Royal Mail are back on the narrative of working all hours paid and want to use PDAs and other new technology to do resourcing and revisions. The union must oppose this move!

[tommyrep]

If RM no longer want to do Posties a favour in letting them leave early, then surely Posties won't do RM favours such as working through their breaks and working past their contracted hours for free.

Exactly that happened in my office and overtime only done after contracted time. The resulting mess in the office with overtime not covered and people coming back bang on time so unable to do anymore work in non existent spare time meant it lasted less than a week. Would probably be different now though because all vacancies are filled and there's hardly any overtime to cover

Is that such a bad thing? Vacancies being filled,that is a good thing surely. A fully staffed office should be the norm.
Overtime, by its very wording is exactly that. Ghost OT is hard to justify, although it happens to dig managers out the crap.
OK, I get the overtime loss that people often need, but that is a problem that contributes to having staff over a barrel too!
Working overtime - or needing to and depending on overtime, is a false dawn and could/can and is withdrawn at a whim to maintain pressure on a workforce. I totally accept and sympathise with young people on poor contracts only trying to get on in life, sorry but being reliant on OT is never the answer. Politically, good well paid FT work is hard problem to solve.

[citypostie]

If RM no longer want to do Posties a favour in letting them leave early, then surely Posties won't do RM favours such as working through their breaks and working past their contracted hours for free.

Exactly that happened in my office and overtime only done after contracted time. The resulting mess in the office with overtime not covered and people coming back bang on time so unable to do anymore work in non existent spare time meant it lasted less than a week. Would probably be different now though because all vacancies are filled and there's hardly any overtime to cover

Is that such a bad thing? Vacancies being filled,that is a good thing surely. A fully staffed office should be the norm.
Overtime, by its very wording is exactly that. Ghost OT is hard to justify, although it happens to dig managers out the crap.
OK, I get the overtime loss that people often need, but that is a problem that contributes to having staff over a barrel too!
Working overtime - or needing to and depending on overtime, is a false dawn and could/can and is withdrawn at a whim to maintain pressure on a workforce. I totally accept and sympathise with young people on poor contracts only trying to get on in life, sorry but being reliant on OT is never the answer. Politically, good well paid FT work is hard problem to solve.

Not saying its a bad thing at all. It's nice not being asked daily to do overtime. Some people aren't happy because they don't get to work days off anymore but personally it doesn't bother me. Also I have no problem working leisurely upto my time but don't get upset if others want to rush round to go home early or get some ghost in the bank if it's on offer because I know they've done the same work or if they've done overtime more than me just quicker because the rounds in my office apart from a couple of firms deliveries(that senior non rushing/overtime types do) are about equal, the big difference in finishing times being down to the people doing them. Hence my comment that if these outdoor standards are brought in and real time monitoring happens the ones who will moan the most will be the same ones who have called for them to be used in my office

[postslippete]

If RM no longer want to do Posties a favour in letting them leave early, then surely Posties won't do RM favours such as working through their breaks and working past their contracted hours for free.

Exactly that happened in my office and overtime only done after contracted time. The resulting mess in the office with overtime not covered and people coming back bang on time so unable to do anymore work in non existent spare time meant it lasted less than a week. Would probably be different now though because all vacancies are filled and there's hardly any overtime to cover

Is that such a bad thing? Vacancies being filled,that is a good thing surely. A fully staffed office should be the norm.
Overtime, by its very wording is exactly that. Ghost OT is hard to justify, although it happens to dig managers out the crap.
OK, I get the overtime loss that people often need, but that is a problem that contributes to having staff over a barrel too!
Working overtime - or needing to and depending on overtime, is a false dawn and could/can and is withdrawn at a whim to maintain pressure on a workforce. I totally accept and sympathise with young people on poor contracts only trying to get on in life, sorry but being reliant on OT is never the answer. Politically, good well paid FT work is hard problem to solve.

Not saying its a bad thing at all. It's nice not being asked daily to do overtime. Some people aren't happy because they don't get to work days off anymore but personally it doesn't bother me. Also I have no problem working leisurely upto my time but don't get upset if others want to rush round to go home early or get some ghost in the bank if it's on offer because I know they've done the same work or if they've done overtime more than me just quicker because the rounds in my office apart from a couple of firms deliveries(that senior non rushing/overtime types do) are about equal, the big difference in finishing times being down to the people doing them. Hence my comment that if these outdoor standards are brought in and real time monitoring happens the ones who will moan the most will be the same ones who have called for them to be used in my office

The guys who often 'dig managers out the crap' at our place are often the same ones who come in earlier; so in effect they are the ones that do 'ghost overtime' by finishing at 2.30pm whilst also claiming additional overtime for doing an extra loop or so on someone else's delivery! Ironically though, its like Woody said, because they have been working in the office over an hour before anyone else off their own bat, they have somehow justified that the hours have been worked. What happens when Royal Mail refuse to acknowledge this could lead to additional absorption and bigger deliveries. But we have been down this avenue before and all it brings is its own problems when staff knowing this suddenly decide to come in on time, work their hours and cut off as per procedure. I see it when managers suddenly decide to lapse a duty. You get some guys who have flown round all week and when lapsing gets introduced you see them in the canteen or taking their time before going out on delivery so they haven't got time to lapse. What I'm saying is its one thing to use PDAs to resource and do revisions....but its quite another to enforce without problems.

[number one]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

[norris9]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

[number one]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

[Ren Hoëk]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

and if they are not? People have given you plenty reason as to why these people make life hard for others and the implications it DOES have as to why other people should be concerned about what they are doing. It's as infuriating as it is selfish.

[tommyrep]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

So, is that their allocated work that takes them up to their true finish time? Don’t assume that somehow!
Some are happy to be on the street until the cows come home claiming that as overtime. Some others will try and use any shortcut, doing “anything” possible in the process to condense that work into as near normal duty time, while getting paid extra for those discrepancies, that RM should be stopping and not encouraging.
This term “Ghost” overtime does get banded around a lot on here. I have seen people being asked to do say half a walk on OT. In the past the they agreed the “terms “ with the DOM and were happy to do it, now with all OT on the meter managers struggle to get any takers. Fair cop to anyone doing or wishing to do overtime it is their choice, it’s their time and deserve what they can get. Your point on managers V posties, in my experience there is the same disgruntled people in the DO as on this forum. Out of the office they can vent their true feelings on these pages, in the DO there are many more who are not very vocal, but will mumble away under their breath, wanting others to fire the guns they load!
The strange thing, I find, on this forum is that the same moans or complaints are on subjects that have the same vibe!
You and Woody do the same in constantly sticking up for the very same people posters criticise.
It does get very boring and I agree with you on that. Beggars the question though, it would appear RM operate the same sort of management style nationwide- to intimidate! It also beggars the bigger question of WHY the Union do not act on that intimidation in protecting* it’s members. It is by design, to intimidate people who claim OT for example because of the corrupt bonus system they operate for managers. There are problems created by posties on themselves and each other, but there are MANY who roll over and accept that there will be even more intimidation by managers on them if they do claim OT or not go in early etc. It is far less hassle and decide to capitulate for a quieter time rather than stick up for themselves- my own view on this the Union are as culpable on this matter as management are.

[number one]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

and if they are not? People have given you plenty reason as to why these people make life hard for others and the implications it DOES have as to why other people should be concerned about what they are doing. It's as infuriating as it is selfish.

No they haven’t, if people work well together at a high standard then there isn’t a problem. The problems arise when people are trusted outside of the office, with no managers watching them to get on with their job. Too many people see that as an opportunity to deliberately go slow, have a sneaky break here and there and so on. If they do bring a delivery standard in these people will be crying but I certainly won’t be as me and my partner would more than likely be working above it anyway. We crack on with our duty and hammer the overtime.

[Ren Hoëk]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

and if they are not? People have given you plenty reason as to why these people make life hard for others and the implications it DOES have as to why other people should be concerned about what they are doing. It's as infuriating as it is selfish.

No they haven’t, if people work well together at a high standard then there isn’t a problem. The problems arise when people are trusted outside of the office, with no managers watching them to get on with their job. Too many people see that as an opportunity to deliberately go slow, have a sneaky break here and there and so on. If they do bring a delivery standard in these people will be crying but I certainly won’t be as me and my partner would more than likely be working above it anyway. We crack on with our duty and hammer the overtime.

Im pretty sure "work well together" actually means works how you want them to and you have been perfectly clear that if they arnt running around like yourself then they must be lazy work shy Barstards.

Im alright jack? right?

We had a guy just like you recently retire. He genuinely thought people loved him. His customers and colleagues. He was unanimously hated by both.

[tommyrep]

REN Hoëk
I think your description is obvious to all the readers of this forum.
Selfish! and bricking it that any changes will upset their apple cart, or just another wind up merchant?
I can just imagine how anyone paired up with him would really feel? The prospect of him loosing out on OT?
And I am like a stuck record on the topic of intimidation from MANAGEMENT !!!! too, but your right no one likes a ....
Gee, the arrogance is astounding. Age will and illness may ensue sooner or later and his place on the scrap heap awaits.

[number one]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

and if they are not? People have given you plenty reason as to why these people make life hard for others and the implications it DOES have as to why other people should be concerned about what they are doing. It's as infuriating as it is selfish.

No they haven’t, if people work well together at a high standard then there isn’t a problem. The problems arise when people are trusted outside of the office, with no managers watching them to get on with their job. Too many people see that as an opportunity to deliberately go slow, have a sneaky break here and there and so on. If they do bring a delivery standard in these people will be crying but I certainly won’t be as me and my partner would more than likely be working above it anyway. We crack on with our duty and hammer the overtime.

Im pretty sure "work well together" actually means works how you want them to and you have been perfectly clear that if they arnt running around like yourself then they must be lazy work shy Barstards.

Im alright jack? right?

We had a guy just like you recently retire. He genuinely thought people loved him. His customers and colleagues. He was unanimously hated by both.

It’s funny how you just make things up and presume things just so it fits your own personal opinion. For 20 years I’ve heard how things are going to stop or change. Every time RM introduce something new people on here laugh at how ghosting and overtime will stop when the truth is I’m earning more now than I ever have

[Ren Hoëk]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

and if they are not? People have given you plenty reason as to why these people make life hard for others and the implications it DOES have as to why other people should be concerned about what they are doing. It's as infuriating as it is selfish.

No they haven’t, if people work well together at a high standard then there isn’t a problem. The problems arise when people are trusted outside of the office, with no managers watching them to get on with their job. Too many people see that as an opportunity to deliberately go slow, have a sneaky break here and there and so on. If they do bring a delivery standard in these people will be crying but I certainly won’t be as me and my partner would more than likely be working above it anyway. We crack on with our duty and hammer the overtime.

Im pretty sure "work well together" actually means works how you want them to and you have been perfectly clear that if they arnt running around like yourself then they must be lazy work shy Barstards.

Im alright jack? right?

We had a guy just like you recently retire. He genuinely thought people loved him. His customers and colleagues. He was unanimously hated by both.

It’s funny how you just make things up and presume things just so it fits your own personal opinion. For 20 years I’ve heard how things are going to stop or change. Every time RM introduce something new people on here laugh at how ghosting and overtime will stop when the truth is I’m earning more now than I ever have

Oh mate, Im not making that up. You aren't deluding yourself into thinking your colleagues enjoy working with you?

Also, What am I presuming? You've have made it clear what you think. You have typed it up, with those fingers of yours and posted it to this forum.

if people work well together at a high standard then there isn’t a problem. The problems arise when people are trusted outside of the office, with no managers watching them to get on with their job. Too many people see that as an opportunity to deliberately go slow, have a sneaky break here and there and so on.

With my magic powers of READING COMPREHENSION I know exactly what you are saying.

[Ren Hoëk]

REN Hoëk
I think your description is obvious to all the readers of this forum.
Selfish! and bricking it that any changes will upset their apple cart, or just another wind up merchant?
I can just imagine how anyone paired up with him would really feel? The prospect of him loosing out on OT?
And I am like a stuck record on the topic of intimidation from MANAGEMENT !!!! too, but your right no one likes a ....
Gee, the arrogance is astounding. Age will and illness may ensue sooner or later and his place on the scrap heap awaits.

I have considered he's just trolling. Which would be sad in of itself. But, It's also totally believable that someone like this exist's within the company. I bet he thinks that when he goes his office will go down the pan. When in reality he wont be missed one iota! People probably dread having to work with him. He's made it perfectly clear what he thinks of people that don't meet his "standards".

[aiden01]

So many maybe, might do, could do’s, will do’s in this thread. It’s funny that people are totally obsessed with other people doing ghost overtime. If somebody is willing to do more work why shouldn’t they be paid for it? They have done their allocated work quickly so they can do some more. Never mind the battle between manager and posties, people in here want to constantly fight there own work colleagues.

I'll give one good reason why....

If they are in a van share they push the other Postie to the limit, make the other Postie rush about like their little beeeatcchhh just so they can selfishly get back and earn double pay.

Not if they are both as quick as each other

and if they are not? People have given you plenty reason as to why these people make life hard for others and the implications it DOES have as to why other people should be concerned about what they are doing. It's as infuriating as it is selfish.

No they haven’t, if people work well together at a high standard then there isn’t a problem. The problems arise when people are trusted outside of the office, with no managers watching them to get on with their job. Too many people see that as an opportunity to deliberately go slow, have a sneaky break here and there and so on. If they do bring a delivery standard in these people will be crying but I certainly won’t be as me and my partner would more than likely be working above it anyway. We crack on with our duty and hammer the overtime.

Im pretty sure "work well together" actually means works how you want them to and you have been perfectly clear that if they arnt running around like yourself then they must be lazy work shy Barstards.

Im alright jack? right?

We had a guy just like you recently retire. He genuinely thought people loved him. His customers and colleagues. He was unanimously hated by both.

It’s funny how you just make things up and presume things just so it fits your own personal opinion. For 20 years I’ve heard how things are going to stop or change. Every time RM introduce something new people on here laugh at how ghosting and overtime will stop when the truth is I’m earning more now than I ever have

Still waiting to see your payslip that you earned in excess of 40 grand last year. Which you promised you would do on this forum.