Poll - longer deliveries or less Full Timers.

[halfull]

bench merging has been a total fail in the trial office, i can confirm that if dingo wont or doesnt know so i wouldnt worry about that too much yet.

[halfull]

Before I answer the question from Fish I just want to answer the points of mother and Hatiful.

Mother the point is that Royal Mail are likely to propose via the IR framework to this offices where they could move to one wave of traffic. We all know that they cannot move to one wave everywhere yet , so the point I was making is if they propose it in my area , every office or Branch has to have their own strategy for dealing with it. In 2009 when the National Union said no Office should agree any savings my area and others did that and we took 20 days of strike action to back it up when Royal Mail took executive action. The reason why the CWU called the policy is that Royal Mail said they no longer was going to pay for change and they did not need to pay for the BT revisions , a SHorter working week or a pay deal for BT 2010. Too many offices throughout the UK did agree savings against the policy.

Hatiful how many offices do you talk for so many generalisations which have no evidence to back it up. If your office is like that then talk about your office don't make out your an expert on other offices .

Now Fish I can only give a personal opinion and not a United CWU position as this is an emerging debate and subject.

The average age of a postal worker in the Eastern geographical directors control area ( there are 3 geographical directors for the UK ) is 48.

According to Royal Mail's records via thousands of test letter sampling 95% of walks complete by 14:30

There are approximately 66 thousand walks of varying lengths.

We have rural deliveries already around 6 hours due to the time between delivery points

Within offices there is a range of delivery times as walks are unbalanced.

The other thing is we have an appetite from OPGs and part timers to work over their contracted hours by doing belateds , or performing their own walks.

Equally let's be clear you could have 2 different walks of 4 hours and it may be completely different in terms of time actually out on delivery ! One could have hardly any attendance calls and the other could have 40% of his walk in attendance calls. They are both 4 hour walks but one takes 6 hours and the other 4 hours ! This is happening now in offices !
As since BT revisions walks are going longer for a variety of reasons more delivery points , more traffic congestion , more attendance calls etc.

We also have a variety of attendances some work 4 days so walks would natural be longer to fill a 9:35 day , we have a rotating rest day , we have 9 day fortnights and we have wallingtons where people work 6 days a week to gain a rest week where some work their rest week.

We also have varying walks within offices we have those who have high terrain , we cdvs , we have HCTs we have those who do businesses we have those who do council houses we have those who do upper class areas etc . No one walk is the same.

Personally I think 6 hours is not a target which any Union should support. the issue ! The 6 hour span is only going to be a factor if Royal Mail ever purchases the 20 large letter machines and that is probably 3 to 5 years. The real immediate threat which none of you seem to get is if your work does not come until 8:30 or 9 than in order for you to complete your contracted hours your attendance times would have to move from say 06:30 -1430 but to 0900 too 1700. This is not lengthening the delivery span it is changing the time your work gets into the office.

It is almost the best red herring get everyone arguing about the span length when it will only ever happen if they buy the 20 machines and sequence all the work which will mean there is no indoor work at all ! This is a 5 year plan!

The real threat is moving to one wave which is next year !

people finished by 14:30 but there is a real appetite for overtime on the delivery lol
No people get harassed into working over! you will not see this from an office but in the real world we experience & see it day in day out!
However getting obsessed with a span length is not the issue you say!!!!!! this can only be spoken by somebody who never does a hard days work! the span length is the only thing that matters to posties! Id rather deliver from 14:30-17:30 over 8am-14:30pm everyday of the week! you are well out of touch!
Still no comment on people going over their times by hours each week & methods not being used or pushed by the cwu?
I can speak for my office & tell you over 100 hundred posties never have a good word to say about the cwu! The rep is fantastic but the reps on the ground know whats going on,what we are going through each day! The further up the cwu chain the more out of touch & management like it gets.
Im not saying you dont do a good job when called upon, im not saying that as it would be unfair as i dont see you in action but i can tell you for a fact you are as out of touch with how posties feel & what they want as mp's are with the working people of Britain.

[cyrus]

"According to Royal Mail's records via thousands of test letter sampling 95% of walks complete by 14:30".....and does Royal have figures on how many start early skip, their breaks,break the speed limit In the van,etc,etc,etc.?

[geordieboy123]

Apologies as I suppose this is covered somewhere but can someone explain how this one wave will work why is there a view that there will be no inside work? whether the mail comes in one, two or three waves it's still got to be put in the frame has it not? we will still have to sort the parcels and packets will we not? we will still have to put in the d2d's will we not? or am I missing something?

Yes.

1 wave won't cancel all indoor work straight away but over 5 years when they introduce the new machines which will be sequencing all letters, flats and small packets, D2Ds will arrive pre-sorted and the frames won't exist (it's even got a name - bench merging). Therefore either the D2Ds will arrive mixed in with the mail, or you'll have specific addresses on specific days, and you'll only need to sort through the bundles to mark the packets that aren't presorted.

Though how this will work with Christmas Cards which the machines can't read, I can only guess at extended delivery being a matter of course, and 5-6 hour deliveries during the rest of the year being 8 hour duties at Xmas.

What is bench merging.

[POSTMAN]

What is bench merging.

Bench merging is what happens in Holland where there is 10% full timers and 90 % part timers with an average contract of 18 hours. A signicant amount of part timers are what is known as waysiders anything which Royal Mail are interested in where they would drop the work out to part timers at certain points and part timers would not have an office.

The idea behind bench merging is that when all your work come in on one wave you would not need to then put your work into a frame but simply add your manuel to the work they are even considering not prepping the door to door into the bench merging. All of this is due to be trailed in the Wasall area.

[Martin Walsh]

The old tale of shoot the messenger springs to mind.

I have given you probably more information than anyone on this subject.

Fish I get people are concerned about the span , but the span can only be lengthen by negotiations and it will only really be an issue when Royal Mail buy the 20 large letter sequencing machines. They have not yet purchased the machines. It is part of their future strategy but it is a 5 year strategy and that is towards the back part of the plan.

The immediate threat is that as early as next year they could move over 60% of delivery offices to one later wave of work. Clearly if you only have 15% of your work in up to 9 in the morning then you do not need 50 60 70 80 or 90 % of staff starting before 9 in the morning. In order to get your contracted hours in then you would move your attendance latter ! There would still need to be people who got out early on firms , tracked and specials. But the vast majority will have to move later. Now I think your underplaying the impact this will have as most people have built their lives around the attendances they have enjoyed. Look at the uproar when it moved to 3 o'clock on a Saturday imagine 5 on a Saturday.

Think of those who have built their wages based on the OPGs is finished early enough to pick the kids up which allows the other partner to work as well ?

Not Hatiful I know all about the bench merging trial in walsall but let's be clear the reason why it is not working is that the CWU have strangled it limiting it to 9 walks. This is why Royal Mail want to move to the merging jacket so you merge on the street. Remember because it is one wave the only merging needed is door to door and large letters flats . The jacket has slots in the front where your flats , d2d and large letters can be put ! The CWU have refused to agree the jacket .

But the 5 year plan means that if they get the large letter machines there is no need to have any frames in offices. Only a bull ring for parcels. Again the CWU have not agreed this.

TBT of course you have not heard formally on this as the CWU are trying to join the plans together , as there are numerous other strands including the introduction of clocking in and out and after ever task a computer package total production management.

I can assure you the PEC have had the presentation on the modelling from one wave and the trail on walsall as has the Divisional Reps and I can guarantee that this subject in the new year is going to be huge.

[greengiant]

So the opg wears a jacket with loads of pockets?

Seems rather a faff having to merge stuff on the street, even moreso when it is raining! And then have to also check for redirections which you'd need to take with you?

[Newbie001]

Every one seems have forgotten the part-time staff in all of this. Are we really expected to come in at 11 a.m plus???
Also how would the over-running procedure work, because I can guarantee I won't be extending a minute past 5 and I'm sure most posties won't either. Also traffic is a nightmare in most places between 3-6 pm so this will also have to be factored in as well. Not forgetting the fatigue factor of starting so late in day. People will naturally be slower than normal. Can only see negatives in all of this I'm afraid.

[motherhubbard]

The immediate threat is that as early as next year they could move over 60% of delivery offices to one later wave of work.

Do you know where the 60% of offices are?
And why can't the other 40% be moved to one wave early next year?

[k979aaa]

The only things the bosses up top see is less hours less jobs more profit they don't give a f**k what time you finish or start or how long your out there it is a business model and if you don't fit in the square peg as a well rounded postie you do not fit the business model and their for are surplus too the requirements of the business.

[gary1975]

A jacket full of d2ds and flats that we have to merge together outside lol surely got to be a piss take ive heard it all now the later start times alone will lead to
Strikes 100% no postie will want it and not a second would anybody work over, could you imagine xmas with 5pm finish some people would be out until 7pm

[A2B]

One wave will mean bigger trucks coming to the delivery office, i'd guess any office without the room to accommodate them would be in the firing line for closure?

[fishtank]

The "merging jacket" lol.
That's the mother of all bullshit scare stories.
What do you get on a hot summer's day?
The "merging man-kini"?
Absolute bollocks.

Dingo , you do realise that royal mail are f***ing with you?
You're an intelligent guy, how thick do you think we are?

[A2B]

The "merging jacket" lol.
That's the mother of all bullshit scare stories.
What do you get on a hot summer's day?
The "merging man-kini"?
Absolute bollocks.

Dingo , you do realise that royal mail are f***ing with you?
You're an intelligent guy, how thick do you think we are?

Are we really talking about a wearable jacket? I took it to mean some sort of outer pouch/sleeve which you would put your delivery inside much like you would put a book inside it's jacket? I could well be wrong

[Martin Walsh]

Fish too many think the jacket is the issue ! I think Royal Mail want to detract the union on issues which we get all thing are big issues but then they open another front like one wave or D2D collation starting in Swindon from January or later acceptance times. I highlighted the jacket as they wanted to use in wasall but I agree they are playing us on certain side issues.