LTB 248/21 - National Joint Statement - Resourcing & Recruitment Including the Reintroduction of Postal Apprentices

[POSTMAN]

So some of the training costs will be paid by the government; how does that make it a scam?

Are you realy not aware of apprentice scams?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-50973579

How can someone in KFC or a barista, that is someone who makes and serves coffee and sandwiches ect be an apprentice in that line of work.

[fezza34]

Review of part-time Employees’ hours
Both parties commit to using the current revision activity to review part-time hours and
(where the workload supports it and the duty pattern can be accommodated) to look at
increasing part-time hours to align to the duty set. Royal Mail Group commit to
empowering local managers to review part-timers who regularly work above their part-
time hours jointly with local representatives as part of the 6 monthly reviews of the hours
performed by part-timers and annual revisions/realignment activity.
To further support this reinvigorated approach and to ensure our solutions remain in
place, a six monthly joint national strategic framework will be put in place where the
national parties come together and review data and issues from the unit reviews.

There's the get-out clause...

Funnily enough,our DOM has stated that no full time positions will be entertained even though we have numerous f/t folk departing, numerous p/t staff doing 55+ hours a week, absolute joke.Numerous union reps have even looked into this, basically the agreements arent worth the paper there written on, dont believe we should be looking at this as a victory when clearly its not!

[POSTMAN]

Review of part-time Employees’ hours
Both parties commit to using the current revision activity to review part-time hours and
(where the workload supports it and the duty pattern can be accommodated) to look at
increasing part-time hours to align to the duty set. Royal Mail Group commit to
empowering local managers to review part-timers who regularly work above their part-
time hours jointly with local representatives as part of the 6 monthly reviews of the hours
performed by part-timers and annual revisions/realignment activity.
To further support this reinvigorated approach and to ensure our solutions remain in
place, a six monthly joint national strategic framework will be put in place where the
national parties come together and review data and issues from the unit reviews.

There's the get-out clause...

Funnily enough,our DOM has stated that no full time positions will be entertained even though we have numerous f/t folk departing, numerous p/t staff doing 55+ hours a week, absolute joke.Numerous union reps have even looked into this, basically the agreements arent worth the paper there written on, dont believe we should be looking at this as a victory when clearly its not!

2nd one now and no doubt there are others, can someone elighten me where is it that the screws can demand or say that there will be no extra full time jobs in revisions, where is this s**t coming from and what are the reps/cwu doing about it?

[Tman]

=POSTMAN post_id=943329 time=1624030543 user_id=2]
Are you realy not aware of apprentice scams?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-50973579

Where there's money to be made there will be some who'll try and scam it, but it's not "all" apprentice scams by any means.

How can someone in KFC or a barista, that is someone who makes and serves coffee and sandwiches ect be an apprentice in that line of work.

The story was about RM and future "apprentices" being employed by it. I rather doubt RM is trying to scam funds from the government scheme.

[Woody Guthrie]

An apprenticeship should be a gateway to a trade or profession, a two to three year learning process including some kind of qualification.

In the past these were limited to engineering, manufacturing and construction trades, now you can be an apprentice burger flipper and the whole system has been undermined to the point where even though we're well aware there are still good apprentice schemes out there the entire thing is seen as a scam.

That shouldn't need explaining, nor the fact that an apprenticeship in putting letters through doors is laughable.

[Tman]

Going back years no-one needed a cadetship to put letters through doors either, but RM (to their credit) still ran the scheme.
Then, as now, if it gets young people into working for RM then it's no bad thing, though references to burger flippers etc aren't relevant to what RM are proposing.
Some kids won't/can't/aren't savvy enough do a modern apprenticeship in engineering etc but that doesn't mean that the RM scheme is somehow worthless or some sort of scam.

[Woody Guthrie]

The cadet system was primarily to protect 16-18 year old kids from being exploited by management, it was more or less a legal requirement because these kids could not legally work under the same conditions as an adult.

We don't employ 16-18 year old kids anymore because the vast majority of them stay in some form of education until 18.

[Sugar]

All apprentices are scams, this will be no different.

If they bring in the new apprenticeships at the government hourly rate of pay it'll save RM an absolute fortune in wages. I nearly fell through the floor when my oldest told me what they were getting paid on their apprenticeship. I was on nearly that much 30 years ago when I started out as an apprentice.

As you say just another government cheap labour scam.

[Smir]

should be illegal, royal mail is not a "career" sort of job any more... less and less hours given out, more and more temporary contracts, no one can actually get a mortgage or anything, I doubt they'd even let you rent.. unless one of the people had a permanent job.

Unsure what a Level 2 Postal Apprenticeship is actually worth?

[POSTMAN]

The scheme is aimed at, although not exclusive to, the school leaver population and I can confirm the starting salary is £6.82 an hour on a 35 hour contract.
Therefore for a 16 year old that would be approx.. £238 per week, this will increase with the age of applicants.

NATIONAL PAY RATE

MAX : £453.50
ADULT RECRUIT AGE 18 : £408.15
AGE 17 : £317.45
AGE 16 : £272.10

OUTER LONDON NORMAL PAY RATE

MAX £537.87
ADULT RECRUIT AGE 18 : £484.08
AGE 17 : £376.51
AGE 16 : £322.72

INNER LONDON NORMAL PAY RATE

MAX £568.87
ADULT RECRUIT AGE 18 : £511.98
AGE 17 : £398.21
AGE 16 : £341

Add on deliver supplement Pro rata to conditioned hours : £26.35

Pay Rate Guide - CWU Represented ex-Letters Grades in Royal Mail Operations :2021

[rockytony67]

When I started as a cadet in 85 at 17, I took home £51 for a 43 hrs six-day week all in cash, by the time I gave my Mum housekeeping there wasn't a lot left, but it seemed a lot to me: