2 IN A VAN AGAIN?

Cucumber · Post by **Cucumber** » 21 Jul 2020, 19:09

From BBC:

Sir Jeremy, a member of Sage, the government advisory body, said the world would be living with Covid-19 for "very many, many years to come".

"Things will not be done by Christmas. This infection is not going away, it's now a human endemic infection.

"Even, actually, if we have a vaccine or very good treatments, humanity will still be living with this virus for very many, many years.... decades to come."

If a job can be done 1 per van, which it can be albeit with varying levels of difficulty/success. then I can't see it returning to shared vans.

citypostie · Post by **citypostie** » 21 Jul 2020, 19:46

If we don't go back to van sharing it will be because rm don't want us to, not because of covid. Eventually even though it isn't disappearing life will get back to normal and not the "new normal" we've got now. I went to Asda the other day, noticed they've done away with the queing system and staff counting people in and out. It's getting back to normal because thats what the government wants and it won't matter what any scientist says in the long run because the money matters more

Post by **SpacePhoenix** » 21 Jul 2020, 19:55

If packet levels stay high, long term will van share even still be viable with the increased amount of space needed in the vans?

Mr Rush · Post by **Mr Rush** » 21 Jul 2020, 20:46

barncopxx wrote:But it goes to prove that the good old days of job and finish were by far the most efficient and cost effective way of doing this job!

I've been saying that ever since P&L came in. Maybe on upper management's flow charts the job looked like a beatifully synchronised machine designed by an expert watchmaker, but in reality it was always the three-legged race.

daveyeff · Post by **daveyeff** » 22 Jul 2020, 16:18

Mr Rush wrote:
barncopxx wrote:But it goes to prove that the good old days of job and finish were by far the most efficient and cost effective way of doing this job!
I've been saying that ever since P&L came in. Maybe on upper management's flow charts the job looked like a beatifully synchronised machine designed by an expert watchmaker, but in reality it was always the three-legged race.

because Crozier and Leighton wanted to do away with ''Spanish practices''...i.e job and knock. ''we just want people to work the hours they are paid'' (those two didn't)..and so began the beginnings of park and loop and 5.5-6 hour deliveries and endless fighting with the union. we were making 700m a year profit before that.

Cucumber · Post by **Cucumber** » 22 Jul 2020, 17:24

daveyeff wrote:
Mr Rush wrote:
barncopxx wrote:But it goes to prove that the good old days of job and finish were by far the most efficient and cost effective way of doing this job!
I've been saying that ever since P&L came in. Maybe on upper management's flow charts the job looked like a beatifully synchronised machine designed by an expert watchmaker, but in reality it was always the three-legged race.
because Crozier and Leighton wanted to do away with ''Spanish practices''...i.e job and knock. ''we just want people to work the hours they are paid'' (those two didn't)..and so began the beginnings of park and loop and 5.5-6 hour deliveries and endless fighting with the union. we were making 700m a year profit before that.

Unfortunately a lot of offices have gone 'all in' on park and loop and will need to be majorly restructured to get 'out' of it again. Plenty offices moved to new locations miles away with the 'they can just drive there 2 in a van' way of planning. Theres at least 2 offices in our area that moved 15 minutes away from where they were originally located.

DGH · Post by **DGH** » 22 Jul 2020, 17:49

Cucumber wrote:
Unfortunately a lot of offices have gone 'all in' on park and loop and will need to be majorly restructured to get 'out' of it again. Plenty offices moved to new locations miles away with the 'they can just drive there 2 in a van' way of planning. Theres at least 2 offices in our area that moved 15 minutes away from where they were originally located.

One in a van (two shifts if necessary) and everyone drives solves that.

Not by any means a 'good thing', but a solution. Especially if a '21st century USO' allows letters and untracked packets to be delivered every second, or even third, day, allowing sufficient scope for the redundancies.

Remember: there's a job for anyone who can and wants to work for Royal Mail.

Cucumber · Post by **Cucumber** » 22 Jul 2020, 18:08

DGH wrote:
Cucumber wrote:
Unfortunately a lot of offices have gone 'all in' on park and loop and will need to be majorly restructured to get 'out' of it again. Plenty offices moved to new locations miles away with the 'they can just drive there 2 in a van' way of planning. Theres at least 2 offices in our area that moved 15 minutes away from where they were originally located.
One in a van (two shifts if necessary) and everyone drives solves that.

Not by any means a 'good thing', but a solution. Especially if a '21st century USO' allows letters and untracked packets to be delivered every second, or even third, day, allowing sufficient scope for the redundancies.

Remember: there's a job for anyone who can and wants to work for Royal Mail.

As has been covered on here extensively though, you can't just make someone drive when they've never had to in the past. And on a similar theme, people using their OMV's just now are doing so as it understandably suits them as much as it suits the company. That can't go on forever, surely? How will that be sold to future employees - yeah, you need to drive, but please use your own vehicle.

DGH · Post by **DGH** » 22 Jul 2020, 18:17

Cucumber wrote:
DGH wrote:
Cucumber wrote:
Unfortunately a lot of offices have gone 'all in' on park and loop and will need to be majorly restructured to get 'out' of it again. Plenty offices moved to new locations miles away with the 'they can just drive there 2 in a van' way of planning. Theres at least 2 offices in our area that moved 15 minutes away from where they were originally located.
One in a van (two shifts if necessary) and everyone drives solves that.

Not by any means a 'good thing', but a solution. Especially if a '21st century USO' allows letters and untracked packets to be delivered every second, or even third, day, allowing sufficient scope for the redundancies.

Remember: there's a job for anyone who can and wants to work for Royal Mail.
As has been covered on here extensively though, you can't just make someone drive when they've never had to in the past. And on a similar theme, people using their OMV's just now are doing so as it understandably suits them as much as it suits the company. That can't go on forever, surely? How will that be sold to future employees - yeah, you need to drive, but please use your own vehicle.

You can make non-drivers redundant though, if you decide everyone needs to drive. 'Can and wants to . . .'.

You're right, use of one's own vehicle will stop. But why would you need more vans when introducing two shifts would effectively remove the need to?

I'm not saying any of this will happen, but we should be aware it very well might in these 'unprecedented times' when the business feels the need to 'accelerate the rate of change.'

How many drivers would walk to support non-drivers? I'm sure many would. But many already mutter about the unfairness of the greater responsibility that driving carries.

wallan · Post by **wallan** » 22 Jul 2020, 19:05

There are Jobs being advertised now for PT Delivery Staff working 1300 - 1800 , 25Hrs working 5 days from 6 , Mon - Sat

Bahia Feliz · Post by **Bahia Feliz** » 22 Jul 2020, 19:07

wallan wrote:There are Jobs being advertised now for PT Delivery Staff working 1300 - 1800 , 25Hrs working 5 days from 6 , Mon - Sat

You can't do a delivery in 5 hours including bundling,travelling and meal relief etc,impossible!

Ren Hoëk · Post by **Ren Hoëk** » 22 Jul 2020, 19:10

Non Drivers should seriously consider learning to drive. RM would be stupid not to move to a fully mobile workforce. RM wants to restructure itself to serve parcels first and foremost. A driver can do all duties, a non Driver is limited in their capacity. Doesn't take a genius to see whats coming.

wallan · Post by **wallan** » 22 Jul 2020, 19:21

Bahia Feliz wrote:
wallan wrote:There are Jobs being advertised now for PT Delivery Staff working 1300 - 1800 , 25Hrs working 5 days from 6 , Mon - Sat
You can't do a delivery in 5 hours including bundling,travelling and meal relief etc,impossible!

Whats different to the 0900 - 1400 25 hr contracts ,

Manboat · Post by **Manboat** » 22 Jul 2020, 19:38

Yeh we’re recruiting a few in our place apparently on those times, will do whatever’s required e.g cut offs, parcels, surely if they were gonna force existing staff onto split shifts they wouldn’t need to recruit these would they

Cucumber · Post by **Cucumber** » 22 Jul 2020, 19:48

Manboat wrote:Yeh we’re recruiting a few in our place apparently on those times, will do whatever’s required e.g cut offs, parcels, surely if they were gonna force existing staff onto split shifts they wouldn’t need to recruit these would they

Those times look like they are wanting a 'second wave' of staff using the vans from 1pm onwards. That will only work if vans can return after doing their contracted hours by 1pm. Do those offices have staff that finish by 1pm (I'm talking about the time they are paid to, not a time achievable by not taking breaks/not doing full hours etc). It needs to based on contracted hours, not some kind of 'someone will be back 2 hours early and you can use your van (which is kind of what's happening now).

As a second thought, with times like that, I'm sure they could tempt many full time staff with a generous buy down of hours incentive.