Reverse lights on Fiat Doblo not working

[In The Know]

Interesting read ganda. Apparently it's a common fault on the Doblo, a sensor on the gearbox is naff.

[ganda]

Lights:- I would hope you WOULDN'T drive the car with no reverse lights, but people do do it. There is no legal requirement to have reversing lights fitted at all. Nor are non-working reversing lights a reason for a MOT failure. BUT you are subject to the rule of - if it's fitted, then it has to work. So GET THEM FIXED!!!

https://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/index. ... ar-issues/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[eric the viking]

Lights:- I would hope you WOULDN'T drive the car with no reverse lights, but people do do it. There is no legal requirement to have reversing lights fitted at all. Nor are non-working reversing lights a reason for a MOT failure. BUT you are subject to the rule of - if it's fitted, then it has to work. So GET THEM FIXED!!!

https://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/index. ... ar-issues/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Quoting a forum does not make it law.

[ganda]

Its a police question and answer forum. The police authority answered.... If fitted it/they have to work.

[yellowbelly]

Road Vehicles Lighting Regs 1989 deals with Reversing Lights which it defines as " a lamp used to illuminate the road to the rear of a vehicle for the purpose of reversing and to warn other road users that the vehicle is reversing or about to".

It is an Optional lamp and therefore not covered by Reg 23 which deals with the maintainance in good and working order.

Schedule 14 list the characteristics:

Number - Not more than two
Position - no requirement
Size of illuminated area - no requirement
Colour - white
Wattage: no requirement if displaying an approved mark otherwise one lamp not to exceed 24 watts
Tel-tale - Only required if light is not automatically activated by selection of reverse gear.
So yes he can drive it but could just play at being an awkward bugger and ask manager to find the correct regs and refuse to drive until they have found them.

As to the OP's original question Can someone tell me if it's illegal to drive if they don't work? - as eric the viking has already said (and backed up by the The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 -http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989 ... on/23/made which is the law) - it appears it is not illegal.....

Whether RM procedures state all lights are to be in working order and whether morally you should drive a vehicle with an fitted but unserviceable light are different matters to the OP question.

Re UKPoliceonline advice quoted by ganda - from their website disclaimers:

This site disclaims any and all responsibility or liability for the accuracy, content, completeness, legality, reliability, operability or availability of information or material on this site,.......

and

This website has no official connection with any of the UK's police forces or associated special constabularies. Unless otherwise stated, the information, products or services on this website are not official and are not endorsed in any way by any of the UK's police forces or associated special constabularies.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/made" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989

PART III

REGULATIONS GOVERNING THE MAINTENANCE AND USE OF LAMPS, REFLECTORS, REAR MARKINGS AND DEVICES

Maintenance of lamps, reflectors, rear markings and devices

23.—(1) No person shall use, or cause or permit to be used, on a road a vehicle unless every lamp, reflector, rear marking and device to which this paragraph applies is in good working order and, in the case of a lamp, clean.

(2) Save as provided in paragraph (3), paragraph (1) applies to–

(a)every–
(i)front position lamp,
(ii)rear position lamp,
(iii)headlamp,
(iv)rear registration plate lamp,
(v)side marker lamp,
(vi)end-outline marker lamp,
(vii)rear fog lamp,
(viii)retro reflector, and
(ix)rear marking of a type specified in Part I of Section B of Schedule 19,with which the vehicle is required by these Regulations to be fitted; and
(b)every–
(i)stop lamp,
(ii)direction indicator,
(iii)running lamp,
(iv)dim-dip device,
(v)headlamp levelling device, and
(vi)hazard warning signal device,with which it is fitted.

Specific to reversing lamps:

SCHEDULE 14
requirements relating to optional reversing lamps

1. Number:

Not more than two
2. Position:

No requirement
3. Angles of visibility:

No requirement
4. Alignment:

To the rear
5. Markings–

(a) A motor vehicle first used on or after 1st April 1986 and a trailer manufactured on or after 1st October 1985:
An approval mark
(b) A motor vehicle first used before 1st April 1986 and a trailer manufactured before 1st October 1985:
No requirement
6. Size of illuminated area:

No requirement
7. Colour:

White
8. Wattage–

(a) A reversing lamp bearing an approval mark:
No requirement
(b) A reversing lamp not bearing an approval mark:
The total wattage of any one reversing lamp shall not exceed 24 watts
9. Intensity:

No requirement
10. Electrical connections:

No requirement
11. Tell-tale–

(a) A motor vehicle first used on or after 1st July 1954, provided that the electrical connections are such that the reversing lamp or lamps cannot be illuminated other than automatically by the selection of the reverse gear of the vehicle:
No requirement
(b) Any other motor vehicle first used on or after 1st July 1954:
A circuit-closed tell-tale shall be fitted
(c) A motor vehicle first used before 1st July 1954:
No requirement
(d) Any vehicle which is not a motor vehicle:
No requirement

So after research all I can state is that a reversing lamp is not mandatory. It is not specifically listed as must be working in 23(1) but may fall under the Hazard requirement in 2a(vi).

In essence its anyone's guess.

[ganda]

As I stated we approached the police over the matter, they said if fitted it has to work.

[ganda]

Also the police online forum, to put questions to the police also states they have to work...... What more proof do you need....

https://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Also the police online forum, to put questions to the police also states they have to work...... What more proof do you need....

https://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Its not "proof" its an opinion posted online - but one that I suggest people follow. The strange thing is that "must be working" section says it only applies to lamps in that list - reversing lamps are not on that list. In cases where there is confusion its always better to err on the side of caution.