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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Coronavirus discussion forum.
Woody Guthrie
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by Woody Guthrie »

In the vast majority of cases you won't be able to claim back a bank holiday but the statutory minimum holiday entitlement is 28 days and the minimum contractual annual leave in the business is 22.5 days with the balance made up of 8 Bank Holidays.

The business is legally obliged to provide you with 28 days annual leave so if you lost 4 through Easter and May you would be entitled to claim 1.5 days back.

Obviously this is unlikely to affect many people but it is the legal position and would probably take an industrial tribunal to resolve as most managers would just refuse by default.
Only dead fish follow the current
rhia
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by rhia »

My friends wife has to self isolate for twelve weeks and her husband’s work has he can stay off 12 weeks to anyone know if thats fact
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POSTMAN
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

Peeps in Oldham have to continue to shield until 14 August, anywhere else?

Oldham follows Rochdale, its neighbouring Greater Manchester borough, and Blackburn with Darwen and Pendle in Lancashire, in introducing new restrictions.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-m ... r-53568956" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Was their shielding extended? And Leicester?
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
johnboy999
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by johnboy999 »

With it looking increasingly likely that a second lockdown is coming and the strong possibility of people who shielded before being instructed to do so again, what is the official policy regarding sick pay? In my case, for example, when I shielded earlier this year, RM took 3 and a half months off my sick allowance but with other health related absences I now only have a few weeks allowance left to last for the next 4 years! If I am required to shield again, I will go onto half pay fairly quickly. Now, as I wasn’t furloughed first time round, I believe that wouldn’t be an option for me going forward.

When I asked my manager about this you know what his response was? Ignore the letter and come to work so I don’t have to worry about it! Unbelievable! :arrrghhh
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

Extremely clinically vulnerable’ employees

I have an employee in my team who is in the extremely clinically vulnerable group. There are local restrictions in place, so do they need to shield again?

Shielding ended on 31 July 2020 (16 August in Wales), so employees who cannot work from home have been able to return to work, with the relevant protective measures in place, from 1st August (17 August in Wales).

There may be cases of local restrictions where those employees who were previously shielding themselves are advised to do so again or take extra care. Where a local restriction impacts on the business, we will issue a COVID-19 flash communication to those in the affected areas. If this occurs, we encourage our managers to contact those employees to discuss their personal situation at the time.

When an extremely clinically vulnerable employee is returning to work managers should use the relevant Return to work toolkit and supporting documents to discuss returning to work with employees and contact HR Advice and Support where necessary.

Please note that the advice could change, so always check the Public Health website for the very latest position.

Safe return process agreed for vulnerable Royal Mail Group workers

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I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

COVID-19 flash communication
Ever seen one?
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54525067" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Shielding not needed yet, despite rising Covid rate
Shielding is not being reintroduced in England, despite rising levels of coronavirus across most of the nation.

Government advisers say that, unlike in March, there are other protective measures in place - such as the rule of six and the wearing of face coverings in shops - to help reduce the spread.

But people should take precautions to avoid getting Covid.

Those who were on the shielding list will receive a letter about the advice with tips on how they should do this.

The charity Blood Cancer UK said the recommendations were not enough on their own, without financial and mental health support for the most vulnerable.

The advice is tailored according to the local Covid alert level the person lives in, using the new three-tier system:

Medium alert level:
  • Strictly observe social distancing
    Meet others outside where possible
    Limit unnecessary journeys on public transport
    Work from home where possible
    People can still go to work and children should still attend school.
    Rule of six applies
High alert level:
  • Reduce the number of different people you meet outside
    Avoid travel except for essential journeys
    Work from home where possible
    Reduce the number of shopping trips made or go at quieter times of the day
    Going to work - in Covid-secure workplaces - permitted if they cannot work from home
    Children should still attend school
    Restrictions on not meeting other households indoors, unless part of a support bubble apply as does the rule meet in groups of no more than six outdoors
Very high alert level:
  • Work from home
    Stay at home as much as possible
    Avoid all but essential travel
    Reduce shopping trips, and if possible use online delivery or ask people in your household, support bubble or volunteers to collect food and medicines
    People in these areas are encouraged to still go outside for exercise, and can still go to school and to work if they cannot work from home
    Additional support should be available from local authorities
    Shielding advice will not automatically be triggered by an area going into tier three.
But it may be reintroduced in the future in hotspot areas in exceptional circumstances.

If that happens, people at high risk would again be advised to stay at home, not go to work or school and limit social interactions to their own household and support bubble.

The aim is to strike a balance - protecting health but not being too stringent with measures that can take a toll on people's wellbeing.

Deputy Chief Medical Officer for England Dr Jenny Harries said: "Whilst advisory, I would urge all those affected to follow the guidance wherever they can and to continue to access health services for their medical conditions.

"We will continue to monitor the evidence closely and fine-tune this approach to make sure everyone in this group is clear about the safest way to go about their daily lives, particularly over the coming winter months."

Shielding is paused in Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland too, and the devolved nations are expected to take similar approaches to England.

Gemma Peters, chief executive of Blood Cancer UK, said: "The Government needs to urgently revise this guidance and give financial support to people with blood cancer who cannot work from home.

"This guidance also fails to offer specific mental health support. The mental health toll of the pandemic on people who have been shielding has been great, and so it is extremely disappointing that, six months on, there is no extra mental health support for people who are vulnerable to the coronavirus."
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
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Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

I have an employee in my team who is in the extremely clinically vulnerable group. There are local restrictions in place, so do they need to shield again?

Shielding ended on 31 July 2020 (16 August in Wales), so employees who cannot work from home could return to work as our workplaces are ‘COVID-19 secure’. There may be cases of local/regional/national restrictions or lockdowns (e.g. the lockdown in England from 5 November to 2 December 2020) where those employees who were previously shielding themselves are advised to do so again or take extra care.

There may also be other employees who were not previously shielding, but due to a change in circumstances are now required to shield, e.g. they are undergoing chemotherapy. Where a local restriction impacts on the business, we will issue a COVID-19 flash communication to those in the affected areas. If this occurs, we encourage our managers to contact those employees to discuss their personal situation at the time.

For employees who have been advised by the NHS to shield themselves during periods of local/regional/national restrictions or lockdowns and provide the NHS updated letter as appropriate medical evidence to support this, we will continue to pay entitlement to RMG sick pay.

We will also provide financial support to those in that group who are due to move on to half pay, nil pay or Statutory Sick Pay (SSP). More details of this support will be communicated shortly.

When an extremely clinically vulnerable employee is returning to work managers should use the Return to work toolkit to discuss their return to work and contact HR Advice and Support where necessary.

Please note that the advice could change, so always check the Public Health website for the very latest position.

UPDATED 10 NOV 2020

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https://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communi ... 71&t=94715" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
johnboy999
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Re: Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those

Post by johnboy999 »

The bit about providing financial support for those moving onto half pay or zero pay..... any more details on this? I’ve just been told come to work or go onto half pay. No mention to me about any financial support from my manager :hmmmm
theotherone
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Re: Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those

Post by theotherone »

johnboy999 wrote:
16 Nov 2020, 07:39
The bit about providing financial support for those moving onto half pay or zero pay..... any more details on this? I’ve just been told come to work or go onto half pay. No mention to me about any financial support from my manager :hmmmm
Try the Rowland Hill trust mate.
johnboy999
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Re: Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those

Post by johnboy999 »

Just heard they will be paying full sick pay for everyone shielding up to December 2nd, including those on half/zero sick pay and staff with less then 12 months service. Good news at last!
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Re: Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those

Post by POSTMAN »

For employees who have been advised to shield again to due to local/regional/national restrictions or lockdowns, will Royal Mail sick pay be provided?
POSTMAN wrote:
17 Nov 2020, 10:01
https://www.myroyalmail.com/news/2020/1 ... -shielding

We are extending sick pay to clinically extremely vulnerable (CEV) colleagues

We understand that colleagues who are clinically extremely vulnerable (CEV) have been advised not to go to work during the national lockdown in England, if they cannot work from home.

Employees in this group will have received a letter from the UK Government/NHS, with detailed advice on what they can and cannot do during the current lockdown period.

People who are defined as CEV are at very high risk of severe illness from Covid-19, so if a colleague receives a letter from the UK Government/NHS advising them to shield, they should do so. If they are unable to work from home, they should not come to work.

We are extending Royal Mail sick pay to colleagues with CEV status as we did during the last lockdown. Exceptionally, we will also offer full sick pay to support CEV colleagues who are due to move on to half pay/nil pay or Statutory Sick Pay (SSP). This means CEV colleagues with less than a year’s service are also covered. This will apply where you cannot work from home. Colleagues who are on half/nil/SSP and in this category will receive a letter confirming the arrangement.

This approach will be in place until Wednesday 2 December when lockdown and shielding are due to end. The extension of our policy is at our discretion and we will review the situation again once we know whether lockdown or shielding are being extended.

As a condition of extending sick pay colleagues must:
  • Provide their manager with the letter they received from the Government/NHS advising them to shield and not come to work, if they cannot work from home, during the lockdown period.
    Agree to book and take all their full annual leave entitlement this holiday year (ending 31 March 2021) even if it overlaps with shielding.
    Agree to take any pre-booked annual leave, even if that overlaps with shielding.
    Colleagues will receive their usual pay when taking holiday.
Please note, the clinically extremely vulnerable rules currently only apply in England. Northern Ireland https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/co ... ble-people, Scotland https://www.gov.scot/publications/covid-shielding/ and Wales https://gov.wales/guidance-on-shielding ... id-19-html continue to have their own restrictions in place.
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
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Re: Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

Letters coming out again according to Boris.
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
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Re: Guidance on shielding and protecting people defined on medical grounds as extremely vulnerable from COVID-19 : Those who received the letter

Post by POSTMAN »

On 4 January 2021, the Prime Minister announced a new national lockdown to help tackle the high and rising cases of COVID-19 across the country. Everyone is required to follow the new national restrictions, which include:
  • 1. Requiring people to stay at home, except for specific purposes.
    2. Preventing gathering with people you do not live with, except for specific purposes.
    3. Closing certain businesses and venues, like hospitality and non-essential retail.
    4. Support children and young people to learn remotely until February half term, except for vulnerable children and the children of critical workers who may still attend school.
The new national lockdown restrictions are rules that apply to everyone and which everyone must follow. The full details of these rules can be found online at https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus.

As part of the lockdown, the Government is also advising all clinically extremely vulnerable people to take extra shielding measures to protect themselves. This advice will apply until 21 February 2021. If the advice is to continue beyond that date, we will write to you again with further information.

We are writing to you because you have previously been identified as someone thought to be clinically extremely vulnerable and therefore at highest risk of becoming very unwell if you catch COVID-19. This letter contains important advice on how to protect yourself and how to access further support. It also includes specific advice for clinically extremely vulnerable children and young people.

Whilst you are strongly advised to follow these extra precautionary shielding measures to help keep yourself safe, this remains advice, not the law. You must, however, follow the lockdown rules that apply to everyone.

If you live in an area that was previously in Tier 4, you may have recently received a letter advising you to shield. This letter now replaces that one, and you should follow the guidance and time periods set out in this letter.

Advice summary

Clinically extremely vulnerable people are advised to stay at home as much as possible. You can still go outdoors carefully to exercise or to attend health appointments. You are strongly advised to work from home if you can. If you cannot work from home, then you should not attend work. You may be eligible for the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme (furlough). This letter is a formal shielding notification and can act as evidence for your employer to show that you cannot work outside your home from 5 January until 21 February 2021, including for statutory sick pay (SSP) purposes.

Please make sure your GP has your most up to date contact details, including your home address and, if possible, a personal email address, so that we can contact you quickly in the event that guidance changes in the future.

If you need any additional support to help you follow the guidance, your local council may be able to help. You can contact your council and register for support at the Shielding Support website: https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-shielding-support

Advice for clinically extremely vulnerable children and young people

Our current knowledge suggests that very few children are at highest risk of severe illness due to the virus. Doctors have therefore been reviewing all children and young people who were initially identified as clinically extremely vulnerable to confirm whether they are still thought to be at highest risk.

If this letter is addressed to a child or young person, and you have not yet heard from your child’s hospital doctor or GP to discuss this, please contact whoever usually provides care for your child to check whether they should still be considered clinically extremely vulnerable.

If you have already discussed this with your child’s doctors and they have confirmed your child is still considered clinically extremely vulnerable, they should follow the advice in this letter.

Access to health and care

Please remember that the NHS is open, and we urge you to continue to access all the NHS services that you need. It is safer for you to use the NHS than to try to manage alone.

If you are concerned about the impact of COVID-19 on your health, speak to your GP, hospital clinician or use NHS111. Further information on accessing help and support can be found in the attached guidance.

The clinically extremely vulnerable will get priority access to vaccination against COVID-19 before the general population and in line with the priority ordering set by the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI). You will be contacted again by the NHS with more information on when and how you will be invited to get the vaccine.

The vaccine is likely to make an important contribution towards protecting you from COVID-19. We expect to have been able to offer the first dose of the vaccine to you by mid-February.

Your local NHS will ensure that you can receive the vaccine as safely as possible, as well as any care and support needed. Even if you have had both doses of the vaccine, you should continue to follow this shielding advice until further notice as we continue to assess the impact of vaccination among all groups. The people you live with should continue to follow the public health rules and guidance as long as they are in place, including if you have received the vaccine and if they have received the vaccine.

The Government is extending the offer of a free 4-month supply of vitamin D supplements for all adults who are clinically extremely vulnerable to support general health. If you have not already applied you can register at https://www.nhs.uk/get-vitamin-d. Further guidance on how to safely take vitamin D supplements will be provided during the opt in process.

We will continue to update you as the situation changes and will issue further advice to you before this guidance comes to an end on 21 February. Once again, we thank you for your efforts to keep yourself and others safe.

Yours sincerely,
Matt Hancock
Secretary of State for Health
Robert Jenrick
Secretary of State for Housing, Communities and Local Government

This email is available in different languages and formats, including easy read, on GOV.UK. For audio, braille, large print call RNIB on 0303 1239999

Guidance for clinically extremely vulnerable people

This guidance is for clinically extremely vulnerable people in England.

The full guidance can be found online at https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus. This is additional guidance specifically for clinically extremely vulnerable people, to help you protect yourself from the virus by following these shielding measures.

This guidance applies to clinically extremely vulnerable individuals only. Others living in a household with someone who is clinically extremely vulnerable are not advised to follow this guidance.

Socialising

The new national lockdown guidance, which applies to everyone, means that you must not leave or be outside of your home and garden, except for limited purposes which are set out in that guidance.

We are advising clinically extremely vulnerable people to stay at home as much as possible.

You can still go outside for exercise or to attend health appointments, but try to keep all contact with others outside of your household to a minimum, and avoid busy areas.

You can still meet with your support bubble, but you cannot meet others you do not live with unless they are part of your support bubble.
Outdoors, you can meet one person from another household for exercise. This is part of the wider national regulations that apply to everyone.
Try to stay 2 metres away from other people within your household, especially if they display symptoms of the virus or have been advised to self-isolate.

Work

You are strongly advised to work from home because the risk of exposure to the virus in your area may be currently be higher. If you cannot work from home, then you should not attend work.

You may want to speak to your employer about taking on an alternative role or change your working patterns temporarily to enable you to work from home where possible.

If you need support to work at home you can apply for Access to Work (https://www.gov.uk/access-to-work).
Access to Work will provide support for the disability-related extra costs of working that are beyond standard reasonable adjustments an employer must provide.

If you cannot make alternative arrangements, your employer may be able to furlough you under the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme (https://www.gov.uk/government/collectio ... ion-scheme), which has been extended until the end of April 2021. You should have a conversation with your employer about whether this is possible.

As you are being advised not to attend work, you may be eligible for Statutory Sick Pay (SSP) or Employment Support Allowance (ESA). The formal shielding letter you receive will act as evidence for your employer and the Department of Work and Pensions that you are advised to shield and may be eligible for SSP or ESA.

Members of the household who are not clinically extremely vulnerable should continue to attend work if they are unable to work from home, in line with the wider rules set out in the national lockdown guidance at https://www.gov.uk/guidance/national-lo ... ay-at-home.

Education settings

As our knowledge of COVID-19 has grown, we now know that very few children and young people are at highest risk of severe illness due to the virus. Doctors have therefore been reviewing all children and young people who were initially identified as clinically extremely vulnerable to confirm whether they are still thought to be at highest risk.

If you have already discussed this with your child’s doctors and they have confirmed your child is still considered clinically extremely vulnerable, your child should follow this shielding advice.

Under the current national lockdown, children will learn remotely until February half term, except for vulnerable children and the children of critical workers who may still attend school.

Clinically extremely vulnerable children and young people should not attend school or other educational settings, because the risk of exposure to the virus in the community is now very high. Your school or college will make appropriate arrangements for you to be able to continue your education at home.

Travel

You are advised to stay at home as much as possible and not to travel unless essential (e.g. to attend health appointments).
Shopping

You are advised not to go to the shops. Use online shopping if you can, or ask others to collect and deliver shopping for you (friends and family, local volunteers or NHS Volunteer Responders).

You can register (https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-shielding-support) to request priority access to supermarket delivery slots, if you do not have someone you can rely on to go shopping for you. If you already have priority access to a supermarket delivery slot, that will continue – you do not need to do anything further. When registering you will be asked for your NHS number. You can find it on any letter the NHS has sent you, or on a prescription.

Registering on the site just gives you priority. It does not mean you’ll definitely get a delivery slot. If you want access to supermarket deliveries, you will also need to set up an account with at least one supermarket and book slots yourself.

If you need other forms of help, including support to register for priority access to supermarket delivery slots, you should contact your local council directly. Find out how your local council can help at https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-local-help
Medicines
You are strongly advised not to go to a pharmacy.

In the first instance, you should ask if any friends, family or volunteers can collect medicines for you.
If friends and family are not able to collect your medicines for you, and you and/or the pharmacy are unable to arrange for a volunteer, then you will be eligible for free medicines delivery. Please contact your pharmacy to inform them that you are clinically extremely vulnerable and need your medicines delivered, and they will arrange this free of charge.

Accessing care and support

You can still receive informal care at home from people within your support bubble (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/making-a-su ... -household).

You can still receive care at home from professional social care and medical professionals.

We urge you to continue using the NHS and other health providers for your existing health conditions and any new health concerns.

You can access a range of NHS services from home, including ordering repeat prescriptions or contacting your health professional through an online consultation. To find out more visit www.nhs.uk/health-at-home, or download the NHS App at https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/nhs-se ... e-nhs-app/. If you have an urgent medical need, call NHS 111 or, for a medical emergency, dial 999.

If you do need to receive care in person, you can. Your local NHS services are well prepared and will put in measures to keep you safe.

It is also really important to look after your mental health. Go to the Every Mind Matters website (https://www.nhs.uk/oneyou/every-mind-matters/) for advice and practical steps that you can take to support your wellbeing and manage your mental health during this pandemic. If you or someone you care for are experiencing a mental health crisis, we urge you to make contact with a local health professional immediately (https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/nhs-se ... al-health/).

Any carers or visitors who support you with your everyday needs can continue to visit. This also applies for those of a child or young person in your care. They should follow social distancing guidance where close or personal contact is not required.

You should continue to access support from local charities and organisations, as well as NHS Volunteer Responders. As well as helping with shopping and medicines delivery, NHS Volunteer Responders can help with a regular, friendly phone call, and transport to and from health appointments.
Call 0808 196 3646 between 8am and 8pm to arrange support or visit NHS Volunteer Responders website at https://www.nhsvolunteerresponders.org.uk/

Registering for additional support

If you need additional help to follow this guidance, your local council may be able to help. If you are advised to shield you will be able to register yourself or someone else at https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-shielding-support to:
  • • request priority access to a supermarket delivery slot (if you have already got priority access that will continue – you do not need to do anything further)
    • tell your council if you need support to follow shielding guidance, especially if you are unable to arrange this yourself or with the help of friends, family or other support networks
    • make sure your details, such as your address, are up to date
When registering you will be asked for your NHS number. You can find it on any letter the NHS has sent you, or on a prescription. It is helpful if you register even if you do not have any support needs at this time. You can log in and update your needs if circumstances change at any time.
I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
My BFF Clash
The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.