November Lockdown

[k979aaa]

We need a proper evaluation of this as schools are the primary cause of this we cannot meet any other family in our own family but my kid can go to school with 30 to 40 other kids in the same classroom. Madness!

Totally mad, you're right.

Rate of infection in schools is lower than in the general population and flat or declining in primary school children.
So no, again he's not right.
He's just projecting a baseless theory.

Debunking your theory we all have millions of bacterial infections and viruses in our own noses If anyone breaths with a mask or without a mask it can possibly get transported for want of a better word.

[Sir Henry]

"Most children who become infected with the COVID-19 virus have no symptoms, or they have milder symptoms such as low-grade fever, fatigue, and cough. Early studies suggested that children do not contribute much to the spread of coronavirus. But more recent studies raise concerns that children could be capable of spreading the infection.

Though the recent studies varied in their methods, their findings were similar: infected children had as much, or more, coronavirus in their upper respiratory tracts as infected adults.

The amount of virus found in children — their viral load — was not correlated with the severity of their symptoms. In other words, more virus did not mean more severe symptoms.

Finding high amounts of viral genetic material — these studies measured viral RNA, not live virus — in kids does not prove that children are infectious. However, the presence of high viral loads in infected children does increase the concern that children, even those without symptoms, could readily spread the infection to others."

Children/school kids are still a vector.

[k979aaa]

if it did not work the first time why would it work now?

It did work the first time.

It was "late", and thus went on longer that it could have, but it did slow the spread and thus reduce the load on hospitals which was the aim of the lockdown. If it hadn't "worked" cases would have continued to rise, and hospitals would have had patients stacked on top of each other possibly with trailers filling the car parks to store the dead.

This new lockdown has the same aim. Now that cases have risen to a point where there is risk of overwhelming hospitals again, they aim to slow the spread to reduce the load on hospitals again.

I do agree with slowing the transmission rate but why did we end up where we are when the government said test and trace is working and the lack of action to support our NHS by recruiting more staff and actually building hospitals and buying drugs that treat the virus, If not make them ourselves this is time lost and people will die of this inaction that they cannot claim to have noticed!

[Pumpernickel]

why did we end up where we are when the government said test and trace is working and the lack of action to support our NHS by recruiting more staff and actually building hospitals and buying drugs that treat the virus, If not make them ourselves this is time lost and people will die of this inaction that they cannot claim to have noticed!

Track and trace isn't working. It doesn't work with the people in the system, and that system is voluntary leaving many reluctant to subscribe.

They can't just "recruit" more NHS staff. Doctors and Nurses need to be trained, a process that takes years, to be able to fulfill the needs of their respective roles. The worldwide nature of this pandemic means we can't just temporarily "loan" or "poach" trained people from overseas as everywhere else needs the same staff.

Drugs I don't know about, but there is active worldwide research. I'm not certain of the UKs drug manufacturing capability, but any expansion in that capability will probably take years given factories need be built or repurposed, and any machinery used needs be manufactured and installed. Again this also needs competent people (Doctors, analysts, and whoever else) with worldwide demand, and any training to gain competence takes years.

While I also have concers over our governments inaction, it is important to recognise that many things necessary to get this thing under control cannot happen overnight. It's impossible, hence the government were advised weeks (months?) ago to have repeated 2 week lockdowns to control the spread.

[k979aaa]

why did we end up where we are when the government said test and trace is working and the lack of action to support our NHS by recruiting more staff and actually building hospitals and buying drugs that treat the virus, If not make them ourselves this is time lost and people will die of this inaction that they cannot claim to have noticed!

Track and trace isn't working. It doesn't work with the people in the system, and that system is voluntary leaving many reluctant to subscribe.

They can't just "recruit" more NHS staff. Doctors and Nurses need to be trained, a process that takes years, to be able to fulfill the needs of their respective roles. The worldwide nature of this pandemic means we can't just temporarily "loan" or "poach" trained people from overseas as everywhere else needs the same staff.

Drugs I don't know about, but there is active worldwide research. I'm not certain of the UKs drug manufacturing capability, but any expansion in that capability will probably take years given factories need be built or repurposed, and any machinery used needs be manufactured and installed. Again this also needs competent people (Doctors, analysts, and whoever else) with worldwide demand, and any training to gain competence takes years.

While I also have concers over our governments inaction, it is important to recognise that many things necessary to get this thing under control cannot happen overnight. It's impossible, hence the government were advised weeks (months?) ago to have repeated 2 week lockdowns to control the spread.

They have had at least 8 months to implement these things what did they do spend £530 million on eat out to spread it all around give way and bounce back loans in everybody's name in the phone book. This is not rocket science we the UK are a laughing stock with a spiv for a priminister and a ship of fools who follow him. I know lot's of people who are disenchanted with this fool time will tell.

[Pumpernickel]

They have had at least 8 months to implement these things what did they do spend £530 million on eat out to spread it all around give way and bounce back loans in everybody's name in the phone book. This is not rocket science we the UK are a laughing stock with a spiv for a priminister and a ship of fools who follow him. I know lot's of people who are disenchanted with this fool time tell.

I don't disagree with you on eat out to spread it out, and have my own issues regarding the hundreds of millions given to companies (that have been operating for single digits of days) for "PPE" that goes straight in the bin, on the millions spent on "consultancies", on the restrictions that are often contradictory or nonsensical, or the track and trace that doesn't work (the Serco bit: the NHS run bits actually work fine apparently).

There is a lot of incompetence up top, along with a lot of mud slinging to blame everybody else (aided and abetted by the press), but that doesn't change the realities of other aspects where increasing capacity (for example; in the NHS) will literally take years, or in the worldwide effort to find some sort of vaccine which will be ready when it's ready.

[twiddledumb]

why did we end up where we are when the government said test and trace is working and the lack of action to support our NHS by recruiting more staff and actually building hospitals and buying drugs that treat the virus, If not make them ourselves this is time lost and people will die of this inaction that they cannot claim to have noticed!

Track and trace isn't working. It doesn't work with the people in the system, and that system is voluntary leaving many reluctant to subscribe.

.

It is not working because the corrupt tories are handing out the contracts to their mates/donors to do it (serco) instead of the NHS/local councils. This government are rotten to the core. Read the articles below to see how corrupt this lot are.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -teenagers" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/ ... r-22827399" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[k979aaa]

They have had at least 8 months to implement these things what did they do spend £530 million on eat out to spread it all around give way and bounce back loans in everybody's name in the phone book. This is not rocket science we the UK are a laughing stock with a spiv for a priminister and a ship of fools who follow him. I know lot's of people who are disenchanted with this fool time tell.

I don't disagree with you on eat out to spread it out, and have my own issues regarding the hundreds of millions given to companies (that have been operating for single digits of days) for "PPE" that goes straight in the bin, on the millions spent on "consultancies", on the restrictions that are often contradictory or nonsensical, or the track and trace that doesn't work (the Serco bit: the NHS run bits actually work fine apparently).

There is a lot of incompetence up top, along with a lot of mud slinging to blame everybody else (aided and abetted by the press), but that doesn't change the realities of other aspects where increasing capacity (for example; in the NHS) will literally take years, or in the worldwide effort to find some sort of vaccine which will be ready when it's ready.

It will take years but will the vaccine work with all the strains even if it does not would be better off investing in the health care system than bounce back loans and eat out to help out. Because we could find another virus just as deadly in ten years time or so?

[Grumpyoldmailman]

It will take years but will the vaccine work with all the strains

I have been wondering that as well.

[rambo1]

Just had a scary thought. Black Friday and cyber Monday or whatever they're naming them this yr, 100% on line !!!! We're fxxcked.

[k979aaa]

Just had a scary thought. Black Friday and cyber Monday or whatever they're naming them this yr, 100% on line !!!! We're fxxcked.

Don't worry no one is manning the phones or the desks the managers are shitting themselves keep calm and carry on do your best!

[Pumpernickel]

will the vaccine work with all the strains even if it does not would be better off investing in the health care system than bounce back loans and eat out to help out. Because we could find another virus just as deadly in ten years time or so?

No idea if the vaccine will work for all strains (no idea if a vaccine will ever be available at all either). I don't work in that field (obvs) so I don't think about it.

I agree we'd be better investing in the healthcare system, but we've got a relatively recently elected government of the type to siphon all the money out of the healthcare system. I have doubts that they would invest in anything outside their own pockets and with the prospect of voting them out 3.5 years away: I don't concern myself with that either. I only have so much time, and I'd rather not spend most of it angry.

regarding another virus: it's not a case of "could find" another: it's a case of "will come across" another at some point (and it'll happen when it happens). I just hope it comes after we've had the opportunity to get an investing government that invest prudently, but before we've forgotten that spare capacity in healthcare is required (as opposed to an "inefficiency").

[k979aaa]

It will take years but will the vaccine work with all the strains

I have been wondering that as well.

Do we need a vaccine I have one for flu it only has three strains of the virus of which there is 74 or more they use data of which strain is most common in Australia in June which is there winter hence why we get the flu jab every October. Not averse to needles or jab or vaccines or social distancing or washing hands before and after a piss as some say on here most don't in his acquaintance.

[k979aaa]

here are the rules https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-52530518" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Schools will stay open and university's and supermarkets will be open. But non essential shops will close which will increase parcel volumes and possibly letters too!

[twiddledumb]

Still no mandatory mask wearing in offices. Dodo Johnsons brain takes weeks before the penny drops that something needs to be done.