Change to come

[Godric]

been told by a lino that these 1991 figures dingo is spouting is for the London and Manchester area where Tnt are delivering mail in competition with Royal mail and like everything that is wrong with the UK dingo/Union equates London figures as the figures for the rest of the UK

[dvbuk55]

been told by a lino that these 1991 figures dingo is spouting is for the London and Manchester area where Tnt are delivering mail in competition with Royal mail and like everything that is wrong with the UK dingo/Union equates London figures as the figures for the rest of the UK

Well that wouldn't surprise me in the slightest, dingo thinks the CWU stops at the Watford Gap.

[RTP]

been told by a lino that these 1991 figures dingo is spouting is for the London and Manchester area where Tnt are delivering mail in competition with Royal mail and like everything that is wrong with the UK dingo/Union equates London figures as the figures for the rest of the UK

Yeah and aren't London on something like 60 bsi? As the song goes "there may be trouble ahead".

[Martin Walsh]

been told by a lino that these 1991 figures dingo is spouting is for the London and Manchester area where Tnt are delivering mail in competition with Royal mail and like everything that is wrong with the UK dingo/Union equates London figures as the figures for the rest of the UK

Yes your Lino knows more that Stephen Agar who is in charge of the letter strategy. Dream on ! You probably still think the world is square as well. It's easy to attack an indivdual and you then complain about bullying ! I have never run away from a debate but let's have a debate not my Lino told me.

For the record TNT have captured 6% of the letter traffic in west London where they have been in operation since 2012. Less in South West London and the city and are just begining to take traffic in Manchester . Now if TNT was to ever get rid of our vat exemption then that would signicantly increase. Remember the Mail TNT delivers is what contracts they have from dsa so it does not now come into Royal Mail at all.

[dvbuk55]

Vote NO.

[Godric]

been told by a lino that these 1991 figures dingo is spouting is for the London and Manchester area where Tnt are delivering mail in competition with Royal mail and like everything that is wrong with the UK dingo/Union equates London figures as the figures for the rest of the UK

Yes your Lino knows more that Stephen Agar who is in charge of the letter strategy. Dream on ! You probably still think the world is square as well. It's easy to attack an indivdual and you then complain about bullying ! I have never run away from a debate but let's have a debate not my Lino told me.

For the record TNT have captured 6% of the letter traffic in west London where they have been in operation since 2012. Less in South West London and the city and are just begining to take traffic in Manchester . Now if TNT was to ever get rid of our vat exemption then that would signicantly increase. Remember the Mail TNT delivers is what contracts they have from dsa so it does not now come into Royal Mail at all.

so you are taking the advice of some royal mail spiv who hasn't done our job and has a agenda to spout these ludicrous figures ... ever heard the line ... "spout a lie often enough and it becomes fact" that is what you and your colleagues are guilty of ... believing the lies coming from a Royal Mail spiv

[halfull]

been told by a lino that these 1991 figures dingo is spouting is for the London and Manchester area where Tnt are delivering mail in competition with Royal mail and like everything that is wrong with the UK dingo/Union equates London figures as the figures for the rest of the UK

Yes your Lino knows more that Stephen Agar who is in charge of the letter strategy. Dream on ! You probably still think the world is square as well. It's easy to attack an indivdual and you then complain about bullying ! I have never run away from a debate but let's have a debate not my Lino told me.

For the record TNT have captured 6% of the letter traffic in west London where they have been in operation since 2012. Less in South West London and the city and are just begining to take traffic in Manchester . Now if TNT was to ever get rid of our vat exemption then that would signicantly increase. Remember the Mail TNT delivers is what contracts they have from dsa so it does not now come into Royal Mail at all.

give it a rest,please!

[Glenno]

Stephen Agar is the most boring person I have ever had the privilidge to meet, he may be in charge of Letter Stratergy but he cannot hold a conversation on a 1 to 1 basis, and this is the real problem, the upper end of the Union think they can connect with these people...

[fishtank]

I do believe mail is down significantly on 2005 levels however it is very naive to take anything senior Royal Mail managers tell you as gospel. This isn't particularly a dig at them but it is their job to squeeze every bit of productivity they can from staff and a common management negotiation technique is to downplay workload and exaggerate financial constraints on the business.

Royal Mail has publicly stated that it is now in the business of managing the decline in letters, It is likely that they will use this decline to force through cuts so it is obviously in their interests if not to blatantly lie then certainly to overplay the significance of this decline. I'm not sure what the union's motivation for parroting this would be though other than maybe they see those cuts coming, are unable or unwilling to fight them and are preparing the members for the worst.

Funnily enough I remember when the volumes were rocketing about 10 years ago being told be senior management that it takes exactly the same time to deliver 10 letters to an address as it does to deliver 1 so there was no need for investment in deliveries...does the same argument not work in reverse?
Volume is not directly proportional to call rate, a 10% reduction in mail does not make a 10% shorter delivery.

[Pinky 1]

Question.
If this ballot carries a yes vote we'll all get a pay rise and backpay, presumably fairly quickly.
Within a few months the D.O.'s kick off 'cause nothing's changed and demand a national ballot is held.
This produces a mandate for strike action.

So Royal Mail tear up this new agreement 'cause we've broken our side of the deal.
Do we fall back to the 2010 agreement, and revel in our new found wealth ?

[dvbuk55]

Question.
If this ballot carries a yes vote we'll all get a pay rise and backpay, presumably fairly quickly.
Within a few months the D.O.'s kick off 'cause nothing's changed and demand a national ballot is held.
This produces a mandate for strike action.

So Royal Mail tear up this new agreement 'cause we've broken our side of the deal.
Do we fall back to the 2010 agreement, and revel in our new found wealth ?

You seriously think that the CWU, if this agreement is carried, is going to back a national ballot for strike action - in reality it doesn't have to be strike action.

[BernardBresslaw]

It comes as no surprise that key union figures are now trying to force a hackneyed agreement through, using RM spokespersons propoganda as justification. They might as well be the same company now.

Vote NO.

[Godric]

I do believe mail is down significantly on 2005 levels however it is very naive to take anything senior Royal Mail managers tell you as gospel. This isn't particularly a dig at them but it is their job to squeeze every bit of productivity they can from staff and a common management negotiation technique is to downplay workload and exaggerate financial constraints on the business.

Royal Mail has publicly stated that it is now in the business of managing the decline in letters, It is likely that they will use this decline to force through cuts so it is obviously in their interests if not to blatantly lie then certainly to overplay the significance of this decline. I'm not sure what the union's motivation for parroting this would be though other than maybe they see those cuts coming, are unable or unwilling to fight them and are preparing the members for the worst.

Funnily enough I remember when the volumes were rocketing about 10 years ago being told be senior management that it takes exactly the same time to deliver 10 letters to an address as it does to deliver 1 so there was no need for investment in deliveries...does the same argument not work in reverse?
Volume is not directly proportional to call rate, a 10% reduction in mail does not make a 10% shorter delivery.

you are 100% correct Fishtank

[hans solo]

Question.
If this ballot carries a yes vote we'll all get a pay rise and backpay, presumably fairly quickly.
Within a few months the D.O.'s kick off 'cause nothing's changed and demand a national ballot is held.
This produces a mandate for strike action.

So Royal Mail tear up this new agreement 'cause we've broken our side of the deal.
Do we fall back to the 2010 agreement, and revel in our new found wealth ?

You seriously think that the CWU, if this agreement is carried, is going to back a national ballot for strike action - in reality it doesn't have to be strike action.

but we can take action and leave out 60bsi london to makke sure its not national