Yes or no the result

[Judgee]

Lincox I know what you are saying with regardes to deliveries, including b&h, workload, dignity and fairness. That's what I meant by not being especially impressed with the deal on offer. The money issue was not /is not what's important compared to the other aspects mentioned. But if this deal is rejected we will very likely lose everything on offer. There is no way we will get any agreement on bullying and better work loads now, it was highly unlikely before but as it's been dragged out for so long union support has dwindled drastically. Now we are privatised profit is the only thing that matters to the RM bosses and the best way for them to make money is to crack the whip and beat the workforce into working longer and harder for less. They will not give that up and now they know the CWU is all bark and no bite they have nothing to fear.

Bullying and workload issues are mainly a delivery problem. As in the last deal when D2Ds were added to the workload indoor workers have very little if anything to lose. You will not get a no vote on the deal whilst half the workforce are offered a carrot to sellout the other half. It happened before and will happen again. There will not be a vote for strike action unless delivery staff are allowed to vote seperately on the workload issue and as that will never be allowed to happen, RM management are sitting pretty. I'm surprised they haven't already pulled the plug on this offer, maybe they are getting soft?

Take the deal before it goes off the table. Anyone thinking the CWU will go away and come back with anything other than a worse deal in a months time is bonkers!

[stephen500]

"yes"

[Moley88]

No

[t-c]

No.
The pay deal is ok, but they can stuff the none strike clause up their furry a***

We keep voting in pay deals with promises of a brighter land afterwards, dealing with B&H, Work loads, and they continue to be swept away until the next pay deal... Vote NO, and make the bastards deals with our issues BEFORE coming to the members to vote on their deal of the century!

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Lost faith in the union when they agreed the d2d payment went to everyone. I know the d2d is important to rm coffers but surely the ones that deliver it should get more of the payment

Unfortunately you have lost your faith in the union on a misunderstanding or fallacy.

Only those in the delivery function receive the Delivery Supplement, and everyone in the delivery Function at OPG level does do something in the pipeline to ensure timely delivery.

We are no longer Paid extra for delivering D2Ds.

Anyone outside of the delivery function WILL NOT get the Delivery Supplement, they will get their own supplement. Mail Centres got one of about £8 from the BT2010 deal.

I have also lost a lot faith in the Union, and I think the Delivery Supplement/D2D issue was handled poorly, but we have to judge them on realities not incorrect assumptions.

[Lincox]

Judgee, it is not a case of rejecting the deal or asking Royal Mail to increase the deal. What the No Voters are asking for is a deal on deliveries which can then be voted on by the membership. What we have is an agreement that does not match the intention of the consultative agreement that was voted in by a majority including all functions covered by CWU.
It must be that we ask the CWU to go back and get a negotiated settlement on delivery. If this means that the pay and guarantee settlement has to be deferred a little longer (not renegotiated), then that is what should happen. Do we continue to settle agreements on the basis of Money talks loudest, and be scared that Royal Mail might pull the plug on all of the agreement. If that is the case then all functions should be worried about what the future holds and not just deliveries.

[Judgee]

Lincox, a seperate deal for deliveries would be the ideal but it will never happen. If there was even the slightest hope of getting this then I would vote no but let's be realistic here. Is there anything in the CWUs track record that shows they can achieve this or that even know where to start with it?

[Lincox]

It,s not an ideal Judgee. It is what this membership voted for and the role of the union is to carry out the wishes of the majority. If Royal Mail refused to negotiate a deal for deliveries then this should have been passed back to the membership for a vote for Industrial Action, although I believe the CWU were given this mandate in the vote which followed the consultation.

[dvbuk55]

Lincox, a seperate deal for deliveries would be the ideal but it will never happen. If there was even the slightest hope of getting this then I would vote no but let's be realistic here. Is there anything in the CWUs track record that shows they can achieve this or that even know where to start with it?

That's well put judgee and true but it would be better for the union to be honest with the members that they can no longer negotiate successfully instead of pretending the sun shines out of their arse.