we lose colleague shares!managers get increased bonus??

[DB1100]

The D2D issue does get people riled, but thinking about it, i dont think it was as terrible as people make out. Regardless of how many i get i still get the £20. I probably average 3 a week. The good bit is that i still get the supplement when im not delivering them. So as i work one in six thats 8 weeks for starters, plus my six weeks holiday plus any sick leave. RM COULD have offered sweet FA with them being included in workload. Sure, given the option i would have kept the per item payment, but while its certainly not "the deal of the century" it could have been worse.

It is worse for part timers,they do the same as full timers but get paid less,in fact on p/l duties they are usually the walkers so they actually deliver more for less and that ain't fair is it.

Perhaps you are advocating different pay rates for the different parts of the working day. Sorting at £8:30 Prepping at £7.50. Delivering Letters £9.35 Delivering Large packets £8.95. Driving at £9.10 - boy that would be messy.

Or perhaps you are advocating piece work - not a good idea if you accept the argument over declining volumes. Would be an open door for 8 hour deliveries or more.

Or perhaps piece work based on the different sizes.

Its not perfect but being paid the same hourly rate whatever the amount of hours you do is the fairest, but I am more than willing to listen to suggestions, as long as pay levels remain the same if not better for all.

Oh and when we get P&L me as a FT on 39 hours will be the walker of our pairing.

What are you on about,I merely stated that a part timer gets paid less for doing the same d2d's and in a p/l is USUALLY the walker and you start going on about piece work and different pay rates,stop trying to confuse the issue,the delivery supplement should be the same for everybody in delivery it would be the only fair way.

[fishtank]

What are you on about,I merely stated that a part timer gets paid less for doing the same d2d's.

But they don't.
A part-timer earns the same per hour as a full-timer.
Therefore they must earn exactly the same for delivering D2D.

[DB1100]

What are you on about,I merely stated that a part timer gets paid less for doing the same d2d's.

But they don't.
A part-timer earns the same per hour as a full-timer.
Therefore they must earn exactly the same for delivering D2D.

Not quite,I think a part timer is on more an hour than a full timer to make up for the 1hr drop a full timer got,anyhow the only difference between a f/t and a p/t is the indoor element i.e sorting and prepping,the actual delivery span is no different between a f/t or p/t so therefore for delivering d2d's a p/t gets less than a f/t.

[Sidley]

Or as has been pointed out ad nauseum, no one gets paid anything for delivering d2d.

[DB1100]

Or as has been pointed out ad nauseum, no one gets paid anything for delivering d2d.

But judging by the comments on here it is still looked upon as payment for delivering them,and how does that affect my argument that the delivery supplement should be the same for everybody who deliver's them.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

The drop from 40 hours to 39 hours at the same weekly wage means a 2.5% hourly increase in pay - exactly the same pay raise as PTimers got.

1/40th = 2.5%

If the actual delivery span is the same for FT and PT I can't see the logic behind your claim that PTimers get paid less. The hourly pay is the same rate and the Delivery Supplement is also based pro-rata on the number of hours you work. If PTs go over their contracted hours then their hourly rate goes up to take the extra Delivery Supplement into account. Thats the reason I suggested you may be advocating different rates of pay for different parts of the job.

If you work out what a PT would get doing the same job as they do now, but doing it for 39 hours (including pay and delivery supplement and the overtime rate up to 39 hours) it would match the FTimers exactly.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Or as has been pointed out ad nauseum, no one gets paid anything for delivering d2d.

But judging by the comments on here it is still looked upon as payment for delivering them,and how does that affect my argument that the delivery supplement should be the same for everybody who deliver's them.

Because per hour the delivery supplement is exactly the same for every OPG.

(albeit the slight difference caused by purchasing leave put to one side)

[Sidley]

It has little to do with the latter but the sooner everyone accepts that we don't get paid for d2d the less these cyclical arguments will happen and folk won't get so confused as to why F/t and p/t are paid different amounts.

Yes the walks are the same but the lengths of the duty aren't, hence the larger amount of supplement paid to f/t.

[DB1100]

It has little to do with the latter but the sooner everyone accepts that we don't get paid for d2d the less these cyclical arguments will happen and folk won't get so confused as to why F/t and p/t are paid different amounts.

Yes the walks are the same but the lengths of the duty aren't, hence the larger amount paid of supplement paid to f/t.

The walks are the same so the delivery supplement should be the same.It should have nothing to do with the indoor element.Part timers are treated very badly in this company.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

It has little to do with the latter but the sooner everyone accepts that we don't get paid for d2d the less these cyclical arguments will happen and folk won't get so confused as to why F/t and p/t are paid different amounts.

Yes the walks are the same but the lengths of the duty aren't, hence the larger amount paid of supplement paid to f/t.

The walks are the same so the delivery supplement should be the same.It should have nothing to do with the indoor element.Part timers are treated very badly in this company.

So are you advocating different pay rates for Indoor Delivery Work and Outdoor delivery work because that would be result of only paying the delivery supplement for the outdoor element.

[DB1100]

The drop from 40 hours to 39 hours at the same weekly wage means a 2.5% hourly increase in pay - exactly the same pay raise as PTimers got.

1/40th = 2.5%

If the actual delivery span is the same for FT and PT I can't see the logic behind your claim that PTimers get paid less. The hourly pay is the same rate and the Delivery Supplement is also based pro-rata on the number of hours you work. If PTs go over their contracted hours then their hourly rate goes up to take the extra Delivery Supplement into account. Thats the reason I suggested you may be advocating different rates of pay for different parts of the job.

If you work out what a PT would get doing the same job as they do now, but doing it for 39 hours (including pay and delivery supplement and the overtime rate up to 39 hours) it would match the FTimers exactly.

What I am saying is,that as it is a delivery supplement,a payment for delivery in other words if the delivery spans are the same for a f/t and a p/t why should the payments not be the same,is it right that some people get paid it for indoor work.

[DB1100]

It has little to do with the latter but the sooner everyone accepts that we don't get paid for d2d the less these cyclical arguments will happen and folk won't get so confused as to why F/t and p/t are paid different amounts.

Yes the walks are the same but the lengths of the duty aren't, hence the larger amount paid of supplement paid to f/t.

The walks are the same so the delivery supplement should be the same.It should have nothing to do with the indoor element.Part timers are treated very badly in this company.

So are you advocating different pay rates for Indoor Delivery Work and Outdoor delivery work because that would be result of only paying the delivery supplement for the outdoor element.

What I am saying is that the supplement should only be for outdoor delivery work,is it right that the P.H.G gets the full supplement but never delivers any,I don't think so.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

The drop from 40 hours to 39 hours at the same weekly wage means a 2.5% hourly increase in pay - exactly the same pay raise as PTimers got.

1/40th = 2.5%

If the actual delivery span is the same for FT and PT I can't see the logic behind your claim that PTimers get paid less. The hourly pay is the same rate and the Delivery Supplement is also based pro-rata on the number of hours you work. If PTs go over their contracted hours then their hourly rate goes up to take the extra Delivery Supplement into account. Thats the reason I suggested you may be advocating different rates of pay for different parts of the job.

If you work out what a PT would get doing the same job as they do now, but doing it for 39 hours (including pay and delivery supplement and the overtime rate up to 39 hours) it would match the FTimers exactly.

What I am saying is,that as it is a delivery supplement,a payment for delivery in other words if the delivery spans are the same for a f/t and a p/t why should the payments not be the same,is it right that some people get paid it for indoor work.

They are the same if you look at the hourly rate. They are only different if you look at the take home pay.

[DB1100]

That's it in a nutshell,for doing exactly the same deliveries f/t take home £20.00 and a p/t on 30hrs takes home £15.00,not a vast difference but it all adds up,I see your side of the argument but it should never have been agreed on by the union.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

What I am saying is that the supplement should only be for outdoor delivery work,is it right that the P.H.G gets the full supplement but never delivers any,I don't think so.

I would tend to agree with the PHG indoor worker position, I think perhaps there should be different supplements for indoor work (callers office getting more than we do, locker staff less perhaps), but so far you've based your position on FT/PT - not on the content of the work undertaken. Thats why I keep saying we need to argue from facts and not from perception.

Your argument which gets a lot of sympathy from me and probably most delivery staff is that the physical aspect of delivery work should be recognised more than its is. It shouldn't be based on the hours they do (apart from fixing an hourly rate) but on whether they physically do any delivery work.

Even that causes problems, but these would be easily sorted if we could get our heads round how the delivery supplement works now. If works now by paying everyone the same hourly rate when they work in the Delivery Sector of Royal Mail Letters.