Corbyn

[Tman]

I think you should vote Tory mate. Put your money where your mouth is.
What Labour needs to do is convince those that have f**k all - and there's a lot more of them than there is people like you. And its a much easier ask than trying to convince people like you who are far too fat and comfy :

Jet is Stalinistic in his logic; even though you said you've been a life-long labour supporter, you should now vote Tory but because you don't agree with Corbyn? It would be almost sinister if it wasn't so abject.
If dear old Jet is typical of the latest breed of Corbyn supporter (and he's clearly getting his rehashed ideas from somewhere, he's not that lucid) the lunatics really are in charge of that once-proud party.
And why does anyone need "convincing"? They either will or they won't.

[baldrick]

Nope, just a big cock

Who you trying to convince - us or you ?

specsavors-(1)-2014-615.jpg

[dvbuk55]

I see our illustrious would be leader, not content with refusing to update Trident, but is now refusing to support our NATO allies in times of conflict. How far down the road of pacifism would this man go? I suspect he's got his not so white underpants on a broom handle already if someone shouts boo. If we hadn't supported Poland in 1939 where would we be now? We don't want him anywhere near politics he is an out and out coward and I'll just bet he was bullied at school and that's why he's applied the same tactics since he became leader.

[jetblack]

I see our illustrious would be leader... is now refusing to support our NATO allies in times of conflict.

Hey, if you are happy being the yanks poodle then you go for it DVB. You send your son to fight the Russians in the Ukraine .

The US of A. The only nation on Earth ever to have nuked an innocent civilian population.

Oh - sorry - we aren't supposed to mention that are we ?

Our good allies, the US of A

edit. the UK should seriously consider withdrawing from NATO IMHO. Bit like we did from the single European market. Its about realising where your true interests lay, as a nation.

[Tman]

This bloke's plumbed new depths.
I swear he's just on a wind-up now.

[dvbuk55]

edit. the UK should seriously consider withdrawing from NATO IMHO. Bit like we did from the single European market. Its about realising where your true interests lay, as a nation.

Where exactly does Corbyns interests lie? Are we to sit and contemplate our navels whilst the world moves on around us, dreaming of world peace and equality for all. Tell me jet, do you think that Britain is capable of defending its borders and international interests alone? We don't have the manpower and equipment to defeat a large enemy.

If you believe that bombing the Japanese during the second world war was wrong you are a very naïve young man. Believe me in war it is not the taking part but the winning and at any and all costs.

[Tman]

This debate so beloved of the anti-American/Liberal elite has been going on for decades.
X thousand Japanese civilians killed by atomic bombs Vs X thousand allied servicemen killed taking the Japanese mainland.

Obviously no contest....I mean, there's plenty more of those working class boys to replace the ones who would've been killed and maimed, and we really must preserve the ancient Japanese culture and infrastructure at all costs.
So much for dear old Jet and his rights of the Common Man approach to everything.

[jetblack]

Tell me jet, do you think that Britain is capable of defending its borders ..

Yes - I do. People fight differently when its their own home under threat.

..and international interests alone?

Well, there's the rub. Thats a completely different question. A former German defence minister once said "German security is being defended in the Hindu Kush". How does that work ? We, too, have exactly the same philosophy it seems.

How is British security being enhanced by having troops in Libya, for example ?

Modern day imperialism - not defending our security at all.

Nato was set up to counter a perceived threat (real or imaginary) from the former USSR. The USSR has gone now - and Russia has a mixed economy, just the same as ours. Nato's reason for being has been superseded.

[Tman]

Clearly dear old Jet doesn't realise that Russia's "new Imperialism" is being held in check by NATO. How much of the old Communist Bloc would have been retaken by the expansionist Putin if not for NATO?

[baldrick]

Thousands turned out to hear Jeremy Corbyn speak in Sheffield yesterday.

sheffield rally 3000.jpg

Daily Mirror report: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/he ... ds-8667373" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Corbyn is speaking at a rally in NW London tomorrow. I will be going, if anyone else is interested in coming the details are here:
http://www.jeremyforlabour.com/rally_jo ... _id=117470" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[dvbuk55]

Nato was set up to counter a perceived threat (real or imaginary) from the former USSR. The USSR has gone now - and Russia has a mixed economy, just the same as ours. Nato's reason for being has been superseded.

"It is often said that the North Atlantic Treaty Organization was founded in response to the threat posed by the Soviet Union. This is only partially true. In fact, the Alliance’s creation was part of a broader effort to serve three purposes: deterring Soviet expansionism, forbidding the revival of nationalist militarism in Europe through a strong North American presence on the continent, and encouraging European political integration."

Russia is still a threat and is set to expand into former bloc countries and as for defending ourselves differently, when would you start defending? When a North Korean was knocking at your front door asking for permission to cross the threshold - well that scenario isn't going to happen it's more likely to be a warhead from a submarine a thousand miles away - they wouldn't even see Jezzas undies on the broomstick and that's why we need a deterrent other than Jezzas knickers. A military presence overseas IS a deterrent, not only as a combat force but intelligence gathering and protecting our overseas interests such as UK citizens abroad who may need to be evacuated, which has happened in the past.

[dvbuk55]

Thousands turned out to hear Jeremy Corbyn speak in Sheffield yesterday.

According to the Mirror it was 2,600, who knew they'd be opening the doors to the asylum to coincide with Jezza speaking

He's always preaching to the converted NOT converting anyone. His latest hook "free university education" - yeah right, he keeps promising crap he's never going to have to make good. Preaching in London tomorrow, thanks for the info I'll be sure to stay at home, oddly enough my next door neighbour is travelling to London tomorrow, though I doubt he'll be staying in Islington unless the Hiltons there.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I don't think it was anyones intention to do so, but the more people put down Corbyn and especially his supporters the more determined I am to vote for him. After all, why change your opinion of what you think is best for the country and the Labour Party when those of a different opinion are so disparaging and contemptuous of yours.

If people and politicians really want to change my mind, at least treat me with some respect. At least FT does try to do so without the histrionics, he at least makes me rethink my position on things.

[dvbuk55]

Well speaking from a personal point of view I only intend to point out his most obvious flaws whilst the corbynistas on here insist on extolling his not so obvious virtues. Anyone who thinks that what Corbyn stands for is for the good of the labour movement is sadly deluded, Jezza is for Jezza period. An honourable man would have stood down rather than exploit the position he had. 65 cabinet members and 172 PLP members can't all be wrong.

[baldrick]

172 PLP members can't all be wrong.

251,417 Labour Party members and affiliated members voted for Corbyn in the leadership election last August. 59.5% of the total vote. He got over 40% more votes than the runner up, and more than all the other candidates combined. Are all those members wrong?
Rather more than 172 mps who have been on the parliamentary gravy train, while overseeing the electoral decline of the Labour Party over the last 30 years.