Masks for indoor work

[Woody Guthrie]

People like Dr Carl Henegan,John Ioannidis,Sunetra Gupta,Dr Karol Sikora Dr Mike Yeadon and Ivor Cummins make far more sense and reasoned arguments ,rather than the hysteria perpetuated by SAGE, Whitty and Vallance and the government.

Okay you have decided to obediently follow the position of a different, far, far smaller minority of scientists, doctors and in the case of Ivor Cummins someone with little relevant qualifications.

Fair enough that's up to you but you have to understand where that puts your position and how seriously we take it.

What exactly is it about this very small minority of experts and others that convinces you that they are right and the huge majority of science (not just Whitty and Vallance) are wrong?

When you choose the minority position the first thing you have to understand in your head is not why you are right but why the majority is wrong. In this case it's a huge worldwide majority so there's a lot of understanding to get through.

[milly]

People like Dr Carl Henegan,John Ioannidis,Sunetra Gupta,Dr Karol Sikora Dr Mike Yeadon and Ivor Cummins make far more sense and reasoned arguments ,rather than the hysteria perpetuated by SAGE, Whitty and Vallance and the government.

Okay you have decided to obediently follow the position of a different, far, far smaller minority of scientists, doctors and in the case of Ivor Cummins someone with little relevant qualifications.

Fair enough that's up to you but you have to understand where that puts your position and how seriously we take it.

What exactly is it about this very small minority of experts and others that convinces you that they are right and the huge majority of science (not just Whitty and Vallance) are wrong?

When you choose the minority position the first thing you have to understand in your head is not why you are right but why the majority is wrong. In this case it's a huge worldwide majority so there's a lot of understanding to get through.
[/quote

If you want to follow the Herd that's up to you.
Perhaps you ought take the time to read Charles Mackay's book Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds.
I don't think that you can take Vallance too seriously what with his £600000 worth of GSK stock.

[nutcracker]

People like Dr Carl Henegan,John Ioannidis,Sunetra Gupta,Dr Karol Sikora Dr Mike Yeadon and Ivor Cummins make far more sense and reasoned arguments ,rather than the hysteria perpetuated by SAGE, Whitty and Vallance and the government.

Okay you have decided to obediently follow the position of a different, far, far smaller minority of scientists, doctors and in the case of Ivor Cummins someone with little relevant qualifications.

Fair enough that's up to you but you have to understand where that puts your position and how seriously we take it.

What exactly is it about this very small minority of experts and others that convinces you that they are right and the huge majority of science (not just Whitty and Vallance) are wrong?

When you choose the minority position the first thing you have to understand in your head is not why you are right but why the majority is wrong. In this case it's a huge worldwide majority so there's a lot of understanding to get through.
[/quote

If you want to follow the Herd that's up to you.
Perhaps you ought take the time to read Charles Mackay's book Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds.
I don't think that you can take Vallance too seriously what with his £600000 worth of GSK stock.

What exactly did Vallance do? Influence an American vaccine to get its trials done first in Brazil, then get all the leading regulatory bodies around the world to approve its vaccine first...

The GSK stock price is at a 5 year low and been falling since January, and Vallance makes about 30k a year in dividends off that holding. Even if he was the pandemic mastermind any shift in those two values would be small change for him.

There’s certainly a conflict of interest with his public position but you would be hard pressed to find a pre-eminent scientist who does not have share holdings in pharmaceuticals, ditto all other industries (nope leave the tin foil in the kitchen draw...)

[Woody Guthrie]

If you want to follow the Herd that's up to you.

That's just dumbass soundbiting.
It's meaningless.
You're following your own herd.
It's just a smaller, weaker herd.

What exactly did Vallance do?

Who gives a toss about Vallance?
I'm not following his advice.
I'm following the advice of the huge majority of scientific evidence based consensus.
You're following the opinion of a minority.

The odds are stacked heavily in my favour, if your position was a racehorse it would have three legs, one lung and a dodgy heart.

The worst part about it is that you're willing to gamble on that horse with other people's lives.

[milly]

If you want to follow the Herd that's up to you.

That's just dumbass soundbiting.
It's meaningless.
You're following your own herd.
It's just a smaller, weaker herd.

What exactly did Vallance do?

Who gives a toss about Vallance?
I'm not following his advice.
I'm following the advice of the huge majority of scientific evidence based consensus.
You're following the opinion of a minority.

The odds are stacked heavily in my favour, if your position was a racehorse it would have three legs, one lung and a dodgy heart.

The worst part about it is that you're willing to gamble on that horse with other people's lives.

Of course you follow Vallance's advice as government policy is formed by his opinion as well as others.
And being in a majority doesn't make you right.

[Schiff]

If you want to follow the Herd that's up to you.

That's just dumbass soundbiting.
It's meaningless.
You're following your own herd.
It's just a smaller, weaker herd.

What exactly did Vallance do?

Who gives a toss about Vallance?
I'm not following his advice.
I'm following the advice of the huge majority of scientific evidence based consensus.
You're following the opinion of a minority.

The odds are stacked heavily in my favour, if your position was a racehorse it would have three legs, one lung and a dodgy heart.

The worst part about it is that you're willing to gamble on that horse with other people's lives.

Of course you follow Vallance's advice as government policy is formed by his opinion as well as others.
And being in a majority doesn't make you right.

Lets imagine for a minute that you and the handful of people you refer to are right, and the rest of the scientific world along with pretty much every government are wrong (because as you say being in the majority doesn't necessarily make you right). If you wear a mask in the workplace for a few months until everyone conssidered vulnerable has been vaccinated, then the absolute worst outcome is that you have needlessly suffered the mildest of discomfort from wearing a mask.

If, on the other hand, you and those you listen to are wrong, with the majority being right, by not wearing a mask you may be killing a number of people and condemning others to living the rest of their lives with lasting organ damage.

We already know that you don't understand basic maths from some of your other posts. How about basic logic or even basic human decency?

[milly]

If you want to follow the Herd that's up to you.

That's just dumbass soundbiting.
It's meaningless.
You're following your own herd.
It's just a smaller, weaker herd.

What exactly did Vallance do?

Who gives a toss about Vallance?
I'm not following his advice.
I'm following the advice of the huge majority of scientific evidence based consensus.
You're following the opinion of a minority.

The odds are stacked heavily in my favour, if your position was a racehorse it would have three legs, one lung and a dodgy heart.

The worst part about it is that you're willing to gamble on that horse with other people's lives.

Of course you follow Vallance's advice as government policy is formed by his opinion as well as others.
And being in a majority doesn't make you right.

Lets imagine for a minute that you and the handful of people you refer to are right, and the rest of the scientific world along with pretty much every government are wrong (because as you say being in the majority doesn't necessarily make you right). If you wear a mask in the workplace for a few months until everyone conssidered vulnerable has been vaccinated, then the absolute worst outcome is that you have needlessly suffered the mildest of discomfort from wearing a mask.

If, on the other hand, you and those you listen to are wrong, with the majority being right, by not wearing a mask you may be killing a number of people and condemning others to living the rest of their lives with lasting organ damage.

We already know that you don't understand basic maths from some of your other posts. How about basic logic or even basic human decency?

From personal experience I have a close relative who discovered they had terminal Cancer after being rushed to hospital.
My relative was too frightened to go to the Doctors due to the hysteria surrounding Covid, if it had been diagnosed earlier the prognosis might have been different.
I have no interest in your virtue signalling and platitudes, many people are frightened of seeking treatment because they listen to doom and gloom merchants like yourself.

[Woody Guthrie]

Of course you follow Vallance's advice as government policy is formed by his opinion as well as others.

Jesus wept.
How can someone completely misunderstand the role of the government's CSA.
He's not sitting in front of a microscope doing his own experiments.
He's not plucking opinions out of thin air depending on his mood.
He's following the worldwide scientific consensus.
So am I.

The saying that the majority isn't always right only applies when the majority is ignorant of the facts.
This is not an ignorant majority situation, this is an extremely highly educated vast majority of scientists and doctors who have in many cases had direct access to the virus, viral research and cases.

[Woody Guthrie]

many people are frightened of seeking treatment because they listen to doom and gloom merchants like yourself.

No they are frightened of seeking treatment because there is a global pandemic.
You're trying to push the responsibility for that fear onto people you don't agree with. That's pathetic.
I think you're frightened yourself, frightened by how easily that life can be turned upside down and the things you like and think important can be taken away.
That's why you cling to this belief that nothing really happened and everyone overreacted.
Denial is a very common reaction to traumatic events.
When I see these anti-mask, anti-vaxxer demos I can almost smell the fear.

Your session on Dr Woody's couch is over.
I'll see you same time next week.

[milly]

many people are frightened of seeking treatment because they listen to doom and gloom merchants like yourself.

No they are frightened of seeking treatment because there is a global pandemic.
You're trying to push the responsibility for that fear onto people you don't agree with. That's pathetic.
I think you're frightened yourself, frightened by how easily that life can be turned upside down and the things you like and think important can be taken away.
That's why you cling to this belief that nothing really happened and everyone overreacted.
Denial is a very common reaction to traumatic events.
When I see these anti-mask, anti-vaxxer demos I can almost smell the fear.

Your session on Dr Woody's couch is over.
I'll see you same time next week.

No scared in the slightest , your comment sounds like psychological projection to me.

[Woody Guthrie]

No scared in the slightest , your comment sounds like psychological projection to me.

I'm happy to admit my fears.
I have no reason to project them.
You by saying you're not scared in the slightest are giving away your true anxiety.
Everyone is at least slightly scared.
You're over your hour and I have another patient waiting....

[milly]

No scared in the slightest , your comment sounds like psychological projection to me.

I'm happy to admit my fears.
I have no reason to project them.
You by saying you're not scared in the slightest are giving away your true anxiety.
Everyone is at least slightly scared.
You're over your hour and I have another patient waiting....

I stopped being scared from April.
But I will admit to being scared of people like you who will believe what they are told by the Government and Media without question.

[Pumpernickel]

People like Dr Carl Henegan,John Ioannidis,Sunetra Gupta,Dr Karol Sikora Dr Mike Yeadon and Ivor Cummins make far more sense and reasoned arguments ,rather than the hysteria perpetuated by SAGE, Whitty and Vallance and the government.

I wouldn't put it that the above make "more reasoned arguments": it's more that they make arguments you personally find more reasonable.

It's important to note that your list includes a Cancer specialist (who likely isn't overly knowledgable about virology or airbourne disease) and a Dietician (seemingly of the "write a book about weight loss" variety). I have no idea why you chose to include either of these in your list (it makes it look like you're grabbing any name you can).

Please note though that our government have been woeful in the measures they've put in place throughout this incident. The measures have not been strong enough IMO, and some of the "advice" should have been mandated. I have no clue as to why you think someone taking their own reasonable precautions as advised by the worldwide scientific community (bar the odd outlier) is "following the herd" or "following government policy" given that government policy has had nothing to do with the scientific advice they recieved, and has been much more about ensuring they don't need to give support to businesses and people that have been affected by this situation. The entire "personal responsibility" thing is from and for a government that have no clue, and can't be bothered learning, how to govern.

[milly]

People like Dr Carl Henegan,John Ioannidis,Sunetra Gupta,Dr Karol Sikora Dr Mike Yeadon and Ivor Cummins make far more sense and reasoned arguments ,rather than the hysteria perpetuated by SAGE, Whitty and Vallance and the government.

I wouldn't put it that the above make "more reasoned arguments": it's more that they make arguments you personally find more reasonable.

It's important to note that your list includes a Cancer specialist (who likely isn't overly knowledgable about virology or airbourne disease) and a Dietician (seemingly of the "write a book about weight loss" variety). I have no idea why you chose to include either of these in your list (it makes it look like you're grabbing any name you can).

Please note though that our government have been woeful in the measures they've put in place throughout this incident. The measures have not been strong enough IMO, and some of the "advice" should have been mandated. I have no clue as to why you think someone taking their own reasonable precautions as advised by the worldwide scientific community (bar the odd outlier) is "following the herd" or "following government policy" given that government policy has had nothing to do with the scientific advice they recieved, and has been much more about ensuring they don't need to give support to businesses and people that have been affected by this situation. The entire "personal responsibility" thing is from and for a government that have no clue, and can't be bothered learning, how to govern.

If you don't rate Ivor Cummins or Karol Sikora I would love to hear your critiques of Sunetra Gupta, Dr Mike Yeadon, John Ioannidis and Dr Carl Hennegan.
You ask for names of people I listen to then just dismiss them.

[Pumpernickel]

If you don't rate Ivor Cummins or Karol Sikora I would love to hear your critiques of Sunetra Gupta, Dr Mike Yeadon, John Ioannidis and Dr Carl Hennegan.
You ask for names of people I listen to then just dismiss them.

You misunderstand on numerous counts.

Firstly: I don't rate people I've never heard of.

Secondly: I don't have the time or inclination to read a load of books. I prefer looking at the odd journal to see what's being said at source. By virtue of this, you will understand the lack of direct criticism for any of those individuals from myself.

Thirdly: You seem confused. I haven't asked you for any names and names are not something I would ask for in regards to a subject like this. What I would ask for is peer reviewed articles in publicly available journals where the writer cites all their sources, but I haven't felt the need to ask you for those yet, and can't see me asking in the forseeable.