs these kind of things around me.

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/ ... el=RES_LET

unreal, £400 here might get you spare room in someones house..

[Norfolk 'N' Chance]

read numerous posts here and on workplace and it appears to me things look very bleak for the immediate future
doms + their support seem to be against senior management
we are at our usual stance against both
cwu hq input into the real life at an all time low
all the extremely hard work by us over the last 18 months has now gone and it's now back to screw you, you won't have a steady day
senior management fighting amongst themselves because they cannot do the revisions in time and will end up bodging them up asap causing more trouble just to appease the shareholders

those are just a few bullet points and sure many more could be added to the current fiasco

i can see a very grim winter approaching and without a very early response from the cwu to react to problems that will no doubt occur in numerous sites across the uk very soon straight away and to actually be on our side it will lead to chaos and tears
we desperately need our union leaders to stop eating prawn sandwiches and drinking latte's with the ceo and his cronies, we need you on the floor with us dealing with our current issues which quite a few don't even involve revisions yet by the look of it

Maybe someone has decided thats not as stupid an option as it sounds? If your at rock bottom then there is only one way to go! - Having dipped in and out of various threads on this forum, it leaves me wondering what advise or assistance the directors and top level management have engaged with. There are many experts external to the organisation and lots of information within the public domain. Much of what seems to be happening right now in RM, happened in BT, Utilities and Railtrack all as a result of privatisation. Clearly RM is a huge beast and a one size fits all approach will never work across the country, as local cultures and environments differ too widely to have inflexible procedures and systems.

If you look at what happened when the bulk distribution of gas was split away from British Gas, for a few years we had TRANSCO. (It didnt really work) so that was spilt up into regions and sold off; there now being national grid gas, southern gas networks, northern gas networks and scottish gas networks to name a few. The outcome being is that as smaller entities they are more efficient then they were as one company, and have more freedoms to manage to suit geographical/local needs. A lot of this is driven by the regulator OFGEM. - Im not suggesting that this is the right or wrong approach, but similar things have happened in Railtrack with the franchises and also in water and electricity sectors. Personally I can foresee the regulator changing the goalposts especially if the USO is watered down or removed.

If the final mile parts of the business were grouped into geographical regions and sold off or set up as wholly owned but independent, even dare i say it franchised companies. In the eyes of the regulator they should be easier to manage and improve. The regulator then would be having a league table and managers/directors in areas would be far more accountable for their actions/inactions. The regulator will have no qualms about publishing the league tables and it will ultimately change the culture and drive performance . There is of course one issue and thats worker involvement !

Regarding worker involvement, I dont know if any of you remember a series on the BBC some years ago with Sir Digby Jones (then of the CBI), more recently Lord Digby Jones. I think it was called "Back to the shop floor" and he would go into failing companies, sometimes under cover at the front line to truly understand what the problems were. He very much advocacted that the people in the front line are often best placed in solving the problems within a business.

In his book "Fixing Business" he concludes that many times he would find the same problems over and over again, repeated in different sectors and across diverse types of businesses. He states "Business clearly has problems and attitudes that need fixing for the good of the business. One of the many problems (that actually gives rise to many others) is that some businesses fail to realise that people do not like to feel controlled, manipulated, abused or simply disregarded, even if it is only their perception. In other words business leaders need to get far better at doing their job; showing leadership and connecting with people and being accepted in the communities in which they operate. - sounds like a fair cop to me....

I have no idea if RM has a representative that liaises with the CBI (Confederation of British Industry), maybe it even has a member that sits on some of its panels/meetings? who knows. But it would nice to think that someone at a corporate level is aware of Digby's findings and how RM can learn from others. - As an outsider I know very little about the pathway to change, but what i do know is if you dont have a solid bed for laying your pathway paviers, it wont belong before you have no pathway left at all!





+

[ssdd]

Great, insightful post Norfolk. I don't have the knowledge to debate the whys or wherefores of splitting up the company in the manner you suggest, but instinctively I'm averse to it. What I will say is there are parties that would rather see Royal Mail come back into public ownership. Same with utilities.

I'm curious, with your experience and insight why you wouldn't want to pursue a management role over a Postie role? Or would it act as a foot in the door so to speak? Don't feel as though you have to answer that question by the way.

Oh, and welcome to the forum. It's good to have someone with your knowledge taking part in the chat and bringing another perspective...

[Dorset Plodder]

If the final mile parts of the business were grouped into geographical regions and sold off or set up as wholly owned but independent, even dare i say it franchised companies. In the eyes of the regulator they should be easier to manage and improve. The regulator then would be having a league table and managers/directors in areas would be far more accountable for their actions/inactions. The regulator will have no qualms about publishing the league tables and it will ultimately change the culture and drive performance . There is of course one issue and thats worker involvement

I find your posts interesting Norfolk.

I'd quite happily work for this type of Business Model. For anyone that feels like they still have pride working for Royal Mail, I'd suggest that that probably went out the window when Vince Cable and his cronies sold us off to their mates in the City. We're now a PRIVATE Company.

If Joe Bloggs Mail Ltd could offer me the same T & Cs, and pay, I'd work for him. Most Delivery Offices seem to feel like they're out their on their own anyway. The mail comes in the door first thing and they're left to get on and deliver it. Several colleagues already act like they're Self-Employed Drivers. Do what they feel like doing ... everything's "Their Duty".... Their Time is always more important than everyone else's ..... and they basically just please themselves. Never willing to help a colleague but moan if the IPS isn't being done because they can't get out early. Most of the rest of us wonder if we're actually working for the same firm already?

IMHO the main problem in our area is the lack of staff. If you want a business to work as it's designed then surely you should have the right ammount of staff to do that job. Look at the situation with HGV Drivers and Fruit Pickers. If RM was in charge of those industries it's stock solution would be, "Ask them if they want to do some more Overtime"! (And Overtime is a misnomer because it's just extra more work for basically the same pay).

[Dorset Plodder]

There are 20+ duties in our DO. In the last 3 or 4 months, there have been, on average, perhaps 7 staff in each day to cover said duties. Last week there were 4 people in. Often there is only 1 person on IP sorting for the entire office, packets and letters. Most of the duties in the office are routinely "stood down".

Your Office sounds well f****d! I sympathise with your problems. All you can do is try and concentrate on your own duty and try not to get stressed by the Big Picture, or it'll drive you crazy.

[HTPostman]

I try not to look too far in the future when it comes to this company, which is odd for me as I plan a lot of my future out. I think there will be work here for everyone for a good amount of years it will just become harder.

The Christmas period is going to be very interesting. Revisions (forced) through, longer rounds, Specials back to normal times. Plus looks like a lot of industries are hiring smaller vans so we’ll struggle to hire extra vans, if RM even wanted to that is. Also another lockdown/not working 2 AND not having access to more vans, at the busiest time of the year with longer rounds will be an absolute mess.

[ssdd]

I try not to look too far in the future when it comes to this company, which is odd for me as I plan a lot of my future out. I think there will be work here for everyone for a good amount of years it will just become harder.

The Christmas period is going to be very interesting. Revisions (forced) through, longer rounds, Specials back to normal times. Plus looks like a lot of industries are hiring smaller vans so we’ll struggle to hire extra vans, if RM even wanted to that is. Also another lockdown/not working 2 AND not having access to more vans, at the busiest time of the year with longer rounds will be an absolute mess.

I'm guessing we may get the agency staff back in. I remember they were using fleet vans after duty holders were complete, delivering from about 3pm onwards. They even had 1 or 2 coming in early to deliver mail, even though they weren't supposed to be touching mail...

[HTPostman]

I try not to look too far in the future when it comes to this company, which is odd for me as I plan a lot of my future out. I think there will be work here for everyone for a good amount of years it will just become harder.

The Christmas period is going to be very interesting. Revisions (forced) through, longer rounds, Specials back to normal times. Plus looks like a lot of industries are hiring smaller vans so we’ll struggle to hire extra vans, if RM even wanted to that is. Also another lockdown/not working 2 AND not having access to more vans, at the busiest time of the year with longer rounds will be an absolute mess.

I'm guessing we may get the agency staff back in. I remember they were using fleet vans after duty holders were complete, delivering from about 3pm onwards. They even had 1 or 2 coming in early to deliver mail, even though they weren't supposed to be touching mail...

Good point, I’d forgotten about them. I remember last year feeling sorry for them, loading up a van as dusk set in, I know nobody forces them to do the job but some of the rounds here are complicated enough in daylight working with another colleague, let alone trying to navigate them on your own in the dark. On the plus side there’s no really rough estates in this area.

[WalkerX]

I started in November as "Agency" doing parcel delivery. I was sent out on my own (no van sharing remember) no training. When offices were being decimated by covid and self-isolating , I was routinely sent to different towns in far extremes of the county, delivering in areas I did n`t know, in the dark, sometimes in some notoriously rough areas. Sometimes the DO was closed when I got back. It was madness looking back on it. Nevertheless, I`m a reserve postie now, luckily my colleagues that I van share with have all been friendly and supportive and I`m getting the training "on the job", training that I should have got in the first place. I joined at the wrong time, I guess, but having been made redundant, I did n`t have a lot of choice. Having been a reserve for 5 months, I can see that I probably would n`t have had any time with a "workplace coach", van share or not, as he`s having to do deliveries due to staff shortages. I`m not looking forward to this winter.

[ssdd]

I started in November as "Agency" doing parcel delivery. I was sent out on my own (no van sharing remember) no training. When offices were being decimated by covid and self-isolating , I was routinely sent to different towns in far extremes of the county, delivering in areas I did n`t know, in the dark, sometimes in some notoriously rough areas. Sometimes the DO was closed when I got back. It was madness looking back on it. Nevertheless, I`m a reserve postie now, luckily my colleagues that I van share with have all been friendly and supportive and I`m getting the training "on the job", training that I should have got in the first place. I joined at the wrong time, I guess, but having been made redundant, I did n`t have a lot of choice. Having been a reserve for 5 months, I can see that I probably would n`t have had any time with a "workplace coach", van share or not, as he`s having to do deliveries due to staff shortages. I`m not looking forward to this winter.

Maybe you joined at the right time...as in it may be better than when you were on agency...

[WalkerX]

I started in November as "Agency" doing parcel delivery. I was sent out on my own (no van sharing remember) no training. When offices were being decimated by covid and self-isolating , I was routinely sent to different towns in far extremes of the county, delivering in areas I did n`t know, in the dark, sometimes in some notoriously rough areas. Sometimes the DO was closed when I got back. It was madness looking back on it. Nevertheless, I`m a reserve postie now, luckily my colleagues that I van share with have all been friendly and supportive and I`m getting the training "on the job", training that I should have got in the first place. I joined at the wrong time, I guess, but having been made redundant, I did n`t have a lot of choice. Having been a reserve for 5 months, I can see that I probably would n`t have had any time with a "workplace coach", van share or not, as he`s having to do deliveries due to staff shortages. I`m not looking forward to this winter.

Good point, I`m more experienced now, but I think with staff shortages and impossible work loads, winter will be hell.

Maybe you joined at the right time...as in it may be better than when you were on agency...