LTB 464/13 - National Talks - Pay and Conditions

[woofwoof]

LTB 464/13 - National Talks - Pay and Conditions




No. 464/2013


Ref: 60000


Date: 5th July 2013






TO: ALL BRANCHES WITH POSTAL MEMBERS








Dear Colleague


NATIONAL TALKS - PAY AND CONDITIONS


Following the rejection of Royal Mail’s pay and conditions offer, a meeting took place this week to confirm CWU’s reasons for rejection and explore a structure for future negotiations covering the issues published in yesterday’s Special Report.


Contrary to some media speculation based on a company press release, Royal Mail confirmed that the published offer was not their final position and they would be making a fresh pay offer in due course.


The CWU reaffirmed that we were committed to negotiations but also advised the company that if we could not resolve all outstanding issues, then a National industrial action ballot was inevitable. We expect further meetings in the coming weeks and any developments will be reported in due course.


Any enquiries on the content of this LTB should be directed to the DGS (P) Department.




Yours sincerely









Dave Ward
Deputy General Secretary (P)

[Cut Off King]

Am I right in thinking that if RM & CWU come to an agreement over everything else EXCEPT privatisation, the union could NOT call a strike over this one issue ?

[woofwoof]

No strings attached pay deal has nothing to do with privatization

[fishtank]

Am I right in thinking that if RM & CWU come to an agreement over everything else EXCEPT privatisation, the union could NOT call a strike over this one issue ?

The union cannot strike solely over privatisation,It's a legal minefield.
The union cannot just accept privatisation,certainly officially,that would be suicidal.
It will be interesting how this will play out....

I would expect RM to throw a big juicy carrot on the table in the next 7 days,something that is going to be difficult for the union to reject outright,possibly decoupling the pension issue.
If the pension issue remains tied to the pay offer it gives the union a get out clause.
I think they will position this as their final offer.

I don't think the "talks" actually mean much,I think the business already knows its next move.

If the union were left with only privatisation to fight it could still do it by continuing to campaign publicly,still fight politically,say all the right things..........and other things.

[Jynxx]

It could have been RM's tactics all along to threaten the pensions, get everyone freaked then come back with another offer not including the pensions. (They'll attack them after privatisation)

[Cut Off King]

Am I right in thinking that if RM & CWU come to an agreement over everything else EXCEPT privatisation, the union could NOT call a strike over this one issue ?

The union cannot strike solely over privatisation,It's a legal minefield.
The union cannot just accept privatisation,certainly officially,that would be suicidal.
It will be interesting how this will play out....

I would expect RM to throw a big juicy carrot on the table in the next 7 days,something that is going to be difficult for the union to reject outright,possibly decoupling the pension issue.
If the pension issue remains tied to the pay offer it gives the union a get out clause.
I think they will position this as their final offer.

I don't think the "talks" actually mean much,I think the business already knows its next move.

If the union were left with only privatisation to fight it could still do it by continuing to campaign publicly,still fight politically,say all the right things..........and other things.

I think that RM will be throwing a good offer our way, to help split the membership. I've already heard members complaining that the CWU should have accepted the first offer, and after last time they ain't gonna vote to strike again.

[Danelectro]

any idea what a good offer or juicy carrot will look like? because no strike = privatisation = any good offer likely to vaporise fairly soon and surely the lessons of decoupling the pension have been learned?

Regarding the pension and I mean the pre 2008 pension-what percentage of staff in Royal mail are in that scheme?

Also will any state majority stake privatisation(51%) be considered by the CWU as a compromise in the admittedly unlikely event that for whatever reason the investors are scared off etc

[fishtank]

any idea what a good offer or juicy carrot will look like?

Bump the pay offer up to 9%(3% per year),decouple both the pension issue and the "future strategy" talks until later and pay the £300 lump sum now(bin the no strike clause).
Commit to protecting MTSF and other T&Cs for 5 years and make some noises about legally binding(don't think it's even possible).

The union would find it very difficult to justify not putting that to the membership.
This isn't a secret,they're not stupid and we've made it clear what we're looking for.

If they leave the pension issue in and the industrial action clause in we'll know they don't actually want a deal because they are well aware we can't under any circumstances swallow either.

[Danelectro]

any idea what a good offer or juicy carrot will look like?

Bump the pay offer up to 9%(3% per year),decouple both the pension issue and the "future strategy" talks until later and pay the £300 lump sum now(bin the no strike clause).
Commit to protecting MTSF and other T&Cs for 5 years and make some noises about legally binding(don't think it's even possible).

The union would find it very difficult to justify not putting that to the membership.
This isn't a secret,they're not stupid and we've made it clear what we're looking for.

If they leave the pension issue in and the industrial action clause in we'll know they don't actually want a deal because they are well aware we can't under any circumstances swallow either.

To me It depends on how true the promise of mega IA by the CWU is because the Government and Royal mail are gonna call that bluff.I just cant see us getting much without some sort of strongly supported IA and at the moment I cant make up my mind if the support for it is there or not.

Also not sure I can believe that a government that forced the disabled and the seriously ill into a Cecil B Demille benefits process resulting in some cases their death is gonna give a toss about petitions,rational arguments and the usual suspects.

For me locally since the CB Ballot there's not been enough regular communications to combat the daily Royal mail propaganda and they are turning a few heads and that's gotta improve if the real aim is to do anything to halt privatisation which if HQ are to believed is the only way to guarantee securing jobs and pay etc.

[Cut Off King]

any idea what a good offer or juicy carrot will look like?

Bump the pay offer up to 9%(3% per year),decouple both the pension issue and the "future strategy" talks until later and pay the £300 lump sum now(bin the no strike clause).
Commit to protecting MTSF and other T&Cs for 5 years and make some noises about legally binding(don't think it's even possible).

The union would find it very difficult to justify not putting that to the membership.
This isn't a secret,they're not stupid and we've made it clear what we're looking for.

If they leave the pension issue in and the industrial action clause in we'll know they don't actually want a deal because they are well aware we can't under any circumstances swallow either.

You've got it right . Thats why RM have spent a small fortune on RMTV, Courier specials, teamtalks ect.
Its a drip - drip - drip effect that slowly wears most down & new entrants know nothing less.

"Mails Down"
"Parcels are our growth area"
"World class mail"
"Our people"
resistance is futile.........

[mandelsons_toenail]

For me

3% rise
Time and half o/t
£1000 lump sum
No strings
No strike action strings, strikes are strikes
Settle all bt2010 payments to offices who haven't had money
Sort the revision f**k ups
£200 Xmas bonus for all
10 year guarantee on t+c
Profit share
Management cull

I'd take that

[Danelectro]

The prediction that roughly an extra £12 a week in your pocket this year along with the dubious claim/agreement of 5 years relative job security is an offer that must be put to the members is a sore one to take.