meeting with Union today with delivery staff

Post by **dvbuk55** » 04 Feb 2016, 11:06

I just bet there'll be exceptions to the clocking in and out and I bet people can guess who they will be.

Post by **halfull** » 04 Feb 2016, 11:15

dingo wrote:
halfull wrote:to get round clocking in early people will just come in early as they already do, then simply walk over & clock in when they should having worked anhour for free!
Management will do nothing to stop this either.
The difference will be stark ! 1 there will not be Any work for them to do and two they will only be paid for the hours which they scan into the program and the hours which they have against their names.

Way too complicated to ever work, have you seen the level of management in delivery offices?
People will always come in early & work for free, management will always turn a blind eye to it & the union will never push the company to stop it.
And of coarse there will be work to do, if start times are 9am there has to be early starters there for the delivery of the mail before that, as it is now, so people will just come in when they know the work is there not when they are scheduled to, then simply clock in after as if they have just arrived.
Also partimers, if there start times are 10:30am they will just simply come in way before that start working, then clock in when they are scheduled to.

Post by **dvbuk55** » 04 Feb 2016, 11:24

halfull wrote:Way too complicated to ever work, have you seen the level of management in delivery offices?
People will always come in early & work for free, management will always turn a blind eye to it & the union will never push the company to stop it.
And of coarse there will be work to do, if start times are 9am there has to be early starters there for the delivery of the mail before that, as it is now, so people will just come in when they know the work is there not when they are scheduled to, then simply clock in after as if they have just arrived.
Also partimers, if there start times are 10:30am they will just simply come in way before that start working, then clock in when they are scheduled to.

And DOs with CSS night shifts? Will they still be in use, if so the mail will be continually processed and if not there will be an excess of staff.

Post by **halfull** » 04 Feb 2016, 11:43

dvbuk55 wrote:
halfull wrote:Way too complicated to ever work, have you seen the level of management in delivery offices?
People will always come in early & work for free, management will always turn a blind eye to it & the union will never push the company to stop it.
And of coarse there will be work to do, if start times are 9am there has to be early starters there for the delivery of the mail before that, as it is now, so people will just come in when they know the work is there not when they are scheduled to, then simply clock in after as if they have just arrived.
Also partimers, if there start times are 10:30am they will just simply come in way before that start working, then clock in when they are scheduled to.
And DOs with CSS night shifts? Will they still be in use, if so the mail will be continually processed and if not there will be an excess of staff.

how many do's have night shifts now? & mail centre delivery offices will always be treated alot better that stand alone do's, as they have their mail right there( i had to go to my mail centre for a week 2 weeks ago & they were leaving to go on delivery at 8:45 & back for around 1pm, my do's last run of mail is not until 8:30 plus our break is after that,we dont hit the streets until 10am or later & finish around 3pm), plus most branches are based in the mail centre so they are on hand to look after do's in mail centres where they dont like to come to other do's as it could involve work.
All of this clocking in & out for every task will NEVER work or even be pushed! Its just all distraction tactics from the company which our union fall for everytime, we should all be working to a duty builder now & indoor working methods etc but how many are? example: a job was planned with 47 mins ips thats all, but how many are allowed to follow this? this person will stop on the ips until its complete, this person should be out the door by lets say 9:25 but he doesnt get out until 10am as he was delayed by the ips, then he is asked why he is not out ontime!!!
This crap is all planned in an ideal world by people who have never done the job then agreed by people in the cwu who have never done the job, then we all know how it falls apart when implemented in the real world!

Whysoslowyehcfc · Post by **Whysoslowyehcfc** » 04 Feb 2016, 14:30

Since Dave ward was voted in, he seems to have gone into hiding...
Also other top officials from CWU, seem quite happy to sign anything as long as they continue to get an easy life, i.e. You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours...

"Don't worry Moira, put out a ten point plan, we'll have discussions, threaten strike action, you take 3 off the table dangle a couple of hundred quid in the deal, and we'll convince them it's a victory for the CWU, THE MUGS WILL VOTE IT THROUGH, then you look after us for the next few years, and alls well in love and war"

fishtank · Post by **fishtank** » 04 Feb 2016, 14:47

I was under the impression that we already did get paid for the hours we work, If what you're saying dingo is that Royal Mail really believe there are a vast amount of unproductive hours that can be clawed back from delivery by strapping an RFID to staff they are living in a fantasy world and if the union buys into this so are they. This is what comes of living your life through spreadsheets and computer programs, you become a little detached from reality.

Did anyone from the union stand up and question the validity of these base presumptions or did you all just sit there nodding away, I would have fallen off my chair...laughing. I have a 39 hr contract, each week I make myself available for 39 hrs of work, If you're saying that Royal Mail want to introduce a contract where the computer tells me how many hours I'm getting paid for then the only question I can ask is why didn't you big brave union men and women (I hope) stand up at that point and walk out because I'm f***ing sure I would and will given the chance.

Chelseablue · Post by **Chelseablue** » 04 Feb 2016, 14:58

Cracking post fish . We all need to stand up to this big time even the yellow belly people who accept anything with regards to a small bung . Don't get me started on the Trade union bill and the right to strike !,,,,'

Martin Walsh · Post by **Martin Walsh** » 04 Feb 2016, 15:29

Fish there were no questions allowed to the managers but afterwards we had the officers report and they were united in saying we are not going to have their plans that is why we are having a policy forum in March to have policy on pensions , Pay and the strategy etc .

The CWU is not just those based in CWU HQs it is in every workplace if you have an issue which you don't think is right in your office then fight it stand together and go through the IR framework.

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 04 Feb 2016, 15:53

dingo wrote:Fish there were no questions allowed to the managers

Then why the f**k were they allowed to brief you. (the expletive is not aimed personally, merely an expression of my exasperation)

This is either symptomatic of RMs autocratic approach where no questions are asked, and orders are passed down from on high. If so, the Union should have insisted that the managers be questioned, or they were not welcome. After all, a briefing paper would have done the same job.

Or it's a symptom of the Union wanting to be included in decisions, which is fine but not at any cost. One of the true values of the CWU should be to represent its members and ask the questions members want. If the CWU agreed to no questions then they have abrogated one of the tenents of being a Union.

Even worse though if it was a CWU HQ decision when RM was willing to be questioned, that would be unbelievable.

motherhubbard · Post by **motherhubbard** » 04 Feb 2016, 16:09

dingo wrote:Fish there were no questions allowed to the managers but afterwards we had the officers report and they were united in saying we are not going to have their plans that is why we are having a policy forum in March to have policy on pensions , Pay and the strategy etc .

Oh wow! - a policy forum in March!
No wonder RM are quaking in their boots. Has the share price nosedived with that announcement?

Post by **halfull** » 04 Feb 2016, 16:12

dingo wrote:Fish there were no questions allowed to the managers but afterwards we had the officers report and they were united in saying we are not going to have their plans that is why we are having a policy forum in March to have policy on pensions , Pay and the strategy etc .

The CWU is not just those based in CWU HQs it is in every workplace if you have an issue which you don't think is right in your office then fight it stand together and go through the IR framework.

the dedication and guts of local reps is not the problem it is area reps, div reps & so on up the chain that dont want to get their hands dirty & thats why things have got as bad as they have.
Those people in those positions do nothing but be reps! Allday long! What can a delivery rep do when he has a 5 hour delivery & everyones problems to deal with everyday!
Branch reps & so on up the chain have got the easiest life in the royal mail! Nobody watching them,no pressure, no threats made to them so on and so on!
The vast majority of the membership are disgusted in how the cwu treat its members & what they prioritise! & thats why the membership has fallen by 20%, & will continue to fall. fact.

Post by **General Mannerheim** » 04 Feb 2016, 17:02

My rep went down to this meeting,he was in today, did he inform anybody of what went on?...Did he feck!

Just sat in the World Class bullshit room with one of his cronie mates both staring at their laptops,no doubt so they can show management how to lapse more walks.

And then I come home and the feckin union have sent me a nice poster and want me and the other mugs in our office to photo ourselfs holding it up and out it on social media....good luck with that one you twats.

daveyeff · Post by **daveyeff** » 04 Feb 2016, 17:59

so dingo, if you and the rest are all against their plans and will reject them, I take it there will be a call for strike action. personally I will go for it but do you think you will get a supportive vote?

dundee · Post by **dundee** » 04 Feb 2016, 18:00

Dingo.Royal mail have had their say,what happens now?What as union member can we do,in your opinion?If we don't go out on strike with these plans royal mail have,I personally will be coming out of the union

Martin Walsh · Post by **Martin Walsh** » 04 Feb 2016, 18:32

Take it from someone has been a rep through countless disputes and led a lot and seen senior Managers presents proposals at similar briefing of course to some it would be great to ask these managers questions and shout at them at a briefing in front of 2500 other reps get a round of applause and leave with a smile on your face ! You really think those Directors who work to even more senior Directors will listen ?

The National Briefing was purposely designed to ensure that all reps were brought up to speed on the issues facing all of us so we can all start consulting with the members on the issue which need their input !

The policy forum means that Branch's and Divisions can form policy for any negotiations. Nothing will be imposed as they simply can't in line with the legal IR framework.

So the question is would you want an 100 questions to RM managers which they bat away and believe me I have had these both the RM strategy Presntation twice before and the Production control before and had heated debates with them over both. Sometimes the only message they listen too is when the membership and the Union Unites !

Let's face it If the employer asked the membership do you want to work 9-5 or 6-3 they would understand the views quite strongly !

To some of you the union seems to be the enemy but every you have from paid reliefs , leave entitlement , weekly pay , sick pay , start and finish times , less than 6 day working , pensions , no complusory redundancies etc have not been given by Royak Mail they have been fought for by the CWU and the members !