Corbyn

[ballsup]

Disappointed, won't stop me voting for him

[dvbuk55]

Disappointed, won't stop me voting for him

Hey why should it, you don't know any politician that doesn't lie to the electorate and he, despite his holier than thou attitude is no different. I remember the reaction the Americans had when Nixon was outed as a foul mouthed liar - it cost him the presidency in the end. The one good thing ballsup is that it won't cost Corbyn the premiership because he'll never be the prime minister.

[fishtank]

Socialism cannot afford to arrogantly decide that people want something "different".
Where is the evidence to support this premise?

Only a year ago the UK voters returned a Tory majority government, all of the polls suggest that if an election was called tomorrow that majority would be substantially increased. I don't think those who are playing schoolyard politics realise that what we have in government at the moment is Tory-lite, the dangers associated with a Tory government with a strong majority are far more frightening than most people realise.

It is vitally important that Labour is in a position to stop that happening, at the moment not only is the Labour party unfit to govern it looks likely that an election would see a disastrous reduction in Labour seats. I've seen this scenario before in the 80s, Thatcher was given free reign to destroy whole communities while Labour tried to offer an alternative that nobody really wanted.

This is the stark choice facing Labour party members, a worthy but increasingly irrelevant party of protest out of touch with the majority or an attempt to rebuild a party fit for government in order to stop the wholesale destruction of the state, there will be compromises yes but real life is full of compromise.

[baldrick]

'Socialism' isn't arrogantly deciding anything. The point of a political party is to offer people a choice. they can vote for it or reject it.
The choice offered by the New Labour clique disappointed the people who voted for it thinking they would get a change from Thatcherism. They found they didn't.
Corbyn is offering an alternative. I think people will vote for it. You, dvbuk55 and Tman don't. Fair enough we are all entitled to our views. It will be up to the electorate in the Labour Party, and then in the next General Election to make that decision.

[baldrick]

More Corbyn BS.

Other passengers on that train have confirmed there weren't enough seats and they had to sit on the floor too.
It wouldn't happen to Owen Smith as he would be travelling First Class on the expenses he claims.

[dvbuk55]

More Corbyn BS.

Other passengers on that train have confirmed there weren't enough seats and they had to sit on the floor too.
It wouldn't happen to Owen Smith as he would be travelling First Class on the expenses he claims.

Poor old Owen being slagged off again by the corbynista brigade (ahem, another fiver please Owen). Well lets say old JC gilded the lily a little bit, well actually a bit more than a bit.

[dvbuk55]

The choice offered by the New Labour clique disappointed the people who voted for it thinking they would get a change from Thatcherism. They found they didn't. Corbyn is offering an alternative.

Well they were so disappointed they voted in labour in three consecutive elections What Corbyn is offering the vast majority of labour supporters don't want it. They would prefer a watered down socialism that is electable than the alternative Corbyn has put on the table. I think Theresa May will wait for the outcome of the leadership vote and then call for an election, destroying the labour party in the process and legitimising her position as Prime Minister. With what is bound to be an overwhelming majority in the house there will be no bounds to the manner of injustice about to be unleashed on the British public and there will be only one man to blame.

[k979aaa]

Now that we UK have voted for the exit from the European union we need someone who means it neither did May or Owen vote for it and now we have the consequences two party's in turmoil but we have to make the best of a situation, None of those who backed the campaign now have any right to be fully involved but as Corbyn was at best lukewarm and with all his criticism of the enforced globalisation of our economy by the European Union, Of which was liberalisation of the postal services of the whole of Europe of which only three countries complied ( Sweden, the Netherlands, and the UK) now call me old fashioned but labour was for the workers But it was NEW LABOUR with Tony Blair who took over the party to get elected by mondeo man lower middle class who he promised the earth and delivered an assault on the working class and the lower middle class with his policy's! of which led to the financial crisis and pensions crisis which we all will pay forevermore! Never has a generation been poorer than now this is not just a damming indictment of the conservatives but New Labour to Tony Blair's bastard child for which some still support for their own reasons!

[britwrit]

The trouble with the 172-camp is that they keep trying to paint Corbyn as the "Worst Labour Leader Ever"" Well, no. He isn't.

Miliband lost a general election he easily could've won and saw the Scottish portion of the party destroyed under his watch. Kinnock was a two-time loser who is the only reason we remember John Major. And having crept out of the dust-bin of history, who are they supporting?

[jetblack]

[Tman]

Miliband lost a general election he easily could've won ?

How do you work that one out? His policies were just "more of the same" and he had as much charisma as Corbyn.
In fact, just like Owen and Corbyn, they're all seat-warmers until someone better shows up.
Clearly no-one thought they had to explain that to Jezza at the time, and the old fraud started to believe his own err... sh*t, rather than (as expected) toddle off into the sunset when the moment was right.

[dvbuk55]

The trouble with the 172-camp is that they keep trying to paint Corbyn as the "Worst Labour Leader Ever"" Well, no. He isn't.

Miliband lost a general election he easily could've won and saw the Scottish portion of the party destroyed under his watch. Kinnock was a two-time loser who is the only reason we remember John Major. And having crept out of the dust-bin of history, who are they supporting?

That isn't the trouble with the 172 camp, it's their strength because they outnumber the corbynista clan by 4 to 1. Well I didn't like Miliband either and there was an ennui at the last election by the electorate and I don't see anything on the table that is going to excite the electorate into voting labour no matter who the leader is. Labour needs to concentrate on getting rid of Corbyn, stabilise the party, seriously look for a real leader and come forward with a manifesto that can be sold to the electorate.

[dvbuk55]

Was he one of the people on the Virgin train who couldn't get a seat with Jezza? I'd have thought if people knew Jezza was on that train he would have had a carriage to himself

[baldrick]

Now that we UK have voted for the exit from the European union we need someone who means it

So Owen Smith is saying that if he becomes leader he will block the implementation of Article 50 triggerring the exit process unless there is a another referendum or a General Election to ratify Brexit.
Perhaps I should have voted for him! Except that I accept the democratic referendum vote. Still it's a win win situation as he's claiming to be as left wing as Corbyn, and that he will accept Labour Conference decisions as Manifesto commitments (re-nationalisation of Royal Mail?).

[baldrick]

Poor old Owen being slagged off again by the corbynista brigade (ahem, another fiver please Owen).

LOL! You should have enough soon to buy a chicken coop and some poultry! I know 'Corbynista' is intended as a derogatory insult, but i quite like it. Reminds me of 'Sandanista', the socialist movement in Nicaragua who overthrew a corrupt right wing regime.
Kris Kristofferson is my favourite singer/song writer, though I'm not so keen on his acting. I've got all his albums on cd and on my ipod. One of his songs is 'Sandanista'. Some of the lines are:

'Sandanista, may your spirit never die
Hold the candle to the darkness
You're the keeper of the flame.
Sandanista, keep believing in the dream
The truth is stronger than the shadows
Keep it shining in your eyes.'

I'll keep believing in the dream dvbuk55.