citypostie wrote:To avoid this I'm assuming everyone will have their breaks round about the middle of the working day.
Which is fine unless you happen to be on a trolley job in a modern housing estate in the freezing rain when the very last thing any sensible person will wish to do is to stop for 20 minutes, let alone 40 minutes.
It's no good saying 'well provision should be made'. Yes, it should be. But it patently is not, largely because only a handful of jobs - relatively speaking - are so affected and there is in fact no real solution beyond taking 20 mins before you go out and the other 20 mins at the end of duty.
citypostie wrote:To avoid this I'm assuming everyone will have their breaks round about the middle of the working day.
Which is fine unless you happen to be on a trolley job in a modern housing estate in the freezing rain when the very last thing any sensible person will wish to do is to stop for 20 minutes, let alone 40 minutes.
It's no good saying 'well provision should be made'. Yes, it should be. But it patently is not, largely because only a handful of jobs - relatively speaking - are so affected and there is in fact no real solution beyond taking 20 mins before you go out and the other 20 mins at the end of duty.
j1mmyc wrote:Clocking in and out won't make a difference to people doing overtime, everyone thought it would be the end of ghosting etc when the pda actuals were brought in but that lasted all of a day, all clocking in and out will do is make people drag there feet and not do overtime, then the dom will turn a blind eye then it's back to square one
When PDA actuals came in there was not going to be an immediate transformation. Information needed to be harvested for a period of time six months or so for it to be acted upon. The idea of dragging your heels for an hour or so on a light day won't be tolerated when there is a comparison for the duty holders regular performance, which has been harvested during the first six month period of PDA actuals operating. The OP will be disciplined for performance issues......
not sure how realistic this, as you say it all goes out of the window when a few go sick and the DOM needs a few favours........
citypostie wrote:To avoid this I'm assuming everyone will have their breaks round about the middle of the working day.
Which is fine unless you happen to be on a trolley job in a modern housing estate in the freezing rain when the very last thing any sensible person will wish to do is to stop for 20 minutes, let alone 40 minutes.
It's no good saying 'well provision should be made'. Yes, it should be. But it patently is not, largely because only a handful of jobs - relatively speaking - are so affected and there is in fact no real solution beyond taking 20 mins before you go out and the other 20 mins at the end of duty.
mattycash wrote:There's me thinking "Working Time Learning" I thought these where scrapped 6 months ago? We no longer have them in our office of 160?
Not heard of them being scrapped (but we've not had one for ages either).
If you've not had one for 6 months that's 160 x 30 mins for lets say 22 weeks (disregarding Xmas) is 22 x 80 hrs = 1760 free hours used for delivery!!!
Kerching, kerching!! went the DOM's bonus!!
mattycash wrote:There's me thinking "Working Time Learning" I thought these where scrapped 6 months ago? We no longer have them in our office of 160?
Your allocated 30 mins every week on a Tuesday for WTLL, where you’re supposed to watch an RMTV video. It’s built into the duty time, but managers ignore it so we have time for the lapsing instead
Duesouth wrote:I think these are trials on how to reduce the working week to 35hrs. Not sure where these trials are being held but the rumour has it that sequence mail would not be put in the frame but would be taken out with you in the van then you would have two bundles back to back. One being the sequenced mail and the other manual.
If this is the case expect more cuts and more problems for us. I can't see how this would work as sorting mail in the back of the van on a windy day is going to be a nightmare. Lapsing duties will be interesting as everyone will be flicking through mail. Chaos springs to mind.
These trials have been a disaster by all accounts so I doubt it. Many of the fittings at our place don't run anyway as they're still done to park and loop, which virtually nobody does at our place. I can only begin to imagine the amount of mis sorts coming back daily and the amount of re-direction failures that would suddenly start happening.
I quite get the theory behind the idea, to a suit in an office somewhere the thought of sorting mail that you're just going to pull out in that order anyway seems like a total waste of time but like many theories it doesn't work in practice.
Its almost embarrassing watching that video, the amount of time and money wasted on what is clearly a terrible idea, no doubt from someone who has never done the job.
citypostie wrote:To avoid this I'm assuming everyone will have their breaks round about the middle of the working day.
Which is fine unless you happen to be on a trolley job in a modern housing estate in the freezing rain when the very last thing any sensible person will wish to do is to stop for 20 minutes, let alone 40 minutes.
It's no good saying 'well provision should be made'. Yes, it should be. But it patently is not, largely because only a handful of jobs - relatively speaking - are so affected and there is in fact no real solution beyond taking 20 mins before you go out and the other 20 mins at the end of duty.
steve1873 wrote:
Ehm...... Have your full 40 before you go out!
So then what if you are a part timer working 5 hours? Your duty is 'arrive, tie up, deliver.' When do you take your break on an HCT job then? 30 minutes after arrival in the office is unreasonable. When the wether's half decent then taking the break half way through is fine. When it's thoroughly unpleasant, not so much . . .
Yes, this is not a common case. But it's not unique either and trite answers don't solve it.
steve1873 wrote:
Ehm...... Have your full 40 before you go out!
So then what if you are a part timer working 5 hours? Your duty is 'arrive, tie up, deliver.' When do you take your break on an HCT job then? 30 minutes after arrival in the office is unreasonable. When the wether's half decent then taking the break half way through is fine. When it's thoroughly unpleasant, not so much . . .
Yes, this is not a common case. But it's not unique either and trite answers don't solve it.
Why not? It isn't ideal clearly, but you are indoors for 30 minutes longer meaning you are out of the elements for that 30 minutes. How is it trite to make the suggestion as to taking all the break prior to departure? It is what I do. It is what thousands of us up and down the country do.
What exactly is the alternative? Don't have a break at all, come back half an hour early and then have an additional 30 minutes work given to you as a result of the PDA actuals flagging up the "early" finish?
j1mmyc wrote:Clocking in and out won't make a difference to people doing overtime, everyone thought it would be the end of ghosting etc when the pda actuals were brought in but that lasted all of a day, all clocking in and out will do is make people drag there feet and not do overtime, then the dom will turn a blind eye then it's back to square one
When PDA actuals came in there was not going to be an immediate transformation. Information needed to be harvested for a period of time six months or so for it to be acted upon. The idea of dragging your heels for an hour or so on a light day won't be tolerated when there is a comparison for the duty holders regular performance, which has been harvested during the first six month period of PDA actuals operating. The OP will be disciplined for performance issues......
not sure how realistic this, as you say it all goes out of the window when a few go sick and the DOM needs a few favours........
So will that work the other way? Duty holders always hours over but then when they are off the cover people can complete it with plenty of spare time, so do the duty holders get pulled in for performance issues when their performance is compared to people who don't have a vested interest in making the duty too big so they don't have to do lapse or can claim lots of overtime
citypostie wrote:To avoid this I'm assuming everyone will have their breaks round about the middle of the working day.
Which is fine unless you happen to be on a trolley job in a modern housing estate in the freezing rain when the very last thing any sensible person will wish to do is to stop for 20 minutes, let alone 40 minutes.
It's no good saying 'well provision should be made'. Yes, it should be. But it patently is not, largely because only a handful of jobs - relatively speaking - are so affected and there is in fact no real solution beyond taking 20 mins before you go out and the other 20 mins at the end of duty.
Don't know how many people at your DO do that but if there's enough, then that's potentially a whole walk that could get taken out, as for higher-up it'll look like many of you are making time
