Polish for Posties!

[Homo Harry]

homo harry, chears luv tea milk no sugar, what f***ing type of round you got where you got time to stop for a cuppa., as for your polish, where did you learn that from. the poles that covered various mail centres while we were out on strike[yeah there right on our side arnt they].nice friends you got. your entitled to your oppinions and i speak from experience when i say most just want to come here earn as much as they can whilst claiming benefit for their kids back home and send money home thus not contributing to our society.[source] a neighbour 2 doors away. his own words.he even said britain is a standing joke back home. even as far as newspapers printing how to claim benefits when thay get here, untill they find work.do i have a problem with foreigners.yes i do if they cant speak our language and are not working. when my kids have to have a educational school trip cancelled because of lack of school funds due to the fact the school governing body has to find money for translators[source] headmistress at said school.

Were the translators to decipher what the hell you are on about? It's your native language, learn to spell.

Britain has a big B. As does Pole or Poland.

Cheers not chears.

Opinion is spelt like this.

Until will never be spelt untill

They, isn't spelt thay.

Sentences start with capital letters, they're the big ones that mostly look different.

Your and You're mean different things.

All that aside, you've got the wrong end of the stick. But then I've never really held out for sense from bigoted types.

I'm NOT a postman. I was, but I am not now. I now work for an agency, mostly in factories, with a lot of Poles. My girlfriend until recently is one of those you are slagging off. Her kids are grown up, she claims nothing in benefits, pays NI and tax. She thinks England is a wonderful country with very tolerant and welcoming people. Luckily she hasn't met you.

This thread isn't about some kind of Neanderthal posturing from someone who shaves their knuckles. If you don't like Poles, fine. But seeing as you are so very proud of being British, then consider this. During the Battle of Britain, 1 in 8 pilots were Polish. Some of those are still here in the UK, they aren't claiming benefits, because they died in defence of this country and are buried here. Then there were Polish army regiments, the Enigma machine, which cracked the German codes, and saved British lives, was brought here by Poles.
If it isn't too taxing for you, you might want to understand a little about the history of this country you are so proud of,
here's a start, about the role of Polish pilots in the Battle of Britain.
http://ww2-aviation.net/polavhist/bob.html

Now, about your post. I know a shed-load of Polish people working here. Some of them will cross a picket line, some of them never would. I know a shed load of Brits, and the same is true of them. Just because some crossed the lines, doesn't mean you have to then hate every one of them.. British or Polish, that'd be ludicrous, a bit like your argument. Those who refused to cross the lines, probably refused the work and therefore weren't there. I bet a lot of them had no idea they were being bussed into an industrial dispute.

I don't get your point about them not speaking English. Most of them speak at least a little English, 99% of the wish to learn more English. So, what's so bad about me posting up something that might just help us cross that language barrier? Reach out a bit, and you might just be surprised to find that these are real people with real feelings. Yeah, there's good and bad, but don't tar all of them with the worst brush you can find, from some vague research you have done. They're here to work. What's so bad about that?

OK.

[IWW Fellow Worker]

That's a great post Harry!

[Homo Harry]

That's a great post Harry!

Ta!

Workers of the world unite... we have more in common, with workers of other nations, than we have with the bosses of our nation... while we're fighting other workers, we aint fighting the proper enemy...

Simple.

[IWW Fellow Worker]

That's a great post Harry!

Ta!

Workers of the world unite... we have more in common, with workers of other nations, than we have with the bosses of our nation... while we're fighting other workers, we aint fighting the proper enemy...

Simple.

Yes, I've long held the belief that class divides us, not place of birth. Bosses will use anything to try to divide us. Religion, sex, sexuality, colour, nationality. Anyone who allows these things to divide us is a bosses stooge.

[moanmoanmoan]

homo harry, chears luv tea milk no sugar, what f***ing type of round you got where you got time to stop for a cuppa., as for your polish, where did you learn that from. the poles that covered various mail centres while we were out on strike[yeah there right on our side arnt they].nice friends you got. your entitled to your oppinions and i speak from experience when i say most just want to come here earn as much as they can whilst claiming benefit for their kids back home and send money home thus not contributing to our society.[source] a neighbour 2 doors away. his own words.he even said britain is a standing joke back home. even as far as newspapers printing how to claim benefits when thay get here, untill they find work.do i have a problem with foreigners.yes i do if they cant speak our language and are not working. when my kids have to have a educational school trip cancelled because of lack of school funds due to the fact the school governing body has to find money for translators[source] headmistress at said school.

It is not very often that I agree with IWW.

I live in an area which now has huge numbers of Poilsh immigrants.

Why? Simple - our unemployed just will not do the work.

The Polish can not just land here and claim benefits - they have to find a job and several hundred thousand have found work here in the UK.

As far as not speaking foreign languages I think that were are second only to the USA in terms of being useless. Ok some of that is down to the fact that English is one of the most spoken second languages. I will put money on the Polish workers you object to so much having :

1) a much better standard of English that you do of any other language
2) Probably a better standard of written English than you.

One of the companies I do work for has recently taken on a young Polish guy and helped him to get his NI and tax sorted.
He is here to work and pay his taxes. He cannot find decent work in Poland and the company can not find "English" people that are as enthusiastic and genuine as him.

I think we need to look closer to home when it comes to scroungers robbing us all

Good post Harry

[moanmoanmoan]

homo says it all really dont it] mate i think u r rather autocratic in ur stance mate,y to dis my spelling and grammer. when i am[apparently] a white bigoted male] [lol my misss is black, p***k].no prob with ur wife as as you say she pays ni and tax.,oh and i dont dislike poles or any other nationality ,what i do, object to is paying for ther familys kids back home out of my and your taxes.and those bastards doing ur and my work when we r on strike[but that seems fine with you].[idiot] ffs i am not saying all poles. .and as for polish men fighting in ww2,yes they did, and fair play to them. i would of to if my country been taken over by the krauts[oh hang on am i allowed to say that] [ might upset our german friends] .now to language barrier. my misses wants to move to portugal eventually, are we expecting them[natives] to speak english] of course not.if we want to live there its down to us to learn the language. as in rome ring a bell. now go hug a tree. idiot........

I hope you are more eloquent in your spoken English than you are in your written posts as frankly, if not, the Portugese will not understand you - until you learn their language( as the Poles I have met intend to do). I am sure that you will also encounter bigots that will whinge about "immigrants that do not speak Portugese."

I do not see why having a black wife excludes you from biggotry when you make coments like you have. You are just a bigot who makes exceptions. I have met a lot of people that justify their bigotry by coments such as " I know this black,Indian,etc and he is a great bloke".

How can you object to immigrant workers sending money back home - if they earn it fair and square and pay their tax and NI?

I do however understand you feelings if they were working through the strike - I am sure however that there were "English" people doing the same.

[L Tommo]

Why oh why does this point always come up???

I know this IS an issue for the whole of the UK... Immigration is out of control in my book...


No more no less..

There are pros n cons to every argument but the bigger picture is... OUR STRUGGLE...

Posties fighting with the public on our side for this service we provide....

If ANYONE crosses a picket line then it dont matter if they are GREEN... They are a scab....

Lets fight the real problem... The media and Goverments use RACE AND IMMIGRATION as a problem.. I do think it is a problem but its used just to devide and conquer the Working classes... WE shouldnt listen to this argument in our fight....

The Establishment.. Either... STARVE THE PEOPLE OF WORK THAT COMMAND A REASONABLE WAGE (make us hungry) IE. minimum wage ..

OR pull the RACE CARD.. (immigration card) IE.. Blame the naughty naughty johnny foreigners...


OUT


BLAME THESE TWO AND THERE FAT CAT MATES.. :cfo :lfo

[Trends Guild]

A few points I'd like to contribute-

1) There is no shortage of media reports stating that the British are lazy and uneducated or just plain don't want to work, that migrant workers have a better work ethic and are more willing to work, and are willing to work for less money.
Most of this is sheer propaganda peddled because it suits businesses to peddle it -

a) It is offensive and demoralising to British people to have to be constantly told that they are unemployable - it's hard to see how one might get away with saying such things about another racial or national group. If they attempt to stand up for themselves, they are denigrated as racists (or people who whose opinions are worthless because their spelling and grammar is not up to scratch). Who can people who are unable to get work on account of this actually turn to for back-up? Nobody as far as I know.

b) It is damaging to the people of Britain and the economy of Britain that employers freely discriminate against the British in this way. There may well be a need for retraining people - there may well be a need to coerce employers to take on a long-term unemployed person - none of these things will happen while people are so readily replaceable. The 'unemployable' will just pile up. 9.2 million today is the figure, or around 16% of the workforce, are now 'economically inactive', while we have record numbers of people in employment.

c) The NMW ensures that migrant workers cannot undercut British workers wages, so the notion that they are cheaper is nonsense. Employers don't care - the taxpayer will top the low wages up with tax credits. (Yes, migrants do claim tax credits, and child benefit, and housing benefit...anyone on a low wage is entitled to claim tax credits as long as they qualify...). Yes, I know that agricultural and hospitality wages are traditionally low, but the vast majority of migrants are working in warehouses and factories, not in the fields and hotels.

d) The notion that British people are lazy and unemployable is also rubbish. Take this area (Northants) - this is a county where wealth was built on low-paid manual work - shoes and textiles. There was never high unemployment, even though the wages were and still are among the lowest in the country. For hundreds of years, British working class people undertook this work, right up until the time that the shoe factories closed in the 1980's and 90's. They didn't sit on the dole feeling sorry for themselves - they took up jobs in the new local industry - warehousing and distribution. Those people have largely been replaced by migrants in the past two years. My husband worked in a shoe factory for 16 years, and was made redundant in 1992. He then did agency work in the warehouses - no problem. Now the work is just not offered because someone else is doing it. He is now a part-time cleaner for a living - nobody else seems to want that job. This is a story repeated all over the place, with unemployment (especially hidden unemployment) increasing at the same time as employment. What are we saying here? That working class people who traditionally did low paid hard work suddenly stopped wanting to do it? I can't buy that.

2) A prosperous and booming country can support a sizeable intake of migrant workers. This is a relatively prosperous country but has been due a recession for the past 10 years. The reason it has not arrived is because it has been suppressed by the advent of previously unavailable cheap credit and mortgages. Poverty and recession does not discriminate - we will all be affected. The difference between work-permit migrants and EU migrants is that the EU migrant workers do not have to leave - they can stay here and claim benefits as they are entitled to do so after one year. When it does come, there will be several issues - will the British people who have to queue up too sign on (remember the 1980's?) feel like being polite to the Polish or Hungarian or whatever people standing in the dole queue next to them?
How will we as a nation be able to afford to pay the dole of this large amount of extra people, when the number of people in work drops like a stone? Let alone them 'solving the pensions crisis'
How can we say to them, the party is over, times are now lean and you must go home? They have every right to stay here.

Ultimately you can be as polite and friendly to migrant workers as much as you like, but if it is a choice of him having a job or you, who will you choose? (and yes I have come across some people who argue that you should not object to them having your job because we are all in the same boat...victims of greedy businesses).

NB - an interesting development today, it is reported that the government is going to pay £750 or so per head to teach migrant workers English. That will enable those highly educated migrants who currently have a language barrier to move into middle-class working territory - the people who voted in B.Liar and would probably vote for Callmedave. I will be interested to see how many of them still support EU migration when they have to queue up for their £55/week!

[mylegshurt]

moanmoanmoan, i dont have a problem with them sending mmoney back home,though it is being taken out of our ecconomy.which i dissaprove off. but the fact these foreigners can claim money off of our goverment for children they who dont live here but reside in there native countrys.

[mylegshurt]

moanmoanmoan, btw the english welsh ,irish and scottish people who scabbed i hold them in the same regard as johny foreigner. though like i stated not all foreigners just the economical ones.and as for ,ooh i cant go home johnny taliban will cut off my head they can all feck off as well.

[boltonwestboy]

Wot's F**k off home in polish.

[IWW Fellow Worker]

Wot's F**k off home in polish.

Good question! I often wonder when the English will sod off back to bloody Germany or wherever it was they arrived here from and leave us Celts in peace. All the Saxon bastards have ever brought is misery to these islands. Time for them to go!

[moanmoanmoan]

moanmoanmoan, i dont have a problem with them sending mmoney back home,though it is being taken out of our ecconomy.which i dissaprove off. but the fact these foreigners can claim money off of our goverment for children they who dont live here but reside in there native countrys.

I totally agre with you.

I do not believe that migrant workers should have any right to claim any benefits until they have contributed to our system for a significant period of time.

If they can genuinly claim money for children at home (and it is not just media rumour) then this should be stopped.

We do not need in recriut takers from our system.

[moanmoanmoan]

A few points I'd like to contribute-

1) There is no shortage of media reports stating that the British are lazy and uneducated or just plain don't want to work, that migrant workers have a better work ethic and are more willing to work, and are willing to work for less money.
Most of this is sheer propaganda peddled because it suits businesses to peddle it -

a) It is offensive and demoralising to British people to have to be constantly told that they are unemployable - it's hard to see how one might get away with saying such things about another racial or national group. If they attempt to stand up for themselves, they are denigrated as racists (or people who whose opinions are worthless because their spelling and grammar is not up to scratch). Who can people who are unable to get work on account of this actually turn to for back-up? Nobody as far as I know.

b) It is damaging to the people of Britain and the economy of Britain that employers freely discriminate against the British in this way. There may well be a need for retraining people - there may well be a need to coerce employers to take on a long-term unemployed person - none of these things will happen while people are so readily replaceable. The 'unemployable' will just pile up. 9.2 million today is the figure, or around 16% of the workforce, are now 'economically inactive', while we have record numbers of people in employment.

2)I agree

As far as paying for language lessons - this should be down to the migrant.

c) The NMW ensures that migrant workers cannot undercut British workers wages, so the notion that they are cheaper is nonsense. Employers don't care - the taxpayer will top the low wages up with tax credits. (Yes, migrants do claim tax credits, and child benefit, and housing benefit...anyone on a low wage is entitled to claim tax credits as long as they qualify...). Yes, I know that agricultural and hospitality wages are traditionally low, but the vast majority of migrants are working in warehouses and factories, not in the fields and hotels.

d) The notion that British people are lazy and unemployable is also rubbish. Take this area (Northants) - this is a county where wealth was built on low-paid manual work - shoes and textiles. There was never high unemployment, even though the wages were and still are among the lowest in the country. For hundreds of years, British working class people undertook this work, right up until the time that the shoe factories closed in the 1980's and 90's. They didn't sit on the dole feeling sorry for themselves - they took up jobs in the new local industry - warehousing and distribution. Those people have largely been replaced by migrants in the past two years. My husband worked in a shoe factory for 16 years, and was made redundant in 1992. He then did agency work in the warehouses - no problem. Now the work is just not offered because someone else is doing it. He is now a part-time cleaner for a living - nobody else seems to want that job. This is a story repeated all over the place, with unemployment (especially hidden unemployment) increasing at the same time as employment. What are we saying here? That working class people who traditionally did low paid hard work suddenly stopped wanting to do it? I can't buy that.

2) A prosperous and booming country can support a sizeable intake of migrant workers. This is a relatively prosperous country but has been due a recession for the past 10 years. The reason it has not arrived is because it has been suppressed by the advent of previously unavailable cheap credit and mortgages. Poverty and recession does not discriminate - we will all be affected. The difference between work-permit migrants and EU migrants is that the EU migrant workers do not have to leave - they can stay here and claim benefits as they are entitled to do so after one year. When it does come, there will be several issues - will the British people who have to queue up too sign on (remember the 1980's?) feel like being polite to the Polish or Hungarian or whatever people standing in the dole queue next to them?
How will we as a nation be able to afford to pay the dole of this large amount of extra people, when the number of people in work drops like a stone? Let alone them 'solving the pensions crisis'
How can we say to them, the party is over, times are now lean and you must go home? They have every right to stay here.

Ultimately you can be as polite and friendly to migrant workers as much as you like, but if it is a choice of him having a job or you, who will you choose? (and yes I have come across some people who argue that you should not object to them having your job because we are all in the same boat...victims of greedy businesses).

NB - an interesting development today, it is reported that the government is going to pay £750 or so per head to teach migrant workers English. That will enable those highly educated migrants who currently have a language barrier to move into middle-class working territory - the people who voted in B.Liar and would probably vote for Callmedave. I will be interested to see how many of them still support EU migration when they have to queue up for their £55/week!

As ever Trends Guild you offer a number of well argued points:

I agree with many - however:
a) I certainly do not think that British people are unemployable. Making out and out racist comments will get you branded a racist. It is fair to comment on gramar when complaining that foreigners do not have a good command of English.

b)I do not think that employers descriminate on a general basis against British workers. The benefit system does however discourage many from taking low paid work.

c)Migrant workers being able to claim any benefits should be stopped. Fine come here and contribute and after a period of time claim benefits - say 5 years

d)There have been significant changes in manufacturing industry during the last 20 years. There are less options for lower skilled manual jobs that pay reasonable wages - Most of this type of work has been shipped to lower wage economies. Most manufacturing that remains is now geared either to high volume automation(which requires less manpower) or concentrates on more specialist highly skilled niches. Most of the low skill manual work now atracts minimum wage and a guy with a family can not live on minimum wage - better on on benefits - or at least very little better off from working ligit - benefits and a gardening job one day a week looks like an attractive proposition.

[somerset]

i'm sat on the sidelines watching this debate Get's better every minute.All started of with polish phrases. now a war of words. Come on lads GET REAL????