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Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Postal workers discussion forum. Discuss the day to day life in a Blue Shirt.
fishtank
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by fishtank »

Dee Plish wrote:Higson "shocked" by all this? Nah. Completely unbelievable. Nothing but an act IMHO.

The same line comes out from senior management every time.
It's just a few "rogue managers"...honest...we'll have a word...As if we are to believe that these so-called rogue managers are allowed to make these kinds of decisions without first getting the nod from above....going "rogue" like that would be employment suicide and every manager knows it.

How thick do you have to be to believe the lie?
I await the next joint statement. :cuppa
good times, bad times you know I've had my share
dvbuk55
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by dvbuk55 »

fishtank wrote:
Dee Plish wrote:Higson "shocked" by all this? Nah. Completely unbelievable. Nothing but an act IMHO.

The same line comes out from senior management every time.
It's just a few "rogue managers"...honest...we'll have a word...As if we are to believe that these so-called rogue managers are allowed to make these kinds of decisions without first getting the nod from above....going "rogue" like that would be employment suicide and every manager knows it.

How thick do you have to be to believe the lie?
I await the next joint statement. :cuppa
Here it is:

JOINT STATEMENT

ROYAL MAIL and the cwu have decided to do away with the sham of a new understanding and trust and are going back to the old we'll do as we please and f*ck you that it has always been for the last few years.
hans solo
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by hans solo »

showed members in my office west scot the friday ltb
they were absolutely shocked and disgusted that senior cwu reps area div national allowed unagreed bsi to be built into revisions and are still continuing with this process right now with cwu support.
what they raised was ALL members of cwu who endorsed and signed of iwt rates using bsi of 100+ should resign
as they must have had full knowledge of what was happening and did nothing about it
also where does this leave us now as compared to offices on different bsi rates
do we take action ?
where is the national support for all the scott/northern divisions who have been decieved by rm and cwu
whole thing stinks ,do we revert to standards of our southern colleagues
are we to be treated the same (we are in the same :left: union after all)
some answers would be useful before any action might surfaces
Budfrog
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by Budfrog »

hans solo wrote:they were absolutely shocked and disgusted that senior cwu reps area div national allowed unagreed bsi to be built into revisions and are still continuing with this process right now with cwu support.
100Bsi is ridiculous - if the EP measurement systems are accurate the absolute Max should be 75 Bsi and that is the International Standard for Dayrate i.e. non-financial incentive work (output related bonus/piecework). Mail Centres have been targetted at 75 Bsi (manual) 85 Bsi (Mech) in the past >>> why should deliveries be 33% higher ???
clashcityrocker
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by clashcityrocker »

100 bsi is ridiculous.
But 109 gives them the savings they are looking for...........
The societies of consumption and squandering of material resources are incompatible with the idea of economic growth and a clean planet.
IloveMYredTROLLEY!
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by IloveMYredTROLLEY! »

Why stop at 109BSI? Lets call it 1002345943859348BSI and make one personal run the whole delivery service for the nation... It must be possible if the computer says it is! :arrrghhh
Martin Walsh
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by Martin Walsh »

The thing is Mark Higson normally gets told what he wants to hear not always the truth. At the Royal Mail briefing where all the reps were invited it was very stage managed and that was prior to the joint statements on the model week , Inward working methods and the 100 BSi issue ie no agreement to 100 BSi.

The new Regional management structure is Mark Higsons last throw of the dice to achieve the savings which he promised to the share holder the government and the regulator. it is clear that all the revisons which were either ongoing prior to the new management change or had been agreed under the old regional set up , this applies to the whole of the UK and they want to maximise the savings from phase 2 outputs which are based on 100 BSi which comes down when you put the manuel adjustments in under phase 4 and of course you negotiate the journey.

In addition they seem to now have a default start time of 0700 which clear drivers your finish time , they want to review The CSS operation on a Sunday night and have this done in the mail centre. on top of this they want to review the utilisation of CSS machines in units , plus they have a default delivery span of a miniumn of 4 hours rising to suit the duty modeller and the attendance pattern you have. They have broken the national joints statements on model week , performance as well as the national agreement.

of course some have said on here that it was obvious that Royal Mail would break any agreement which indicates they did not want any agreement. however more mail centre closed when they was no agreement and more savings came out before the agreement from 2008 to 20010 0.9 billion was saved as opposed to 0.7 billion from 2010 to 2012.
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by POSTMAN »

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I Wrote-During Covid-Which is still relevant now
It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
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The daily grind of having to argue your case with an intellectual pigmy of a line manager is physically and emotionally draining.
dvbuk55
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by dvbuk55 »

dingo wrote:The thing is Mark Higson normally gets told what he wants to hear not always the truth. At the Royal Mail briefing where all the reps were invited it was very stage managed and that was prior to the joint statements on the model week , Inward working methods and the 100 BSi issue ie no agreement to 100 BSi.
Is that what the CWU are doing - did Higson think DWard was lying in November 2011?
fishtank
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by fishtank »

dingo wrote:of course some have said on here that it was obvious that Royal Mail would break any agreement which indicates they did not want any agreement.
No it didn't.
Only an idiot would think that we could continue without an agreement.
What you need with an employer who will use every trick in the book to renege on an agreement is as simple and clear an agreement as possible to reduce the possibility of "confusion" or "misunderstandings"...a plan B that both sides understand for when the employer does play silly buggers and the balls to use it.
We have had none of these and have spent the last two years fudging and fidgeting and humming and hawing and more or less leaving members to fry in the sun.
It has not been our finest hour dingo no matter what spin or polish is put on it. :cuppa
good times, bad times you know I've had my share
Martin Walsh
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by Martin Walsh »

thebiggestman wrote:It was the union that shut East London as they did Oxford and Liverpool etc this is because the last time the union needed help to save it's very existence these places pulled out all the stops and went on strike above and beyond and how were they repaid with an agreement with Mail Centre closure at it's core. And the promises of the hierarchy were not forthcoming and without a whimper they were allowed to shut. Its alright sprouting job numbers and duties to go to but it's the job security and the stronghold of a good place of to work you have allowed to be destroyed and now they've finished off the Mail Centres they're coming back for deliveries and you can't see the wood for your own kudos so when you've finished patting yourself on the back there's a job to be done or shall all the delivery members that supported this union wholeheartedly suffer the same fate?
That's simpy not true , mail centres were closing before their was an agreement on Business Transformation , ie Liverpool , Oxford , Reading , Crewe , Stockport , Covertry , Northampton , Milton Keynes , Paddington , North London , South East London , West Central , West 1 , North West London , KEB , Oldham . All these mail centres closed before their was a national agreement on building transformation.

East Londom is closing not because you supported the national union , South London and the Mount done the same amount of strikes as East London , it closed because since the move from Whitecahpel is that Royal Mail believe they could not make productivity improvements in the same way they made them elsewhere. Back in 2008 well before the strike and well before the business transformation agreement Royal Mail appointed a project team to close two London mail centres after East London rejected another revison this was the second after the stansted talks with the Branch. East London had everything going for it , the growth the Thames corridor and the Olympic regelation. The union produced an independent report which supported East London closing but no one in Royal Mail was willing to change their proposal to close East and South London.

The ballot we had and the support we had right across the country was for no complusory redundancies it was not to protect bricks and mortar. The joint statement was endorsed by your Branch which said East London would close providing that all the people were resolved and that quality would be protected. There is a people's resolution for all with many going to the Mount which was not originally available.

it is a sad time because we believe East London should remain open but the employer who pays the wages have said it is ceasing production , we might all not like that but to blame the union is simply wrong and not factually correct. At no time since the joint statement last June has anyone in Royal Mail or in the CWU at Divisonal or national level said East London was staying open. Our aim has been to deal with the people in the right way and during this process we have managed to delay the closing of East London by 9 months it was due to close in January 2012 and that was delayed by 6 months by the Hibbert report.

So the business transformation agreement did not close East London , it would have closed with or without the agreement as both Liverpool and Oxford two which you mention closed when we did not have a business Transformtion agreement.
Martin Walsh
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by Martin Walsh »

Fish you don't talk for everyone on this site , I was responding to a point which was made which said why did the union believe That Royal Mail would honour an agreement. But if we don't trust them then we could never get an agreement.

See I disagree we have had many a fall out since the BusinessnTransformation agreement and normally with the help of ACAS and Roger Poole we have a found a solution. What we have not been good enough at and should be criticised for is there has not been enough help for local reps and members during revisons and not enough help for revison disasters.

it has to be said the delivery aspect is one of the most complex agreements ever when you do the six step process and which included is simply losing some of our reps and members.

The stakes are high for Royal Mail and for Mark Higson they are trying to Manipulate the remaining plan to get their savings and we cannot allow them to do it.
dvbuk55
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by dvbuk55 »

I dont know why we are still fudging the issue that BT2010 was a disaster for deliveries - I don't think the union understood the implications they were agreeing to and the agreement was far too complicated without the i's dotted and the t's crossed before the rollout began. The union left no time to properly evaluate or trial the implications of the changes to delivery. Here we are less than 2 years into CSS and already RM are bored with it. Who in their right mind would invest in machinery that only sequences a very limited amount of a declining mail when packets and large flats are the increasing mail volumes. RM and the CWU are like headless chickens neither knowing how to move forward and run a mailing business without recourse to other models which in themselves aren't working. Who said that other companies would jump on the bandwagon and steal the delivery market when we said that was bollocks - has anyone attempted to invest in such a manpower led operation - NO and neither will they.
fishtank
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by fishtank »

dingo wrote:we have had many a fall out since the BusinessnTransformation agreement and normally with the help of ACAS and Roger Poole we have a found a solution.
No dingo there have been no solutions to the core problems of delivery revisions,only fudges and "on paper" fixes that made the negotiators feel better about themselves but no real difference on the shop floor.
That's why the bulk of the revisions that failed 18 months ago are still failing,or have just gone over to a chaotic mix of overtime resource and bad practice.
The tools RM are using for indoor and outdoor resource are so complex that they hide a multitude of back alleys for management and planners to play cat and mouse with a rep for decades and the whole agenda is savings led.
A tweak here and a small change there isn't a solution,it's a band aid on an amputation.
good times, bad times you know I've had my share
clashcityrocker
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Re: Divsional Reps meeting with Mark Higson

Post by clashcityrocker »

fishtank wrote: The tools RM are using for indoor and outdoor resource are so complex that they hide a multitude of back alleys for management and planners to play cat and mouse with a rep for decades
And without the support of Area and Divisional reps a unit rep has got little or no chance.
Do the Area and Divisional reps understand the tools any better?
The societies of consumption and squandering of material resources are incompatible with the idea of economic growth and a clean planet.