meeting with Union today with delivery staff

citypostie · Post by **citypostie** » 03 Feb 2016, 17:53

dingo wrote:
citypostie wrote:So royal mail must be going to spend a fortune on all this technology, no set deliveries because the machine will decide on them for day depending on mail!!!! They've not been able to get the PDAs to work properly or stay charged for more than an hour so good luck with that. Clocking in and out and only paid for what you work, great an incentive to go as slow as possible and get paid for tossing it off like a fair few already do.
The new PDAs are being rolled out this year and have huge capability. People cost is the biggest cost in Royal Mail and that is what they want to reduce.

And bringing in times of 10 to 6 or later will be the best way of getting rid of people who have been here years and have the contracts they no doubt want rid of. A two tier workforce is coming, the ones left on old decent contracts after new probably zero hour contract workers just getting paid for the hours they're needed. When the new outnumber the old we will all be on the new contracts soon after

Postie45 · Post by **Postie45** » 03 Feb 2016, 17:59

citypostie wrote:
And bringing in times of 10 to 6 or later will be the best way of getting rid of people who have been here years and have the contracts they no doubt want rid of. A two tier workforce is coming, the ones left on old decent contracts after new probably zero hour contract workers just getting paid for the hours they're needed. When the new outnumber the old we will all be on the new contracts soon after

I wouldnt worry too much about them changing the full time contracts, theyre not able to do it without agreement. I can see a lot of EVR offers coming though to get rid of as many of these contracts as they can.

paulsmd · Post by **paulsmd** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:14

pinstripe wrote:Can you imagine the cost of merging three delivery offices into one, on a nationwide scale. The cost would be far to high.

They would have to buy the land and then build the offices. If I recall correctly, we have well over a thousand delivery offices. The cost in a city centre could never justify it.

One man, one van? Never work, RM would either have to pay for non-drivers to sit their driving test, or pay off non-drivers.

Honestly, these are the type of rumours that the CWU should be addressing publicly to their members.

The rumours are out, and people are worrying, but the silence is deafening.

In Ipswich we already do one man one van. Apart from non divers who pair up.
But when they leave Royal Mail only take on drivers. So long term we will all be one man / one van.

citypostie · Post by **citypostie** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:17

Postie45 wrote:
citypostie wrote:
And bringing in times of 10 to 6 or later will be the best way of getting rid of people who have been here years and have the contracts they no doubt want rid of. A two tier workforce is coming, the ones left on old decent contracts after new probably zero hour contract workers just getting paid for the hours they're needed. When the new outnumber the old we will all be on the new contracts soon after
I wouldnt worry too much about them changing the full time contracts, theyre not able to do it without agreement. I can see a lot of EVR offers coming though to get rid of as many of these contracts as they can.

If new contracts outnumber the old, they'll offer you a new one to sign and the old saying like it or lump will come into play. If the cwu and the members let most of the stuff mentioned by dingo come into play you can forget royal mail needing an agreement to do anything because they will have already shown they can do as they want

Postie45 · Post by **Postie45** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:22

yeah, they cant do that, its contract law... "like it or lump it" wont fly

Post by **stodgy88** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:24

Only got 7 years till retirement,but dont want to be put in a position that i am forced to learn to drive to keep my job.

steve522 · Post by **steve522** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:25

hi

might be some truth too this. our union rep had a meeting today to discuss 6 hour deliveries. heard it straight from the horses mouth. ive only heard of making the deliveries 6 hours. not heard nothing about no tuesday delivery or getting rid of shared vans etc.

steve522 · Post by **steve522** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:27

plus the the 6 hour deliveries will just be delivering letters. they will have packet rounds and letter rounds.

citypostie · Post by **citypostie** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:40

steve522 wrote:plus the the 6 hour deliveries will just be delivering letters. they will have packet rounds and letter rounds.

Why would they do that? Pay 2 people to drive down the same streets on the same day, that's why they brought van shares in, to get rid of the separate packet duties like I used to do. It's all about saving money and that would cost more unless they employ new people to do parcels on the same sort of terms that yodel and other courier firms pay

steve1873 · Post by **steve1873** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:43

paulsmd wrote:
pinstripe wrote:Can you imagine the cost of merging three delivery offices into one, on a nationwide scale. The cost would be far to high.

They would have to buy the land and then build the offices. If I recall correctly, we have well over a thousand delivery offices. The cost in a city centre could never justify it.

One man, one van? Never work, RM would either have to pay for non-drivers to sit their driving test, or pay off non-drivers.

Honestly, these are the type of rumours that the CWU should be addressing publicly to their members.

The rumours are out, and people are worrying, but the silence is deafening.
In Ipswich we already do one man one van. Apart from non divers who pair up.
But when they leave Royal Mail only take on drivers. So long term we will all be one man / one van.

Is it just me or does 1 man, 1 van make absolutely no sense? The vans have 2 seats. Thus the potential for 2 persons covering the ground in half the time (as it the case at present with van sharing).

I mean look at the vans as a fixed cost over their lives. 1 person only has the capability to carry out x amount of work per day. Given the vans have the capability of having 2 people work from them, then surely that is not only more logical, but also makes more commercial sense, no?

It is like an airline deciding to only offer flights with half the capacity of their aircraft. Each seat is essentially lost revenue. If you can equare man hours to revenue obviously!

Post by **TrueBlueTerrier** » 03 Feb 2016, 18:45

Perhaps the final plan is to replace CDVs with Cargo Vans like UPS use in this country and USPS do in the USA

gary1975 · Post by **gary1975** » 03 Feb 2016, 19:30

No set walks , does that mean the end of the duty holder, long weekends ?

slinder123 · Post by **slinder123** » 03 Feb 2016, 19:46

postslippete wrote:Those proposals sound about as popular as Donald Trump in an illegal immigrant refugee camp!! But Royal Mail can say whatever they want. They could put Laurel & Hardy on RMTV for us to watch as part of our Work Time Learning session if they want.

But actually getting everyone to agree and conform to everything Royal Mail propose is another matter....

We had a similar scenario whereby one of our senior managers wanted us all to sign out of the office and make sure that we all worked to our time. This manager got a Union Rep on board to try and get a local agreement. However, it never actually went ahead because they were clearly worried about the amount of mail and packets on busy days not being delivered because the majority of staff didn't want to work past 3pm (and that includes the runners who regularly take out extra work).

The biggest thing that is preventing Royal Mail from making the changes is US. Most of us are now working the longs and shorts with the times installed, and to be honest it works quite well. Our main focus should be getting at least 93% of 1st class letters delivered next day so that we don't get a hefty fine from Ofcom. So its good that we have still have a USO even though Royal Mail would love to be free from it. Did anyone mention in your meeting how Quality of Service would suffer from these proposals if they suddenly work them in the next 12 months?? Perhaps someone should mention that EE got fined a million quid for not adequately dealing with customer complaints last year??

well considering there making 3 million a day from door to door there shitting themselves hearing about that million pound fine

edwardo · Post by **edwardo** » 03 Feb 2016, 20:33

dingo wrote:The National Briefing is today and there are presentations from Royal Mail on the crisis of our pensions and the employers cost going forward which is estimated to reach around 40% when the next actuarial is done and Royal Mail have said they will not pay which threatens the future of our pensions going forward. in post office ltd the company has announced a consultation process about closing the defined benefit pension scheme for all employees and putting all those employed before 2008 into an inferior defined contribution scheme.

Anton Harding in charge of the Royal Mail strategy will also be giving a presentation on the plan which this and several other threads have picked up.

Equally there will be a presentation on production control which is a computer package which aims to record time and resource. This includes clocking in and out for OPGs including break times and IPS , Prep etc.

Now I have had the Anton Harding Presntation twice already.

There is no change to the 6 day service at all ! Royal Mail scoped Monday being dropped but with Royal Mail capturing more of the parcels market they did not believe any change would be good !

Yes there will be merged delivery units around 400 will be merged out of the 1500. Royal Mail will not buy an new buildings they only lease nowadays.

This is a 5 year strategy not a 12 months one

The first change is one wave and does not require longer spans only later starts and finish times. Remember they cannot do one wave in every office currently on 65% of offices. They do not want to delay the standard going out of delivery time at around 10. Even then some staff will need to be in earlier as firms , timed deliveries , tracked and specials will still require an earlier delivery

Once they have been given the green light by the board / shareholder they will buy the 20 large letter sequencing machines which will be a game changer.

Only then will all the indoor be removed from a delivery and the only work available will be delivery only hence Royal Mail's 6 hour span plan.

None of this is agreed with the union and it is only the union who is chalkenging this plan.

Hopefully after today the union can put something out to the membership which kills some of the rumour rubbish and confirms the union's opposition to the plans.

how can I clock out for a break when 95% of our office never have a break

Post by **pj2001** » 03 Feb 2016, 20:39

Postie45 wrote:yeah, they cant do that, its contract law... "like it or lump it" wont fly

Wrong! https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/work/ ... _contracts" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;