opt out of labour party on your union subs

[norbet colon]

[

I left Liebour as soon as I'd read Byers had deliberately put :lfo in to sort the CWU out .

Source?

Private Eye -HP Sauce Section, Byers wanted Leighton's Walmart Asda Union Bashing experience to split RM .Horrible New Labour politician , very much a one for privatisation.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

http://www.gnn.gov.uk/environment/fullD ... tment=True

Stephen Byers announced the appointment of Allan Leighton to the Board of the new Post Office company, Consignia, as one of five non-executive directors. The appointment will add to the skills and experience available to Consignia.

[Tman]

And, Stephen Byers announced the appointment of Allan Leighton to the Board of the new Post Office company, Consignia, as one of five non-executive directors. The appointment will add to the skills and experience available to Consignia. He will take special interest in the future development of the Post Office Network.

Hmm, hardly what was claimed.
Byers was a knob-end and Leighton's not much better, but that's a long way from the original accusation.
Any more "proof"?

[CADET86]

Already organised the forms at my office and had loads of takers.

[IWW Fellow Worker]

Already organised the forms at my office and had loads of takers.

You will do mate. They can only play the "at least we're not the Tories, they would be worse" card so many times before the working class start wondering when they're going to do something to warrant their support.

[norbet colon]

And, Stephen Byers announced the appointment of Allan Leighton to the Board of the new Post Office company, Consignia, as one of five non-executive directors. The appointment will add to the skills and experience available to Consignia. He will take special interest in the future development of the Post Office Network.

Hmm, hardly what was claimed.
Byers was a knob-end and Leighton's not much better, but that's a long way from the original accusation.
Any more "proof"?

Leighton "suddenly" becomes Chairman, there's the postal services act 2000 , the monster of the regulator , Postcom introduced , even the Union Exec who wanted more commercial freedom for RM admitted they'd been conned or duped .It all seems to fall into place very nicely , it's called political analysis .

Even so called opinion /comment or Analysis in Private Eye has to stand up in Court , Private Eye have had a few legal battles in the past .

Everytime the union complained , Nurse Ratchett or Patronizing Pat said well you actually wanted this act , typical New Lie-bour Spin . Blair actually wanted privatization which the union had to fight the tories off in the past . The architect for New Liebour "Reform of Public Services " was Mandy .New Liebour had already privatised Air Traffic Control.

What's the real problem?, is noone allowed to criticise New Labour ?

New Labour are just more devious and use different terms than the Tories . Ways & Means , the black art of the possible .

[Tman]

Leighton "suddenly" becomes Chairman, there's the postal services act 2000 , the monster of the regulator , Postcom introduced , even the Union Exec who wanted more commercial freedom for RM admitted they'd been conned or duped .

All of which haven't improved things in RM, but the statement was that Leighton was brought in to do some union-busting, which he patently hasn't done.

It all seems to fall into place very nicely , it's called political analysis .

It looks more like assimilating various facts and extrapolating to the "desired" answer.

What's the real problem?, is noone allowed to criticise New Labour ?

Criticise all you wish, but presenting opinions as facts is fatuous and ultimately futile. I can hear a million posties do that in the canteen every day.............

New Labour are just more devious and use different terms than the Tories . Ways & Means , the black art of the possible .

Oh please spare me the cliches. Anyone would think you liked the Tories. Wait a minute..................maybe you do..........???

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Criticise all you wish, but presenting opinions as facts is fatuous and ultimately futile. I can hear a million posties do that in the canteen every day.............

Sorry but I dont think anyone on here quoted it as fact the post that started this said

I left Liebour as soon as I'd read Byers had deliberately put l:lfo in to sort the CWU out .

So as far as I can see he never quoted it as fact just that is the reason why he had left Labour. My understanding is that on this forum that people may post their opinions and unless you are asking that everyone puts IMO or IMHO in every post, it is taken as such. We are a public forum for personal views and therefore we don't ask for proof on every supposition. If you want to be a member of such a forum I am afraid you wont find it here. However please do stay as we do like differing opinions as its what keeps this board as lively as it s.

[norbet colon]

Leighton has had a damm good go at union busting

So somebody who thinks Walmart is the best company in the world is going to be union friendly , yeah right , he & his senior managers spend two years turning their junior to middle management and staff against the CWU , then the next agenda is privatisation with colleague shares . Just fatuous canteen gossip though , though most of those thick posties would draw their own conclusions from those so called coincidences .it's called on the balance of probabilities .

2003 - quote Tony McCarthy -" We don't intend to sideline the CWU " which means they do . A 1.8% yes vote becomes a green light to attack reps , horror stories of dodgy fit ups , McCarthyite spying on reps as RM want to take the CWU to court . Then there's the endless union bashing propaganda 4 years later .

Leighton & Crozier are merely Brown's hit men for New Labour Public Sector "Reform ", New Labour have always had contradictory agendas , sending mixed messages out etc .

There seems to be a lot of journalists churning out fatuous & futile stuff about New Labour . So if your'e not for New Labour , your'e a Tory then , yeah right .Sounds like something a intellectual or surgical bully would use ? . No I don't like the Tories ,I 'm just old labour . Bit fatuous & facile presenting opinions as fact eh?

Labour have done part privatisation already , Air Traffic Control & London Underground , as soon as Livingstone objects , it's amazing how quickly things are railroaded through.

Plenty of other things on the horizon with the "third way " , that's neither one thing or the other , the problem is New Labour tends to fall on it's own contradictions .

That third way might have been ARGUEABLY a good idea to neutralize the Tories orginally and keep Basildon Man /Middle England /The Mail & Sun onside, but that project seems to be bankrupt and it's run out of steam .B-Liar was "ok " orginally, to get the Tories out after 18 years but he went well past his sell by date and War turned out to be his Waterloo.

there was so many wasted opportunities in the first four years , muddleheadness and spats between Prescott, Brown & B-liar .

If the alternatives are unelectable , no wonder there's such a low turnout in Elections , we've to "move on " with Britain's special relationship or being a poodle for a neo-con US government .

Now you can't get a cigarette paper between the three parties .

So noone is allowed to bash New Labour it'd seem ?

There's the little matter of a lot of truth in cliches unfortunately.

[Tman]

Sorry but I dont think anyone on here quoted it as fact the post that started this said

I left Liebour as soon as I'd read Byers had deliberately put l:lfo in to sort the CWU out .

So as far as I can see he never quoted it as fact just that is the reason why he had left Labour. My understanding is that on this forum that people may post their opinions and unless you are asking that everyone puts IMO or IMHO in every post, it is taken as such.

A statement was made, and a link posted. It didn't add up for me so I asked for more proof. As you say, it turns out it was no more than someone's opinion. So be it.

However please do stay as we do like differing opinions as its what keeps this board as lively as it s.[/quote

]

I'm glad you said that. If everyone thought the same, these forums would be pointless.

[Tman]

.

So if your'e not for New Labour , your'e a Tory then , yeah right .Sounds like something a intellectual or surgical bully would use ? . No I don't like the Tories , just old labour . way

" .


For better or worse, that's the choices we have; New Labour or Tory.
Old Labour no longer exists, they've passed into history along with the Liberals, SDP, the Whigs, and for all the good they do (or ever did) , the SWP and BCP may as well join them.
History. Unelectable. Move on.

So noone is allowed to criticise New Labour it'd seem ]

You've done that one already.

BTW what's a "surgical bully"?

[norbet colon]

.

So if your'e not for New Labour , you're a Tory then , yeah right .Sounds like something a intellectual or surgical bully would use ? . No I don't like the Tories , just old labour . way

" .


For better or worse, that's the choices we have; New Labour or Tory.
Old Labour no longer exists, they've passed into history along with the Liberals, SDP, the Whigs, and for all the good they do (or ever did) , the SWP and BCP may as well join them.
History. Unelectable. Move on.

So noone is allowed to criticise New Labour it'd seem ]

You've done that one already

I did that one again as we've to apparently to accept this mush in the middle and lie down and accept Blairisim as there's no alternative , it doesn't matter that these privatised utilities and the railways don't happen to work very well, take up more public subsidy than before and it's ok for these fat cat executive managers to draw obscene salaries and ruin things like Leighton & Crozier . The market is not a pancea for all the ills and it's Ok for Gordon to adjorcate his responsibilities to the likes of Postcomm .

That's what New Labour are proposing along with PFI which will bankrupt this country , tinkering at the margins of previous Tory policies like splitting the NHS into 404 parts . But we've to move on and accept it as the alternatives are unelectable , yeah right !

can't think why there's so much apparent cynicisim and mistrust about politicians ?

As for Old Labour apparently not existing , there's the little matter of Early Day Motions scuppering B-liar's plans , splits in the party , even Two Shags wasn't exactly a fan of the Train operating companies . At constituency/ local government level & branch level there's ailenation from the Parlimentary Party and/or the millbank machine.

What's really happened is instead of Bennites & the militant tendancy taking over the party ,you've Blairites , look at the background of them , Mandy & Reid ex CPGB , former Trots , their policies have gone to the right but you've still got the same mindset & mentality . That mentality is what's ruining the party and the country due to their sheer bloody-mindedness.

Unfortunately whoever you vote for , the government gets in .

I'm sick of this thread , it's like conversing with Alaistair Campbell or Ed Balls . I thought the CWU went on strike to protect public services, nothing to do with a yes vote is it ?

This is a forum with opinions , It's not Uni when you've to write essays for the Politics Tutor which have to be backed up with proof & sources .Jonathon Dimbleby isn't moderating this forum .

Definition of a surgical bully -thought the word surgical would be self explanatory

[Tman]

[
I'm sick of this thread , it's like conversing with Alaistair Campbell or Ed Balls .

It's a forum for debate; if you don't like debate then why bother?

I thought the CWU went on strike to protect public services, nothing to do with a yes vote is it ?

I never went on strike to protect public services or anything else.

This is a forum with opinions , It's not Uni when you've to write essays for the Politics Tutor which have to be backed up with proof & sources .Jonathon Dimbleby isn't moderating this forum .

True enough, but if statements are made, wouldn't it be nice if there was an element of logic or sense to back them up? In fact, wouldn't the whole thing be pointless otherwise?

Definition of a surgical bully -thought the word surgical would be self explanatory

[/quote]
Indeed it is, as is "bully", but putting the two together, they mean what..........?

[norbet colon]

[
I'm sick of this thread , it's like conversing with Alaistair Campbell or Ed Balls .

It's a forum for debate; if you don't like debate then why bother?

I think that would obviously mean too New Labour and sounding very much like them, you can't debate unless it's pro new labour , that's not debate it's turning everything into a arguement , typical RM standard responses and tactics , clever sophistry, but not clever enough .

I thought the CWU went on strike to protect public services, nothing to do with a yes vote is it ?

you

I never went on strike to protect public services or anything else.That's a typical politican's answer or RM non answer to extracite yourself from a corner or sidestep things


[quote]This is a forum with opinions , It's not Uni when you've to write essays for the Politics Tutor which have to be backed up with proof & sources .Jonathon Dimbleby isn't moderating this forum .

True enough, but if statements are made, wouldn't it be nice if there was an element of logic or sense to back them up? In fact, wouldn't the whole thing be pointless otherwise?


No it's because you can't take any criticism of New Labour , too dogmatic ;so you clutch at straws & twist everything and make issues of things that wern't there in the first place to try and cover for that .My views on New Liebour are pretty common ones as expressed by a lot of people on here and in the media ., that according to you, lack logic and sense . It's a bit arrogant DEMANDING sources ?, seems a bit like smug self righteous SA & SJV or SLH on PostmanShat ? . Going for something vague & obscure & making too much of it is a RM tactic ?

If you can't hack New Labour being bashed , find a more right wing forum. I'll bash New Labour and I'm dammed if I have to justify myself .

Definition of a surgical bully -thought the word surgical would be self explanatory[/quote]

Indeed it is, as is "bully", but putting the two together, they mean what..........?[/quote]

You are nothing but a intellectual snob that thinks yourself as better than everybody else for a start ., that's pretty obvious before we get to verbal bully . Can you do any better than nit picking .

, it's like dealing with the other political extremes left & right , I think you'll be dissapointed with the amount of New Liebour bashing on this site , what are you going to do start picking arguements with everybody else and use the same tactics . Do me a favour , i've no time for this nonsense .

thank god I left Labour ., are you sure your'e not a screw masquarading as staff ? because as Belai says you've all the required attributes ,it's hardly the first time it's happened and typical RM tactics .

[BELIAL]

Mr T does seem a little over endowed in the smug self satisfaction department. Makes up for the people skills shortfall maybe