Clocking in and out entry system

[norris9]

But don't PDA's clock when you come back to the depot? I am sure I was told they do. So they are already capturing when we come back through PDA data.

So I am still none the wiser as to why they are going to spend probably millions fitting these gates.

- PDA's keep track of when we get back to the depot.

- The gates won't be linked to pay.

- Spending millions to save some paper.... I doubt it.


So what is the purpose?


The only thing I can think of is that a lot of people forget to sign in or out and these gates should 100% accurately keep an up-to-date system of who is in or outside of the depot building, but still, spending millions for that reason being worthwhile? not so sure.

[deltaforce]

You won’t need gates....just a scanning device using your id cards

[yubin282]

Scan In/Out data will not be used for the automatic reduction of contractual pay or
allowances based on data captured, or to reduce overtime pay where a (verbal)
contract has been agreed with the manager prior to commencement.
[/quote

So this says that the CWU approve of ghost overtime?

[Dexydog]

Let's not kid ourselves.
No matter what assurances/promises/lies (delete as appropriate) form part of this agreement, they will all be up for renegotiation next time around.
Personally I reckon it will bite them on the arse because if it is,
1. they have not the slightest clue how much time people give for free.
2. people will stop giving that time for free.
3. rush round? forget it.
I know this has been said before, but if this comes in the way it sounds where has our incentive gone?
Glad I'm out before they get it through, you think bullying is rife now, just wait.

[yubin282]

It should be used for payroll why not?

I wish it would be used for payroll. With management bullies still in place old timers with easy walks get to clock off early and get paid for not working, whilst newbies are bullied into working unpaid overtime. Current system in our DO works for the old timers and shafts the newbies.

Roll on a new system. Gotta be fairer than the current one.

A lot of the 'favourites' will be screwed.

Although im sure they'll find a way round it.

[yubin282]

Let's not kid ourselves.
No matter what assurances/promises/lies (delete as appropriate) form part of this agreement, they will all be up for renegotiation next time around.
Personally I reckon it will bite them on the arse because if it is,
1. they have not the slightest clue how much time people give for free.
2. people will stop giving that time for free.
3. rush round? forget it.
I know this has been said before, but if this comes in the way it sounds where has our incentive gone?
Glad I'm out before they get it through, you think bullying is rife now, just wait.

I'm not so sure about point 2

[Marshamp11]

But don't PDA's clock when you come back to the depot? I am sure I was told they do. So they are already capturing when we come back through PDA data.

So I am still none the wiser as to why they are going to spend probably millions fitting these gates.

- PDA's keep track of when we get back to the depot.

- The gates won't be linked to pay.

- Spending millions to save some paper.... I doubt it.


So what is the purpose?


The only thing I can think of is that a lot of people forget to sign in or out and these gates should 100% accurately keep an up-to-date system of who is in or outside of the depot building, but still, spending millions for that reason being worthwhile? not so sure.

PDA's may keep track of when you have returned to the depot but you may then do indoor work for a while. Scanning out they know you have finished and gone home.

[Dexydog]

Let's not kid ourselves.
No matter what assurances/promises/lies (delete as appropriate) form part of this agreement, they will all be up for renegotiation next time around.
Personally I reckon it will bite them on the arse because if it is,
1. they have not the slightest clue how much time people give for free.
2. people will stop giving that time for free.
3. rush round? forget it.
I know this has been said before, but if this comes in the way it sounds where has our incentive gone?
Glad I'm out before they get it through, you think bullying is rife now, just wait.

I'm not so sure about point 2

Who am I kidding?- point 3 probably also applies because,
1. people are stupid.
2. people are stupid.

[Cucumber]

The same casual/verbal agreements that people enter into into regarding ghost OT, well the same managers will now have the green light to have the same casual agreements to remind people at what time they finished at on that quiet Tuesday and they will be looking for it back.

[Dexydog]

Let's not forget, ghost overtime is the managers friend and as such wouldn't be in their interest to piss people off enough to not bother doing it if it's not worth their while.
In the end you get less for doing overtime after 38 hours so why would you bother to do do half a walk for 3 hours whilst at the same time make it last 3 hours?
I reckon RM know this full well, and so have left a verbal agreement in place so that an office gets cleared.
There has to be an incentive somewhere or things will just grind to a halt.

[endofdays1982]

what are they going use for clocking in and out? surely can't be a pda, some of us can't get one some days, nae pay then lmao

[Bboingg]

From the PDA they already have your delivery start and finish time, excluding preparation and winding up, which can be deduced, so does anybody know what will this add that will be of extra use?

[Zicomurphy]

From the PDA they already have your delivery start and finish time, excluding preparation and winding up, which can be deduced, so does anybody know what will this add that will be of extra use?

Just my theory. It will tell them how many man hours are actually being worked across the whole office. For example, if they are paying for 5000 hours of work a week but the scanning in and out shows only 4700 are being worked, when it comes to the yearly revision they will look to take 300 hours out of the office. Will be very hard for local reps to argue against losing duties when the info is all there in black and white.

[Zicomurphy]

You would have to be very naive or trying to kid the troops if you think Royal Mail will go to all this expense to save some paper.

They're not idiots.

It will certainly provide them with all of the data that they need to increase the size of duties in the annual revisions.

Some idiot smugly clocking out an hour early each day won't have their pay deducted, but from the next revision you can bet that they won't be finishing early any more.

This could well be the problem. If it doesn’t have an immediate impact on individuals you will still get the same people rushing around, not taking a break, cutting every corner they can to get finished early, so any data management end up with won’t be based on people doing the job properly.

[HTPostman]

Scan In/Out data will not be used for the automatic reduction of contractual pay or
allowances based on data captured, or to reduce overtime pay where a (verbal)
contract has been agreed with the manager prior to commencement.

I can’t believe RM have gone to the efforts of having these talks (when they could’ve attempted to bring in the changes without any consultation) and yet put in such a big loophole. It’s just inviting ghost OT. When will we see a stop to it and people being made to work the hours they are paid for.