THE CWU AND FOUR PILLARS OF SECURITY Vs ROYAL MAIL AND THE RACE TO THE BOTTOM

tommyrep · Post by **tommyrep** » 18 Apr 2017, 20:23

Number one.
You state, that's what RM want, not what they will get. I wish I had your enthusiasm or belief, but anyway they will have done some research prior to compliling their wish list. They have looked at all the available data, probably with more input from private cost saving specialists/advisors. What they have not observed in these proposals is the many hard fought for agreements forged in the past. I will repeat hard fought, because I think on that point I may have deemed more experience over 40 years of working than you possibly have. Any agreements won by unions were hard fought/negotiated on their members behalf, they most certainly were never gifted or given out by a companies generosity to the poor workers.
They cannot just ignore them or simply deny their existance and remove them by executive action.
Our 4 plillar demads/requests are chicken feed by comparison.
Some if that data, as they stated - try re-reading it! was derived from PDA functions, times, tracking etc.

Our union, that's if you are a member, need to have a fair playing field to contest these facts & figures supplied by RM, these figures are not truly accurate while you or the people you spout of defending do not do the job properly. Simple fact.
Not accurate and encouraged with the help of many delivery postmen/women's actions.
This data, in my humble opinion is not truly accurate in the first instance, as until logged on, the true previous work time has not been accounted for, like proper starting and break times - two actions you may not be aquaint with.
So, on this occasion No 1, YOU may have assumed too much into my post. And secondly, you wrongly ASSUMED I was in fact a rep, when suggesting I should resign. I am NOT a rep. You are a rather fiesty kid, aren't you !

Post by **Brandy** » 18 Apr 2017, 20:51

stan_lers wrote:So the idea is to work from 3 bundles at once - mech, 2nd wave + flats, and D2Ds? How does that even work?

The company obviously wants longer and longer spent out on delivery, but ultimately it's a human being doing the work. It's not physically possible to expect another person to go out on delivery for 6+hrs, walking 15-20 miles. It would surely be one of the most physically demanding jobs in the country. But then I suppose people wouldn't stick around, and they can keep bringing in new staff on worse and worse conditions.

I suspect this is a typical strategy of offering the absolute worst terms they could think of, and then the Union thinks it's got a good deal when they scrap most of it but the bulk of it is still in there.

How much worse can this job get? So glad I am out of it now .I just wonder how many of those who think up these ideas could do them. Unless you have walked in my shoes comes to mind.Good luck to all posties you will need it.

JKSmudge · Post by **JKSmudge** » 18 Apr 2017, 20:59

midegarelu wrote: Maybe now RM is beginning to show its hand people will wake up and support the Union.

How are we supposed to #support the union' when the silence from the union on several matters is deafening, they haven't even secured us this year's pay rise yet (AGAIN) - number 1 item each year should be agree cost-of-living increase, then discuss other matters with RM - wtf do they do all year round ?

Post by **Brandy** » 18 Apr 2017, 21:04

JKSmudge wrote:
midegarelu wrote: Maybe now RM is beginning to show its hand people will wake up and support the Union.

How are we supposed to #support the union' when the silence from the union on several matters is deafening, they haven't even secured us this year's pay rise yet (AGAIN) - number 1 item each year should be agree cost-of-living increase, then discuss other matters with RM - wtf do they do all year round ?

Totally agree lost all faith in the union ages ago

number one · Post by **number one** » 18 Apr 2017, 21:17

JKSmudge wrote:
midegarelu wrote: Maybe now RM is beginning to show its hand people will wake up and support the Union.

How are we supposed to #support the union' when the silence from the union on several matters is deafening, they haven't even secured us this year's pay rise yet (AGAIN) - number 1 item each year should be agree cost-of-living increase, then discuss other matters with RM - wtf do they do all year round ?

It's all tied in with thos deal. Any pay increase will be backdated. Like it always is!!

Post by **osgoody1970** » 18 Apr 2017, 21:20

well brandy, I suggest you put your faith in royal mail to do the right thing with your terms and conditions !!! yeah right, the big thing for me is the absolute, incredible claim, that these proposals are the result of talking to the staff, in all offices, up and down the country, this is how much contempt they hold for their workers and indeed the CWU if they think, anyone with an ounce of sense, will believe these incredible lies, IT IS TIME TO BACK YOUR UNION, its the only chance you have of saving your terms and conditions....and your jobs!!!

Phantom · Post by **Phantom** » 18 Apr 2017, 21:23

45% finishing before their time - To all the knobheads starting before your time, not taking meal breaks, not using delivery methods and rushing around like the twats you all are then WELL DONE MOTHERFUCKERS you've fallen hook, line and sinker for RM master plan!!!

tommyrep · Post by **tommyrep** » 18 Apr 2017, 21:48

Phantom wrote:45% finishing before their time - To all the knobheads starting before your time, not taking meal breaks, not using delivery methods and rushing around like the twats you all are then WELL DONE MOTHERFUCKERS you've fallen hook, line and sinker for RM master plan!!!

, don't let No 1 know you think like that.

fishtank · Post by **fishtank** » 18 Apr 2017, 23:16

There is nothing in the PDA system that can tell you what time members of staff are finishing work.

It can tell where the PDA is but that doesn't mean you're finished.
It can tell when you log off but that doesn't mean you're finished.
If 45% of staff are finishing more than 20 minutes early how many still have 20 minutes of their break to take? How would the business know, individual managers don't even know? How many of those finished on , around or over still have their break to take?

What's more interesting is that trying to gauge what time staff are finished by PDA activity which is unlikely to be your final task (I know people who log off on the street while waiting at the van for their partner ) might actually be underestimating the level of unpaid overtime.

What we certainly can't do is take this information at face value and start turning on each other because that's exactly what it's intended to do. I call bullshit and I would have hoped the union would too.

ernieshoe · Post by **ernieshoe** » 19 Apr 2017, 08:26

tommyrep wrote:Just read in more detail ! Frightening, truly frightening ! But not surprised.
Anyone who did not see the true way forward and vision of a future privatised RM are truly deluded.
Would just like to add my best wishes -NOT - to all my fellow runners, early starters and non method using colleagues.
You all helped and took a stick to the backs of those posties trying to do the job properly, cosyied up to the DOMs, mocked colleagues or openly accused them of being too old or worse, lazy. Young Turks.
Thank you all very much, for providing our RM management with all the useful information they have been supplied by you all, and now putting it to use against ALL posties ! All you smart ars.s, who could not see the wood for the trees ,dobbed off colleagues for a pat on the back and a gold star,being the DOMs favourite, an example that what we should all allude too !!
THANK YOU, every single, selfish one. You were always our real enemy within, not the RM bullying managers. You only made the job easier for them. Enjoy your time in hell, .

You also forgot to mention the half wits or took out their own cars on delivery completely uninsured.

This post is spot on !

Post by **cloherty1976** » 19 Apr 2017, 10:55

ernieshoe wrote:
tommyrep wrote:Just read in more detail ! Frightening, truly frightening ! But not surprised.
Anyone who did not see the true way forward and vision of a future privatised RM are truly deluded.
Would just like to add my best wishes -NOT - to all my fellow runners, early starters and non method using colleagues.
You all helped and took a stick to the backs of those posties trying to do the job properly, cosyied up to the DOMs, mocked colleagues or openly accused them of being too old or worse, lazy. Young Turks.
Thank you all very much, for providing our RM management with all the useful information they have been supplied by you all, and now putting it to use against ALL posties ! All you smart ars.s, who could not see the wood for the trees ,dobbed off colleagues for a pat on the back and a gold star,being the DOMs favourite, an example that what we should all allude too !!
THANK YOU, every single, selfish one. You were always our real enemy within, not the RM bullying managers. You only made the job easier for them. Enjoy your time in hell, .
You also forgot to mention the half wits or took out their own cars on delivery completely uninsured.

This post is spot on !

The problem is whatever deal comes you have to read it and use it to your benefit. There are always ways to make the new deals benefit yourself. In the last 30 years I have been here things have changed but some things have been really good for you to take advantage of.Look for the positives and not always the negatives. You are always going to get people doing things differently and not pleasing everyone but things won't change

tommyrep · Post by **tommyrep** » 19 Apr 2017, 11:59

Cloherty 1976
There is NOTHING in these RM proposals that can be seen as a benefit to any person working in delivery.
If you see anything that improves your lot in processing, ! please share or point it out.

Post by **cloherty1976** » 19 Apr 2017, 12:41

tommyrep wrote:Cloherty 1976
There is NOTHING in these RM proposals that can be seen as a benefit to any person working in delivery.
If you see anything that improves your lot in processing, ! please share or point it out.

Left deliver,left processing and now on logistics. I move to whatever I think the deal is best. On logistics we have no paid meal reliefs and monthly pay but we have a better salary. I have most to lose on pension but to me life is to short. Royal Mail will keep changing things over the next few years and I will act accordingly. Maybe I will invest more in avc to enhance pension and if it's good for shareholders I will invest in shares to make up for what I will lose. I am not going to worry about what they do or don't as you will never know. But in the past 30 years whatever they have done hasn't been to bad for me and so I am certainly not going to worry about it. Life is to short in my book

datasaint · Post by **datasaint** » 19 Apr 2017, 12:45

fishtank wrote:There is nothing in the PDA system that can tell you what time members of staff are finishing work.

Yes there is, simple GPS tracking, what time the PDA left the office, what time it came back.

Even in the PDA's power off state how do we know GPS isn't continuing to work? Unless you physically unplug the battery.

tommyrep · Post by **tommyrep** » 19 Apr 2017, 13:22

cloherty1976 wrote:
tommyrep wrote:Cloherty 1976
There is NOTHING in these RM proposals that can be seen as a benefit to any person working in delivery.
If you see anything that improves your lot in processing, ! please share or point it out.
Left deliver,left processing and now on logistics. I move to whatever I think the deal is best. On logistics we have no paid meal reliefs and monthly pay but we have a better salary. I have most to lose on pension but to me life is to short. Royal Mail will keep changing things over the next few years and I will act accordingly. Maybe I will invest more in avc to enhance pension and if it's good for shareholders I will invest in shares to make up for what I will lose. I am not going to worry about what they do or don't as you will never know. But in the past 30 years whatever they have done hasn't been to bad for me and so I am certainly not going to worry about it. Life is to short in my book

As a career RM employee you have jumped through various hoops for your own benefit. I have no gripe with anyone wishing to improve their lot for their families. Your circumstances may not be akin to most other employees, although the field of logistics and even higher management will also attract the attentions of cost cuts, slowly but eventually. We now have young men on PT contracts with NO chance of ever getting full time work, !! . Your lot and options may be rosier than theirs, but you are no more safer from RM cuts. I am surprised that many well paid salaried staff have not came under more focus - so far. Savings in order to compete with competitors is obvious, feet on the ground are still required to push printed paper through letter boxes, I very much doubt the competitors employ the same numbers of high earners in their logistics departments. I'm all right jacks beware. On another point, are you a CWU or Unite member ?, or neither?