LTB 688/17 - Executive Summary Update on Talks with Royal Mail Group

[TrueBlueTerrier]

so if the second wave of mail is regularly coming in at 7.30am, why on earth should we be working 9 till 5pm?? Surely thats what the investment in automation is for1 - to speed up the process of getting posties out on delivery, not slow it down!!

No - automation is to do away with wages, holidays, sick pay and pensions.
You have also not understood that there won't be a "second" wave under their plans.

I don't understand this obsession with 3 bundles.
If they do what they propose - you will still only have 1 bundle and a few missorts.
You would have to be stupid to carry 3 bundles.

The 3 Bundles is thought to be (at least by me)

1. Sequenced.
2. M/S or unsequenced.
3. D2Ds (before they sequence them)

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Why is automation to do away with wages, holidays, sick pay and pensions????

More automation = less of the squashy things called humans

[Lincox]

Because automation means less intensive labour, so wage roll, holiday pay, pensions etc. all integral to high labour costs will reduce. You do not pay out on expensive machinery unless you are able to reduce labour costs.

[fishtank]

If they do what they propose - you will still only have 1 bundle and a few missorts.

The proposition with 3 bundles is different to bench merging.
The bench merging idea is that you would merge the manual with the sequence without a frame and carry the D2D separately( 2 bundles).

The 3 bundles idea is that the flats would be sequenced seperate to the letters and instead of bench merging you would carry a bundle of sequenced letters, a bundle of sequenced flats and a bundle of D2D. In this brave new world there are no miss-sorts.

Neither option has a hope in hell of ever being implemented because basically they're shite ideas invented by idiots without the slightest idea what the job actually entails.

[postslippete]

Yeah, I think someone on these boards must have got a Phd on washing machines because they sound very much like a spin doctor

[fishtank]

So many basic flaws jump out with these proposals that it makes me wonder how or why the union even agrees to trial such lunacy.

Balancing two bundles on one arm is ridiculous and liable to lead to long-term injuries like tendonitis.
Carrying one bundle in each hand leaves you wondering where you jam the trolley handle.
Standing on a doorstep with two bundles trying to root out D2D from another pouch sounds interesting.
Are letter boxes going to be self opening in the future?
Will someone invent a PDA that uses the same kind of tech as Stephen Hawking?
Will we have personal drone escorts to carry the parcels?

Are these kind of ideas put forward during bring your child to work days?

[Lincox]

I can imagine elastic bands being strewn all over the streets, D2Ds, envelopes flying down the street in the gentlest of breezes, deliveries of paper mache in the rain. Unable to grab a gate post in icy conditions, you could go on and on.

[tpost]

The dangers of postmen working in the dark really do not apply up as its only 2-3 months a year and when I started 30 years ago going out on delivery at 7am it was dark and you were given torches. In reality most postmen/women would be returning to the office around 16.40 to allow booking in packets and signing van back in so actual delivery time in dark is very little.

[fishtank]

The dangers of postmen working in the dark really do not apply up as its only 2-3 months a year and when I started 30 years ago going out on delivery at 7am it was dark and you were given torches. In reality most postmen/women would be returning to the office around 16.40 to allow booking in packets and signing van back in so actual delivery time in dark is very little.

You're missing a few points.

It's far more dangerous delivering in the dark at night than in the morning, very few people get mugged at 7 am. The pubs aren't open and junkies tend to sleep late.

If you're going to have a slip, trip or fall it's much more likely you'll do it towards the end of your delivery when fatigue becomes a major factor.

The roads are far busier at 4.30pm than they ever were at 7am.

[thegreatestfreddy]

First hurdle/practical step I’d like to understand is how on Earth are they going to sequence my 3 currently received perstorps of letter mail into another 3 perstorps of Letter Mail fully sequenced into 3 perstorps of Mail with the first letter at the front of the first perstorp and the last letters at the back of the 3rd perstorp ??

They must then do the same with my currently 2 perstorps of flats..??... I just don’t see they have the technology/ space / time to do either of these things...

Ps I don’t work in processing though so please enlighten me ... !

[clashcityrocker]

The 3 Bundles is thought to be (at least by me)

1. Sequenced.
2. M/S or unsequenced.
3. D2Ds (before they sequence them)

I thought their proposal was to sequence approx. 90% of the walk. Letters/flats/small parcels. D2D collated separately.
Assuming they can do this:

If your duty had 2 000 items the unsequenced would amount to 200 letters. Split over 40 bundles that is approx. 5 letters/bundle.
Why would you carry all 200 all the time?
You would only take the ones pertinent to the bundle/loop you are actually doing. And why would you have to carry them? You would have them in the trolley/bag as appropriate.

If you currently tie up Acacia Avenue from 2-50, if the D2D are separate, then you tie up to 2 - 20 and hold the D2D at the back as part of the bundle.
There is no separate bundle of D2D.
And the D2D are only for 1/6th of the duty/day. There isn't a "3rd" bundle for 5/6ths of the duty.

[thegreatestfreddy]

Clash ...

Are you in processing..??

How are you going to get 3 perstorps of letters (not flats) to me in deliveries sequenced from 1st letter to last letter??

Sorry I don’t understand the processing side !

[postslippete]

The 3 Bundles is thought to be (at least by me)

1. Sequenced.
2. M/S or unsequenced.
3. D2Ds (before they sequence them)

I thought their proposal was to sequence approx. 90% of the walk. Letters/flats/small parcels. D2D collated separately.
Assuming they can do this:

If your duty had 2 000 items the unsequenced would amount to 200 letters. Split over 40 bundles that is approx. 5 letters/bundle.
Why would you carry all 200 all the time?
You would only take the ones pertinent to the bundle/loop you are actually doing. And why would you have to carry them? You would have them in the trolley/bag as appropriate.

If you currently tie up Acacia Avenue from 2-50, if the D2D are separate, then you tie up to 2 - 20 and hold the D2D at the back as part of the bundle.
There is no separate bundle of D2D.
And the D2D are only for 1/6th of the duty/day. There isn't a "3rd" bundle for 5/6ths of the duty.

Why would you leave your D2Ds at the back of the bundle? Imagine out on delivery with 4 or 5 lots of flyers trying to grab them all from the back of the bundle (If you can remember exactly what streets you have to do) with the sequenced letters at the top of the bundle and somehow the mis-sorted letters somewhere lumped at the back before the D2Ds.

I don't know what delivery you do Clash, but its really not as easy as it looks

[SpacePhoenix]

The 3 Bundles is thought to be (at least by me)

1. Sequenced.
2. M/S or unsequenced.
3. D2Ds (before they sequence them)

I thought their proposal was to sequence approx. 90% of the walk. Letters/flats/small parcels. D2D collated separately.
Assuming they can do this:

If your duty had 2 000 items the unsequenced would amount to 200 letters. Split over 40 bundles that is approx. 5 letters/bundle.
Why would you carry all 200 all the time?
You would only take the ones pertinent to the bundle/loop you are actually doing. And why would you have to carry them? You would have them in the trolley/bag as appropriate.

If you currently tie up Acacia Avenue from 2-50, if the D2D are separate, then you tie up to 2 - 20 and hold the D2D at the back as part of the bundle.
There is no separate bundle of D2D.
And the D2D are only for 1/6th of the duty/day. There isn't a "3rd" bundle for 5/6ths of the duty.

How's it supposed to work on a day when you get 10+ boxes of manual from the sequencing for the walks on a batch?

[BeamishStout]

I can see that Bench Merging might conceivably work but only under specific circumstances - over 90% sequenced, no mass mailings unsequenced (think matalan, virgin media etc) and the postie being familiar with not just the route but also the sequence of the mail within that route. I also wonder how on earth the reserves would cope with walks they are unfamiliar with!