Stage 1prompt

Broxi51 · Post by **Broxi51** » 31 Oct 2017, 19:07

I have been off on a few occasions this year. I am currently back at work on light duties as directed by my doctor.
My manager sat me down yesterday to discuss my absences to determine whether I should be given a stage 1.
I pointed out to him that I was still not 100% recovered from my injury and I am still on light duties.
He informed me that as I am back at work then I am eligible to be given this stage 1 discussion and review.
Surely he should have to wait until I am 100%? I do not dispute being given a stage 1 for my absences but when I could still
have a relapse due to the light duties and be off again with the same injury then it is stupid to issue it now and could
add to the pressure. It would also determine as to when I would go back to work should I be off ever again as I
would not think of going back until I am 100% recovered.
Is there any rules regarding this that I could use tomorrow when I see him?
Many thanks in advance

rehabron · Post by **rehabron** » 31 Oct 2017, 20:31

Unfortunately as you have had a welcome back meeting on returning to work although it be on light duties your manager can invoke a stage1 prompt discussion which your several absences has triggered. Assuming that your return to work early on light duties was on the recommendation of OH Assist and you have not yet made a full recovery you must ensure that you have this placed on the notes at tomorrows meeting and that your recovery process is still on going with the possibility of a relapse that may result in a further absence which is part of the previous absence.
If any of your absences are work related then the should be discounted in any calculation that triggers stage warnings. Best not go to tomorrows meeting alone and take a union rep or work colleague with you to ensure that the meeting notes are recorde3d accurately. Best of luck.

k979aaa · Post by **k979aaa** » 31 Oct 2017, 21:51

rehabron wrote:Unfortunately as you have had a welcome back meeting on returning to work although it be on light duties your manager can invoke a stage1 prompt discussion which your several absences has triggered. Assuming that your return to work early on light duties was on the recommendation of OH Assist and you have not yet made a full recovery you must ensure that you have this placed on the notes at tomorrows meeting and that your recovery process is still on going with the possibility of a relapse that may result in a further absence which is part of the previous absence.
If any of your absences are work related then the should be discounted in any calculation that triggers stage warnings. Best not go to tomorrows meeting alone and take a union rep or work colleague with you to ensure that the meeting notes are recorde3d accurately. Best of luck.

If the manager ran him over deliberately he would still get a stage 1 or 2 thing is getting the note's right as these facts need to be at the RTU stage meeting failing that employment tribunal hearing as for stages 1 and 2 just take it as a warning never have I ever not been issued with one!

rehabron · Post by **rehabron** » 01 Nov 2017, 13:03

k979aaa wrote:
rehabron wrote:Unfortunately as you have had a welcome back meeting on returning to work although it be on light duties your manager can invoke a stage1 prompt discussion which your several absences has triggered. Assuming that your return to work early on light duties was on the recommendation of OH Assist and you have not yet made a full recovery you must ensure that you have this placed on the notes at tomorrows meeting and that your recovery process is still on going with the possibility of a relapse that may result in a further absence which is part of the previous absence.
If any of your absences are work related then the should be discounted in any calculation that triggers stage warnings. Best not go to tomorrows meeting alone and take a union rep or work colleague with you to ensure that the meeting notes are recorde3d accurately. Best of luck.
If the manager ran him over deliberately he would still get a stage 1 or 2 thing is getting the note's right as these facts need to be at the RTU stage meeting failing that employment tribunal hearing as for stages 1 and 2 just take it as a warning never have I ever not been issued with one!

" Broxi51" has already mentioned in his posting that he does not dispute been given a stage1 for his absences his fear was that on his present medical condition which we are not aware of and on what he has returned to work on light duties for if he has a deterioration how he would stand should he have to go off sick again. Not being privy to any information that has passed between OH assist ( if they are involved) and RM on his light duties in his rehabilitation plan he needs to inform the interviewer at this meeting which is a prompt not a review what his position would be should he have to go sick again on the same medical condition and have this recorded including the reply from the interviewer in the notes taken at this meeting. He may need his light duties adjusted and/or rehabilitation plan extended or a further referral to OH Assist. It would have been better had he brought this to RM attention at the welcome back meeting but he hasn't but he still has this opportunity at the stage1 prompt. Having this noted which he will be copied into should this progress to further stages and result in a dismissal and then to appeal stage and finally an employment tribunal what has been recorded in the notes may be of assistance to him and be the difference between a successful or unsuccessful appeal and an ET unfair dismissal claim.

AdTheBad · Post by **AdTheBad** » 01 Nov 2017, 19:23

Hypothetically, could the O.P return to work on a FIT/sick note for the condition, that recomends light/adjusted/normal duties with ongoing concerns and renew the note every 2 weeks with the doctor thereby never properly coming off the origional absence IYSWIM.

So, a rolling absence that is always covered by a FIT/sick note ?

rehabron · Post by **rehabron** » 01 Nov 2017, 20:06

AdTheBad wrote:Hypothetically, could the O.P return to work on a FIT/sick note for the condition, that recomends light/adjusted/normal duties with ongoing concerns and renew the note every 2 weeks with the doctor thereby never properly coming off the origional absence IYSWIM.

So, a rolling absence that is always covered by a FIT/sick note ?

The problem with that is RM can elect to totally disregard the GP " fit note" and any qualifications contained and opt for their designated occupational health provider which is OH Assist and even then they can also disregard any recommendations made by OH Assist but in relation to the later RM would be treading on dangerous ground should complications arise in the individuals medical condition and leave themselves open to compensation claims.

Broxi51 · Post by **Broxi51** » 01 Nov 2017, 20:43

Thank you for your replies.
Will be seeing the manager tomorrow and have typed out my concerns to be appended to the notes.
There was no OH assist. I was asked at a previous review whether I wished to see OH and I said yes
and then never heard a word about it. I have asked for that to be put in the notes as well which the manager has agreed with.

Many Thanks again

Justanotherstar · Post by **Justanotherstar** » 02 Nov 2017, 20:06

Gonna jump in and hi jack this for a second as it's similar to my situation, I have an attendance review as i've been off for a few weeks after a trip on duty, can I be given a stage for my absence since it was an accident at work? cheers.

Creditshampoo · Post by **Creditshampoo** » 02 Nov 2017, 20:57

Justanotherstar wrote:Gonna jump in and hi jack this for a second as it's similar to my situation, I have an attendance review as i've been off for a few weeks after a trip on duty, can I be given a stage for my absence since it was an accident at work? cheers.

Sick days due to Accidents at work are normally discounted from your record....that’s not to say they are.
You’ll most likely be given a stage, if it ever gets to stage 3 management won’t have followed procedure in many cases

Justanotherstar · Post by **Justanotherstar** » 03 Nov 2017, 05:27

Thanks, i'll make sure to bring this up

rehabron · Post by **rehabron** » 03 Nov 2017, 05:32

Justanotherstar wrote:Gonna jump in and hi jack this for a second as it's similar to my situation, I have an attendance review as i've been off for a few weeks after a trip on duty, can I be given a stage for my absence since it was an accident at work? cheers.

Was there an ERICA completed? Accidents on duty are normally discounted from calculation in the attendance procedure.

Creditshampoo · Post by **Creditshampoo** » 03 Nov 2017, 09:56

Justanotherstar wrote:Thanks, i'll make sure to bring this up

Get a half decent rep in. And remember they must provide all paperwork in the meeting, welcome back meetings etc if not meeting should be postponed

Justanotherstar · Post by **Justanotherstar** » 03 Nov 2017, 14:52

rehabron wrote:
Justanotherstar wrote:Gonna jump in and hi jack this for a second as it's similar to my situation, I have an attendance review as i've been off for a few weeks after a trip on duty, can I be given a stage for my absence since it was an accident at work? cheers.
Was there an ERICA completed? Accidents on duty are normally discounted from calculation in the attendance procedure.

No, I did ask for one but he tried saying it wasn't an accident on duty, probably going to have to get union involved to have it put through as an accident...not bothered about claiming anything just want it on the system incase anything else arises from it.

Creditshampoo · Post by **Creditshampoo** » 03 Nov 2017, 18:40

Justanotherstar wrote:
rehabron wrote:
Justanotherstar wrote:Gonna jump in and hi jack this for a second as it's similar to my situation, I have an attendance review as i've been off for a few weeks after a trip on duty, can I be given a stage for my absence since it was an accident at work? cheers.
Was there an ERICA completed? Accidents on duty are normally discounted from calculation in the attendance procedure.
No, I did ask for one but he tried saying it wasn't an accident on duty, probably going to have to get union involved to have it put through as an accident...not bothered about claiming anything just want it on the system incase anything else arises from it.

What happened

rehabron · Post by **rehabron** » 04 Nov 2017, 12:11

Justanotherstar wrote:
rehabron wrote:
Justanotherstar wrote:Gonna jump in and hi jack this for a second as it's similar to my situation, I have an attendance review as i've been off for a few weeks after a trip on duty, can I be given a stage for my absence since it was an accident at work? cheers.
Was there an ERICA completed? Accidents on duty are normally discounted from calculation in the attendance procedure.
No, I did ask for one but he tried saying it wasn't an accident on duty, probably going to have to get union involved to have it put through as an accident...not bothered about claiming anything just want it on the system incase anything else arises from it.

ERICA should be completed within 24 hours of the incident and DOM refusal to accept this as an accident on duty you should have immediately contacted your union rep to question your DOM on what evidence he had on refusing to accept your trip as an accident. Not knowing the exact location of your trip but you could have requested that your DOM accompanies to the spot for a risk assessment.