Management

[Marshamp11]

If you work over your time and don't get paid for it you must be an idiot.

Absolutely. Very confused, so you people seem to be happy to not get paid for working. So you work for free when it’s heavy. Why?

I would also argue that if you are not on the payroll after your finishing time then technically you may be not insured.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

If you work over your time and don't get paid for it you must be an idiot.

Absolutely. Very confused, so you people seem to be happy to not get paid for working. So you work for free when it’s heavy. Why?

I would also argue that if you are not on the payroll after your finishing time then technically you may be not insured.

That's a common misconception - Royal Mail's employer liability insurance covers the place of work, not the hours of work so if you had an accident on the premises outside your working hours you would still be covered by their insurance however any payout would normally be subject to a negotiation process where a level of "blame" will be set and the fact that you should not have been on the premises would be used against you to reduce any personal injury compensation.

[Marshamp11]

If you work over your time and don't get paid for it you must be an idiot.

Absolutely. Very confused, so you people seem to be happy to not get paid for working. So you work for free when it’s heavy. Why?

I would also argue that if you are not on the payroll after your finishing time then technically you may be not insured.

That's a common misconception - Royal Mail's employer liability insurance covers the place of work, not the hours of work so if you had an accident on the premises outside your working hours you would still be covered by their insurance however any payout would normally be subject to a negotiation process where a level of "blame" will be set and the fact that you should not have been on the premises would be used against you to reduce any personal injury compensation.

What if the accident occurred off of RM premises but on delivery in the street. I am sure they would play the you should have cut off card.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

If you work over your time and don't get paid for it you must be an idiot.

Absolutely. Very confused, so you people seem to be happy to not get paid for working. So you work for free when it’s heavy. Why?

I would also argue that if you are not on the payroll after your finishing time then technically you may be not insured.

That's a common misconception - Royal Mail's employer liability insurance covers the place of work, not the hours of work so if you had an accident on the premises outside your working hours you would still be covered by their insurance however any payout would normally be subject to a negotiation process where a level of "blame" will be set and the fact that you should not have been on the premises would be used against you to reduce any personal injury compensation.

What if the accident occurred off of RM premises but on delivery in the street. I am sure they would play the you should have cut off card.

The street is our place of work so we are covered.

I don't think people should work for free, be that coming early or not claiming overtime, however, it's still better to give people all the information even if it goes against what you are advocating.

[crimson king]

The street is our place of work

That makes us sound badass!

Or like prostitutes...

[postslippete]

The DOM in our DO is the best one we have ever had in the nearly twenty years I have worked there. We do have an emphasis on holding on to full time duties though which has resulted in our walks being longer than in most other DOs. We also as a general rule cannot book overtime/extended delivery except during the two or three weeks leading up to Xmas. The overtime we book then does not always cover all the time we have worked. So I understand where the OP is coming from.
When we have cover DOMs in they don't like the way we run the office and they tend to want to follow all the rules especially where it could be seen that RM is losing out financially. I do get the feeling though that if it were to go the other way and overtime/extended needed to be paid that they would be so keen to sign that off.
In short the union and RM both know what is going on and are willing to let it continue.

Every office seems to be different. Our office basically runs on overtime and extended delivery!! Now and again they try stopping staff working their day off but then find themselves snookered when someone is on sick leave and there is a duty to cover

[steve1873]

Do not work past your time and expect to be paid with a manager like this. Quite simply at the soonest opportunity it becomes apparent you are going to be going over, whether that is prior to leaving office, or on delivery, then contact the manager and ask him what he would like to you to do? If he doesn't want to authorise overtime (assuming you are happy to work the OT in first place) then inform him that you will then have to return to the office, or leave some of the delivery in office in order that you finish on your time as you will don't come to work to work for free. Royal Mail is not a charity!

[Marshamp11]

If you work over your time and don't get paid for it you must be an idiot.

Absolutely. Very confused, so you people seem to be happy to not get paid for working. So you work for free when it’s heavy. Why?

I would also argue that if you are not on the payroll after your finishing time then technically you may be not insured.

That's a common misconception - Royal Mail's employer liability insurance covers the place of work, not the hours of work so if you had an accident on the premises outside your working hours you would still be covered by their insurance however any payout would normally be subject to a negotiation process where a level of "blame" will be set and the fact that you should not have been on the premises would be used against you to reduce any personal injury compensation.

What if the accident occurred off of RM premises but on delivery in the street. I am sure they would play the you should have cut off card.

The street is our place of work so we are covered.

I don't think people should work for free, be that coming early or not claiming overtime, however, it's still better to give people all the information even if it goes against what you are advocating.

I certainly wouldn't advocate working for free. I personally always book for any time I go over even if it is only 10 minutes.

[Brandy]

I think most posties on this thread must have decent or half decent managers,not like what I had. Most times when I was likely to go over and told the DOM or lino,all I got was grief,why cant you complete,others can do it,why cant you? You are not up to the job anymore etc etc,and if I wouldnt or couldnt take my absorbing well the dummy got spat out.I was made to feel useless.On the very rare occasions that they did say they would pay me extended,I nearly fell over with shock,but then when I got back from delivery,and went to sign the overtime sheet,my time was either docked or my name missed off completely,and it wasnt just me this happened to. In our office as well,it seemed to be the older posties they picked on,I suppose they wanted to grind them down,so eventually they would leave and then be left with a younger workforce,experience and loyalty counted for nothing. Ok I know some on here are saying if they dont pay you dont do it,but when you are threatened with all sorts,fed up of the constant arguing and made to feel a failure you just get on and do it.
Oh well, I was lucky I was able to walk away,and dont have to put up with this s**t anymore,but from a job I loved for so many years,and still loved when I left,I just really hated,still do and perhaps always will hate the way I was treated by RM management.

[HTPostman]

Appreciate every office is different but since I returned to Royal Mail my rule is very clear: I'll work OT but want paying for every single minute of it. The day they don't pay me OT and mess me about (other than a genuine admin error) is the day I'll simply work my 5 hours a day until it's put right.

To be fair I've been paid for all my OT so far, I've heard it said by a few of the full timers in our office that we have 10 staff on sick or light duties, that's about 10% of the workforce here so they rely on overtime etc. Plus there's not a single duty that can be done here in my basic 5 hours a day.

On another note I can't believe how many of my fellow 25 hour a week colleagues are going in early unpaid and some don't even check they are being paid for overtime and working days off. I had one guy telling me as we walked in on Saturday he starts before his time so he can finish early. I asked him what if he doesn't finish early, he just shrugged and said that's the risk he takes. Absolutely ridiculous. Just start on time, and if you go over, book it, and if it's not paid don't do any more. It's simples.

[Postie45]

Most times when I was likely to go over and told the DOM or lino,all I got was grief,why cant you complete,others can do it,why cant you? You are not up to the job anymore etc etc,and if I wouldnt or couldnt take my absorbing well the dummy got spat out.I was made to feel useless.

This is clear b&h if anyone else goes through this see your union rep and file a grievance.

[Brandy]

Most times when I was likely to go over and told the DOM or lino,all I got was grief,why cant you complete,others can do it,why cant you? You are not up to the job anymore etc etc,and if I wouldnt or couldnt take my absorbing well the dummy got spat out.I was made to feel useless.

This is clear b&h if anyone else goes through this see your union rep and file a grievance.

Yes I know it was,but nothing was ever done at our office,I just hope it has been stopped now,but somehow I doubt it.

[hothothot]

I enjoyed the job for many many years , but I would say probably the last 5 years were the worst , management persistently bully and harass staff on a daily basis. Management have ruined a great job I used to really enjoy. I left RM 6 months ago , I can honestly say I don't miss the job one bit , no more stress , bullying , harassment etc. When I left I hated the job , I feel sorry for all my colleagues still in the job. Best wishes for Xmas.

[dtyssmshdchrb]

I've worked in a few offices now over the past 15 years, seen good and bad managers as well as well running offices and poorly run ones.

My current office and manager, however, is the worst I've experienced in any job. So many people on here are asking why people are working for nothing and it's a valid question, one I ask myself daily. In this office though, absolutely every step has been taken over the years so that everyone and I mean every single postie is taken advantage of and ends up working for nothing.

The overtime sheet? Never seen it, never signed it, we don't get to. Every single person come in before their time, the manager has long said he doesn't mind if people come in early to get an earlier finish. However, with 24, 30 and 38 hour contracts all the finish times are different. In the summer from time to time you'll get a super early finish and it's great, the rest of the year though you're over time or you're on time... but you worked your breaks. Ask about claiming for overtime or cutting off and you either get told it'll be quiet tomorrow, you'll get the time back. Have a busy Thursday and you'll get told you finished early on Tuesday, which you probably didn't because you worked through your breaks and cut a million corners.

I know we don't bank hours, I know all the procedures for cutting off and I know all my rights. Yet, in this office, the culture is one of just... working for nothing, all the f***ing time! 24hr contracts get paid an extra hour a day to come in early... so they come in even earlier than an hour before their start time. The duties are all too big yet lapsing is compulsory, nobody dares to cut off. We're short staffed and occasionally have to cover even more as a "favour"... nobody gets paid extra. You get grief if you try to do anything by the book. Everyone has grumbles about it but nobody dares to change how it is. Despite knowing all this, I find myself buckling to conform to the way the rest of the office choose to do things too.

It doesn't help that there is no union representation in the office. Our rep seems to be one in name only. I haven't heard a single communication from the union in this office ever. I'm thinking I need to address these problems by going to a regional rep and seeing what they can do. As it stands, our entire staff are being exploited, bullied and are too far gone to seem to want to change things.

Grim.

[danterossetti]

What a sorry post. you need support from the branch urgently.