Edited title : Strike action? .

[Woody Guthrie]

So why ballot in March Martin when it was already obvious covid19 was going to be a game changer?
Don't you think that was a waste of time and money?

The fact is this dispute has rumbled on since before the agreement in 2018 precisely because the agreement itself was unsatisfactory for both parties, too complex, too many strings and hoops to jump through and too much wiggle room for the employer.

Going by Royal Mail's behaviour it is looking increasingly unlikely that an agreement is achievable but even if one is how can the union convince members that it will be adhered to?

[Martin Walsh]

Woody we never balloted in March we announced the ballot result on St Patrick’s day in March but the ballot timetable was announced in January a time before anyone in the UK realised the impact of COVID.

The reality is that talks are extremely difficult , what the company wants and what we are willing to agree is currently some distance away.

The company wants massive reductions in costs including 5 hour delivery spans , standardising attendance patterns , everyone working above 100 BSi and reductions in sick pay to name just a few demands. For that they are willing to give an unacceptable pay offer based on us accepting all the strings.

So this is not an easy negotiation and there is real pressure for Royal Mail as a result of their future financial position.

If it was easy we would have done the pay deal but nothing is easy in the post COVID world as sadly many employees are finding out through job losses and reductions in terms and conditions.

[Acca Dacca]

Woody we never balloted in March we announced the ballot result on St Patrick’s day in March but the ballot timetable was announced in January a time before anyone in the UK realised the impact of COVID.

The reality is that talks are extremely difficult , what the company wants and what we are willing to agree is currently some distance away.

The company wants massive reductions in costs including 5 hour delivery spans , standardising attendance patterns , everyone working above 100 BSi and reductions in sick pay to name just a few demands. For that they are willing to give an unacceptable pay offer based on us accepting all the strings.

So this is not an easy negotiation and there is real pressure for Royal Mail as a result of their future financial position.

If it was easy we would have done the pay deal but nothing is easy in the post COVID world as sadly many employees are finding out through job losses and reductions in terms and conditions.

what is BSi?

[Woody Guthrie]

The company wants massive reductions in costs including 5 hour delivery spans , standardising attendance patterns , everyone working above 100 BSi

To be fair Martin most of the country are already working under those conditions.

[clashcityrocker]

what is BSi?

It is a measure of productivity.
I didn't think you could go over 100. Not in the real world,

[Manboat]

Woody we never balloted in March we announced the ballot result on St Patrick’s day in March but the ballot timetable was announced in January a time before anyone in the UK realised the impact of COVID.

The reality is that talks are extremely difficult , what the company wants and what we are willing to agree is currently some distance away.

The company wants massive reductions in costs including 5 hour delivery spans , standardising attendance patterns , everyone working above 100 BSi and reductions in sick pay to name just a few demands. For that they are willing to give an unacceptable pay offer based on us accepting all the strings.

So this is not an easy negotiation and there is real pressure for Royal Mail as a result of their future financial position.

If it was easy we would have done the pay deal but nothing is easy in the post COVID world as sadly many employees are finding out through job losses and reductions in terms and conditions.

Thanks for that Martin, you’ve told me more in that sentence than I’ve learnt in the last few months, I’m passed wanting to hear good news just some news and honest updates would be welcomed now.

[roadrunner bill]

Not a chance above 100 BS I .... that put people in a coffin..

Its killing people now.. they dont live in the real world..,

[toonshola]

Woody we never balloted in March we announced the ballot result on St Patrick’s day in March but the ballot timetable was announced in January a time before anyone in the UK realised the impact of COVID.

The reality is that talks are extremely difficult , what the company wants and what we are willing to agree is currently some distance away.

The company wants massive reductions in costs including 5 hour delivery spans , standardising attendance patterns , everyone working above 100 BSi and reductions in sick pay to name just a few demands. For that they are willing to give an unacceptable pay offer based on us accepting all the strings.

So this is not an easy negotiation and there is real pressure for Royal Mail as a result of their future financial position.

If it was easy we would have done the pay deal but nothing is easy in the post COVID world as sadly many employees are finding out through job losses and reductions in terms and conditions.

Why are we not getting proper updates like this on a regular basis? I think this is the first time I’ve read any real details of what’s going on in the talks. Surely these talks can’t remain all sneaky and hush hush all the way through Christmas, the staff have had enough.

[SpacePhoenix]

Woody we never balloted in March we announced the ballot result on St Patrick’s day in March but the ballot timetable was announced in January a time before anyone in the UK realised the impact of COVID.

The reality is that talks are extremely difficult , what the company wants and what we are willing to agree is currently some distance away.

The company wants massive reductions in costs including 5 hour delivery spans , standardising attendance patterns , everyone working above 100 BSi and reductions in sick pay to name just a few demands. For that they are willing to give an unacceptable pay offer based on us accepting all the strings.

So this is not an easy negotiation and there is real pressure for Royal Mail as a result of their future financial position.

If it was easy we would have done the pay deal but nothing is easy in the post COVID world as sadly many employees are finding out through job losses and reductions in terms and conditions.

I know that many (if not all MPUs) are having their CSS machines removed and reverting back to being normal DOs. Any ideas what RM's plans are for CSS, iLSM, IMPs and T2K machines in MCs

[Martin Walsh]

It is difficult for the union to give updates as talks are bound by confidentiality. I have only reveal what Terry mentioned on one of the Facebook live sessions he did. But believe me the things Royal Mail want to change are significant and no one would accept for the type of pay deal on offer.

For the record BSi is a based on planning values and a British Standard. So each task in either in processing or indoor delivery is rated on a planning value. So for example what a 1000 letters should take to sort against what it did take to sort.

The outdoor element is measured by observed times where they measured 30 thousand delivery duties during the ACAS delivery to neighbour discussions.

100 BSi is measured as someone who is considered as motivated and has a full head of workload.

For the record there are offices up and down the uk in every city working at well over 100 if fact the highest record was at 288 BSi. Remember there are unmeasured parts of BSi so it is not an exact measure as it is based on national averages rather than your own office specifics.

Woody very few offices are working at 5 hours excluding travel time and first door to last door only.

[Martin Walsh]

It is difficult for the union to give updates as talks are bound by confidentiality. I have only reveal what Terry mentioned on one of the Facebook live sessions he did. But believe me the things Royal Mail want to change are significant and no one would accept for the type of pay deal on offer.

For the record BSi is a based on planning values and a British Standard. So each task in either in processing or indoor delivery is rated on a planning value. So for example what a 1000 letters should take to sort against what it did take to sort.

The outdoor element is measured by observed times where they measured 30 thousand delivery duties during the ACAS delivery to neighbour discussions.

100 BSi is measured as someone who is considered as motivated and has a full head of workload.

For the record there are offices up and down the uk in every city working at well over 100 if fact the highest record was at 288 BSi. Remember there are unmeasured parts of BSi so it is not an exact measure as it is based on national averages rather than your own office specifics. Of course there hundreds of offices who are below 100 BSi again across the UK. Royal Mail always wants to standardise performance across the UK but there are so many different reasons why offices are different ranging from being outside their postcode , having a CSS attached for the office ,multi floor working , have all CDVs or all HCT walks , have more firms , new delivery point growth , having more rehab duties the list is endless.



Woody very few offices are working at 5 hours excluding travel time and first door to last door only.

[Manboat]

It is difficult for the union to give updates as talks are bound by confidentiality. I have only reveal what Terry mentioned on one of the Facebook live sessions he did. But believe me the things Royal Mail want to change are significant and no one would accept for the type of pay deal on offer.

For the record BSi is a based on planning values and a British Standard. So each task in either in processing or indoor delivery is rated on a planning value. So for example what a 1000 letters should take to sort against what it did take to sort.

The outdoor element is measured by observed times where they measured 30 thousand delivery duties during the ACAS delivery to neighbour discussions.

100 BSi is measured as someone who is considered as motivated and has a full head of workload.

For the record there are offices up and down the uk in every city working at well over 100 if fact the highest record was at 288 BSi. Remember there are unmeasured parts of BSi so it is not an exact measure as it is based on national averages rather than your own office specifics. Of course there hundreds of offices who are below 100 BSi again across the UK. Royal Mail always wants to standardise performance across the UK but there are so many different reasons why offices are different ranging from being outside their postcode , having a CSS attached for the office ,multi floor working , have all CDVs or all HCT walks , have more firms , new delivery point growth , having more rehab duties the list is endless.



Woody very few offices are working at 5 hours excluding travel time and first door to last door only.

We appreciate the info Martin as feel kept in the dark, now at least I feel I know how the talks are actually going, we all know thing’s are gonna change and need to, we just wanna know where we stand.

[Woody Guthrie]

Woody very few offices are working at 5 hours excluding travel time and first door to last door only.

A 5 hour + travelling time standard delivery span would mean increasing a huge number of part-time contracts across the business.
I'll leave it to members to decide whether that's good, bad or even likely to be a thing.

When taken with the level of indoor efficiency already being achieved the length of the delivery span in most of the country is already at a point where any increase is unlikely to be achievable without affecting the indoor operation.

In short for most of us it's no longer the boogeyman it may be for certain areas.

What we obviously fear far more is any reduction in the USO, any word on Royal Mail's preferred direction of travel with that?

[SSkUNkY]

Have they sacked the 20,000 managers doing 'busy work' yet?

When was the last time the Military or Education sectors made a profit? Should we cancel the Armed Forces and all schooling?

People want this service and if the s**t hit the fan Royal Mail would be bailed out by the Government anyway, is no chance in hell they allow 110,000 people to lose their jobs simultaneously.

Yes we cannot hold a strike during a pandemic as it would unite the public against us and be completely inappropriate but we are in a position of strength not weakness and need to behave as such.

[yellowbelly]

...............

Woody very few offices are working at 5 hours excluding travel time and first door to last door only.

LOL - every single duty I know in 6 offices is and this doesn't include the actual OT that has to be
done to complete the duty in the real world........