RM latest changes to service

[twiddledumb]

emm STRIKE! even if they have to pass another ballot. Just do something instead of pointless twitter/facebook posts that are only read by a small percentage of union members. RM will treat us like s**t if the union lets them, and it seems the union a letting them.

I wouldn't be surprised if RM have or are looking onto whether a strike over this firstly would need its own ballot and if it does need it's own ballot, whether they could force the union to go through the whole disagreement and mediation process which would drag it out a good few weeks

And even if it didn’t need one, most legislation has the “national security / public interest” clause that can be activated seemingly at a whim, expect an injunction inbound during the pandemic, of course foreseen by the tacticians;

Most people moaning about the union doing nothing don’t realise how hard it would actually be to strike.

Officially.

And of course don’t expect the union to mass communicate some instruction to work to rule etc; that could be construed as a de-facto strike which is thus unlawful (be surprised if non conformity instruction deemed outside the scope of this tbh).

And on top of that you’ve got a load of folks who want the Saturdays off.

So yeah, anyone moaning about union leadership I wanna know what they’d do if they were running the show. I imagine there’s a lot of really half baked / lashy outey ideas out there that wouldn’t really work real world.

Ok great so tell me why I am paying the union subs for then? What actually is there point if they are as hamstrung as you say they are?

Well if we all stop paying our subs we’ll definitely be worse off for sure.

It’d be way easier to pull sick pay for example.

Just giz an idea on this. Someone. Anyone. Maybe we can figure it out.

Blindly shouting for “summat” isn’t that helpful right now.

So lets say RM did end sick pay, what would the union do? We have just been told that they are hamstrung and cannot really do anything. Again what the hell is the point of the union if RM don't care about them, don't listen to them. If RM can implement sweeping changes to our working practices without push back or action from the union then there is no point in the union and we should all get refunds and stop paying subs. Dave Ward is on over £100 thousand a year. He is paid to protect our jobs and working conditions, maybe it's about time he earned that money.

[Woody Guthrie]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

[LaggyBand]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

And if you get the politest negotiator going, and the response is the plan has to go ahead, what then?

[twiddledumb]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

From what we know about Rico's history in Germany, he will only talk if he is made to talk, otherwise he will do what he likes and not care one iota about what the union thinks. If we want him to talk we have to show strength, and that means be serious about strike action. The unions should at the very least be threatening it. At the moment they are letting Rico walk all over us, so much so that if RM get away with this change in delivery without any worker input, then it will embolden Rico to do what he did in Germany with working conditions and benefits like sick pay all next in line for his agenda. The membership want action not facebook/twitter posts stand up to Rico and show them it is unacceptable to do this without any consultation with the workforce.

[postmanzach]

Is the union plan for us to ignore the management and continue to work normal contracted hours?

[circles]

We should be on strike now..

f**k the courts...

We must take matters into our own hands.

[circles]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

These people are utter scum with no morals or any sense of decency.

Why should we waste yet more time "talking"?

Time for talking has long gone, Sonny Jim

[Woody Guthrie]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

These people are utter scum with no morals or any sense of decency.

Why should we waste yet more time "talking"?

Time for talking has long gone, Sonny Jim

So what comes after strike action, Uncle Buck?

[Ren Hoëk]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

These people are utter scum with no morals or any sense of decency.

Why should we waste yet more time "talking"?

Time for talking has long gone, Sonny Jim

So what comes after strike action, Uncle Buck?

Woody, You have made it very clear you don't have the fight for a strike. The man is not for negotiating. You keep asking questions of people but what do you want? You haven't said a thing. We can see that our T&Cs are under threat, Jobs are on the line and all the time you throw your hands in the air saying "But what can we do" etc. Il tell you what we can do, Go down fighting! They were pushing through with EA and are doing it again. What do you do? Ask politely and get told no? Then what do you do? Terry is not the problem here. Rico is the problem. Who ever was in charge Rico would ignore.

Strike, Starve them of income and force them around the table. Customers will not except it and will look else where, Shareholders will s**t themselves and tell Rico to get around the table and sort this mess out. Shareholders have already been told no dividend as is, How will they feel watching their investment crumble? I think they will come to the conclusion that Rico doesn't have the workforce on side to achieve the results he and they want and will be stuck in a never ended circle of poor industrial relations. All because he is just ignoring the workforce. We know what we are happy with, It was called the 4 pillars. Before you tell me that is a piece of history. It was from 2 f***ing years ago and not fully implemented before Rico came along are tore it up.

I think we can all except that over time, with modernisation and technology the size of the work force will shrink. We want cast iron assurances that there will be no forced redundancies. We also want cast iron assurances that our jobs will not be changed so dramatically and walks made so arduous that continuing them becomes unbearable. What was the saying "Jobs for people who want them and can do them"? A very suspicious quote. It sounds like they will be looking to make the job so s**t that people will walk. Tantamount to constructive dismissal whole scale. They are doing nothing and the very opposite to relay those fears.

So what do we do? Nothing and be forced out or put up with an unbearable job who's T&C's are diminished or put up a fight.

[clashcityrocker]

I think we can all accept that over time, with modernisation and technology the size of the work force will shrink. We want cast iron assurances that there will be no forced redundancies. We also want cast iron assurances that our jobs will not be changed so dramatically and walks made so arduous that continuing them becomes unbearable. What was the saying "Jobs for people who want them and can do them"? A very suspicious quote. It sounds like they will be looking to make the job so s**t that people will walk. Tantamount to constructive dismissal whole scale. They are doing nothing and the very opposite to relay those fears.

1. The CWU cannot accept further shrinkage of the workforce because there simply won't be the necessary level of subs being paid to sustain the union in its present form. It will need to amalgamate with another union. It isn't our jobs that are on the line. Not really.
2. Given the shitstorm that is about to engulf the world economy there can be no cast iron guarantees. Worldwide, millions (maybe billions) of people are going to lose their livelihoods. That will necessarily impact on those who don't lose their livelihoods immediately.
3. We need someone to interface with management at the highest level. That person is not Terry Pullinger. He has to go. Every time he opens his mouth I am embarrassed to be associated with the CWU.
4. Having worked in many DOs the length of the country I have yet to come across a walk so arduous I considered giving up my job. I have however seen numerous people finish hours ahead of their contracted finish time. Every day.

[dooby1]

It's simple enough laggy mate.
This will only be resolved by dialogue.
It's what the best way to start that dialogue is that is the million dollar question.

And for those that say but Rico won't negotiate, if you really believe that there isn't much point in doing anything and we might as well all go to bed.

These people are utter scum with no morals or any sense of decency.

Why should we waste yet more time "talking"?

Time for talking has long gone, Sonny Jim

So what comes after strike action, Uncle Buck?

Woody, You have made it very clear you don't have the fight for a strike. The man is not for negotiating. You keep asking questions of people but what do you want? You haven't said a thing. We can see that our T&Cs are under threat, Jobs are on the line and all the time you throw your hands in the air saying "But what can we do" etc. Il tell you what we can do, Go down fighting! They were pushing through with EA and are doing it again. What do you do? Ask politely and get told no? Then what do you do? Terry is not the problem here. Rico is the problem. Who ever was in charge Rico would ignore.

Strike, Starve them of income and force them around the table. Customers will not except it and will look else where, Shareholders will s**t themselves and tell Rico to get around the table and sort this mess out. Shareholders have already been told no dividend as is, How will they feel watching their investment crumble? I think they will come to the conclusion that Rico doesn't have the workforce on side to achieve the results he and they want and will be stuck in a never ended circle of poor industrial relations. All because he is just ignoring the workforce. We know what we are happy with, It was called the 4 pillars. Before you tell me that is a piece of history. It was from 2 f***ing years ago and not fully implemented before Rico came along are tore it up.

I think we can all except that over time, with modernisation and technology the size of the work force will shrink. We want cast iron assurances that there will be no forced redundancies. We also want cast iron assurances that our jobs will not be changed so dramatically and walks made so arduous that continuing them becomes unbearable. What was the saying "Jobs for people who want them and can do them"? A very suspicious quote. It sounds like they will be looking to make the job so s**t that people will walk. Tantamount to constructive dismissal whole scale. They are doing nothing and the very opposite to relay those fears.

So what do we do? Nothing and be forced out or put up with an unbearable job who's T&C's are diminished or put up a fight.

This IMHO is the best post to date. Rico will do whatever he wants regardless and we actually have no option but to force him to the table. I‘my sick and tired of hearing “what are Dave and Terry doing?” WE ARE THE UNION. They only represent us at the top level as we wouldn’t all fit in the same room to negotiate. WE have to stand together and make a stand. We were a profitable company until Rico took over and we can be again. Rico’s parcel strategy doesn’t add up. We have to deliver to parcels to make the same profit as we do from one letter..... and this is the key line! If we cannot make profit as things currently are delivery the vast amounts of parcels that we have, then Rico has only one choice, and that is to decimate our terms and conditions. Do you want to be an owner driver pissing in Red Bull bottle with no holiday pay, no sick pay, no OT.... no nothing. That’s the impending situation, that’s what we are about to have a tear up about!!! We have to stick together and get behind the Union top brass.

[Chelseablue]

Great post dooby! Were both fed up of words, photos , gate meetings time us running out , this guy dosent give a ,, about us .We need action now to save our company.

[Woody Guthrie]

You all seem to be agreed on one thing, Rico doesn't give a s**t and won't negotiate.

So what exactly are your strike aims?

Is there anything in Rico's past history that makes you think he'll just roll over after a couple of days of strike? So how far are you willing to go and how many of the members do you think you can take with you?

Woody, You have made it very clear you don't have the fight for a strike.

No I haven't, I've actually been on strike many times and if I'm asked I'll do it again and again.

You fall into the trap of believing that you either support one position blindly or you're on the other side, I'm questioning whether we're being led by the nose into a trap. That's certainly what it looks like. Royal Mail have been dictating the terms from day one and now it appears that they've decided the time and place for a final battle by making sure all of the circumstances are in their favour.

I'll tell you what we can do, Go down fighting!

No genuine trade union member wants to "go down fighting". This isn't a game it's the financial security of over 100,000 people, people with families and mortgages and futures to think about. The plan is we don't go down at all.

Strike, Starve them of income and force them around the table. Customers will not except it and will look else where, Shareholders will s**t themselves and tell Rico to get around the table and sort this mess out

The only way you will starve them of income is a long and protracted all out strike, not a couple of days here and there which is what will happen. The problem with an all out strike is that you'll starve the workers out long before you'll starve the employer. You're right customers will not accept it, they'll go elsewhere. Shareholders will also.

If you plan for war you also have to plan for the aftermath. All I hear is empty strike rhetoric , that's not a plan it's a consequence I don't hear any ideas on what happens next.

[bucks123]

We are damned if we strike (bad in my opinion to do this during CV crisis + we will lose custom + business will lose money only delaying the inevitable) and damned if we dont (t&cs eroded over time).

I have only been with RM 3 years having worked in an office for 30. I cannot believe the way RM is run, how the union seem to so be ineffective, how managers cannot manage and how 'some' of my colleagues live in the dark ages when the world has moved on so much. I do think change is needed and, whichever way it happens, the job is not going to be the same and we either need to accept it, while ensuring we retain the best working conditions we can, or find another job. If we do not accept change we will not have a job anyway.

Personally I suspected this may be the way things would be going when I first joined RM (just because it seemed to be 20 years behind the competition and practices appeared to be so outdated). Hopefully the execs and union will talk and sort things out but I am not holding my breath.

[cpsteve]

Emergency statement from the union on facebook at five go on there