Modernisation? NO NEED WHAT SO EVER!

[hatetheboss]

I would start helping the offices that are now in the s**t and not sit back and let it happen. I would not have agreed a computer package to tell me how long I should take and I would not have left local Reps to fight a losing battle.

[fishtank]

so after you said its s**t what would be your next plan to stop it ?

You're right,sometimes you can't stop change and sometimes it's dangerous to try but when faced with a s**t plan i would have made damm sure my members knew how i felt about it from the start and that wouldn't mean pretending to be on board,pretending it will work,pretending it is working,pretending it might work,pretending it might just be teething problems and basically helping to cover up the fact we all knew from the start...the plan was s**t.
I'll be generous and say that on paper it didn't look that terrible but coupled with the management structure we have and have had for nearly 15 years now it had no chance.

I think it may take as much as 5 years to clean up the mess left behind from these revisions....and they are still going ahead...and even after 2 years of experience...some are still failing.
That's a hell of a legacy,Seb Coe will be jealous.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Plenty of people Sid it was s**t some of us was out for 20 days striking about it , but whilst we stopped some of their agenda we could not stop the introduction of automation,the drive to increase productivity , the introduction of CDVs and door to door into workload so after you said its s**t what would be your next plan to stop it ?

The problem is not what they are changing but how they are changing it. The single most effective implementation of any of these methods would be to talk to the people who do the work and can spot the flaws. The Union did not do that, in fact anyone in a decision making capacity at the Union has not done a Delivery or worked on a MC shift for a minimum of 10 years, so whilst they know the theory, may have been briefed excellently and indeed may believe they understand it completely. They have not, and are unlikely to ever be, actually be affected on a day to day operational basis. That I honestly believe is one of the reasons why the Union is seen out of touch and distant to ordinary members.

I know you disagree with me Dingo, but apart from defending your position, which you are entitled to do, what are the Union doing to try address this perception. The Union have to tackle this as the mutterings are starting to get louder, in fact I heard one activist here describe the current situation between the Union and RM as similar to the Con/Lib Dem Government, where one side does what they want in the sure and certain knowledge that the other will do anything to stay in power. I disagree with that description but I can see why he, and others, might hold that view.

[hatetheboss]

Our office needs that much extra time putting in, due to having to flex up, we can't generate enough overtime to cover the hours. Did the union think of that when they agreed all this.

[clashcityrocker]

Our office needs that much extra time putting in, due to having to flex up, we can't generate enough overtime to cover the hours.

Then your model week was set too low.

[Martin Walsh]

TBT , Royal Mail devloped their business plan over a couple of years visiting places like Holand and Germany and other countries. They trailed both the Siemans and Solisitc walk sequencing machines before choosing the solstice machine. They borrowed the money off the government for the purchase of the automation kit and therefore a requirement was to fully unitise the kit 6 nights per week which meant longer Saturdays. CDVs were purchased cause as everyone knows packets have dramatically increased over the last few years and the belief is CDVs would be much more advantageous then replenishing foot deliveries or cycle deliveries.

Royal Mail have wanted to put door to door into workload for over a decade , the union has managed to stall it for a number of years. Royal Mail also believed that letter traffic had decreased and the revenue had also decreased due to DSA , there take was that people were paid a wage for delivering mail inside their contracted hours and therefore should also deliver door to door for the basic weekly wage. Quality was crap on door to door and the ceiling of 3 prevented Royal mail from expanding the product. Royal Mail were not going to sit back and see revenue decline in our traditional market at the same time as not being allowed to grow the door to door market. They were on the verge of walking away from the door to door agreement which would have meant there was no money on offer.

Now you say why don't they ask the people who do the job , well people like Leighton and Crozier and Higson are paid huge sums by the Government to modernise the company and they do not often ask the workforce unless they know they will get the answer they want ie the pay and major agreement.

You then argue that because Divisonal reps , PEC members and area reps have not done a delivery for a period of time then they cannot deal with the issues. I think that is very blinkered, does that mean a member in one office should not then comment on another office cause they have not been their ? Or should a member not comment on how to negotiate anything cause they have never been in a set of Negotations and have no idea of the pressures which come from all sides including that some areas were a disaster in the national strike where more people were working then striking and the reps.

The unions processes should with Communcations , local reps should feed the members comments to the area reps and Branch's who should feed it to the Divisonal reps or headquarters. We have area briefings , Divisonal meetings with all area reps , we have national meetings , branch committee meetings , AGMs and conferences.

The fact is if you asked most members they would not want any change , no absorption , to use their cars on delivery and to finish early. All of those are fantasy requests. Yes in years goneby Royal Mail turned a blind eye to all of the above but we are in a different era and all of those are gone.

Now the reason I believe the Union is weaker is cause we are no longer a communuicating union. Local Reps , area reps and Branch's do not hold meetings in the workplace on a regular basis to hear the members concerns and to give them an update.

I can see why some believe that there is a partnership between the CWU and Royal Mail but again I think if you are in the know you can see that is not true as the amount of arguments and rows over policy , joint statements are just the same. However it's a Communcations issue again. Equaly over the years the CWU have been able to slow down change due to our strength , in fact had the unoffical action not taken place in 2003 after the national no vote and the yes vote for London weighting then there would have not been a CWU in the workplace.

In 2007 the dispute which was meant to be national did not have all parts of the UK out there were large pockets still in. We got a settlement which was endorsed by the members.

In 2009 local Branch's fought a national strike before two days of national strikes which again had even worse support then in 2007 and if it was not for the big cities then it would have been a problem if a third strike was called.

Change comes in every industry be that the print , the mines or the docks, the key is have we got benefits and have we got job security. Ask those industries if they wished for that during their change and disputes ? Plus has any union defeated privitisation 3 times and are still fight to stop the 4th ?

[dvbuk55]

Dingo says the union is failling to communicate and he is right - so what is happening to rectify that. It has been pointed out numerous times that communication is a fundemental problem and still it persists and the reason the membership thinks there is an unhealthy alliance between RM and the CWU is the procession of "Joint Statements". That only confirms the fact to the membership that the union is a junior partner in the sorry state we find ourselves in.
Nothing highlights the union is in deep trouble when a national election only had a tenth of the membership voting. It's time to wake up to the fact that the membership will only take being ignored for so long.

Does it matter that those negotiating have not done a delivery or worked on the shop floor for the last ten years? Well it's always worrrying when people are agreeing to changes in terms and conditions when their terms and conditions aren't changed in the slightest. It is always a worry when those who do nothing think those who are productive can always do more. It is always worrying when those who do have to produce are not consulted first.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Now you say why don't they ask the people who do the job , well people like Leighton and Crozier and Higson are paid huge sums by the Government to modernise the company and they do not often ask the workforce unless they know they will get the answer they want ie the pay and major agreement.

Cropped for brevity.

Thanks for the reply - but my main point, which this answer seems to be addressing, is that the Union did not seem to communicate with the people who were expected to do the job and get their opinions. We all know RM have an autocratic approach and I would not expect them to come down to our level. But the CWU represent me, and I certainly expect them to talk to me, or my colleagues.

Also to the other point about senior officials not having done the job for 10 years or so. My point is not that I think they are incapable of discussing matters and making decisions, or that they should not be able to comment on or adopt policies. What I am saying is that the job has changed massively in the 9 years I have been at Royal Mail, so much so that apart from the absolute basics of putting bits of paper through a letter box, or sorting them at an MC, the job is not the one I started back then. My view is that if senior officers say from Area Rep up to but not including HQ officers "got their hands dirty" and worked 5 days in a year in one of the functions they are covering, this would change the perception many ordinary members have that they are out of touch and in it for themselves. It doesn't have to 5 straight days it could be 1 day every couple of months.

I honestly believe it would improve communication, engagement and it would help FTR reps get the respect they deserve. You admit communication is poor, this one step could improve it immeasurably. You and the other FTR reps all work hard, but its not getting recognised by those on the shop floor, if you worked with them then perhaps you would get the opportunity to tell them.

[5plusbonusball]

To save money is the priority in this day and age, but why do we have so many people left in the offices when we are out? The customers are out there and so should ALL the managers - delivering. Just let one stay in to welcome us back . MANAGERS SHOULD WORK MORE OUTSIDE OR GET RID.

[Budfrog]

Thanks for the reply - but my main point, which this answer seems to be addressing, is that the Union did not seem to communicate with the people who were expected to do the job and get their opinions. We all know RM have an autocratic approach and I would not expect them to come down to our level. But the CWU represent me, and I certainly expect them to talk to me, or my colleagues.

When it comes to the central planning for initiatives such as delivery planning RM are all too eager to employ the services of graduates on more than decent salaries to design and roll out the projects. I don't doubt the intelligence of the vast majority of these people but many of them simply have not built up the background knowledge or experience to plan effectively and this is one of the main reasons that there are so many problems ...square pegs in round holes. For this type of activity above all you need to take on board the thoughts and ideas of the workforce, it is one of the basic principles of WCM and Lean Productivity .. but then working together isn't really top of the agenda (except in the Courier).

[spoodoo]

Weve lost a good number of full timers who'd been here for years but just had enough. We now have a huge shortage of staff, and the only people who are getting out on time are the dafties who all come in early ,not one person refuses lapsing or cuts off ,I soooo wanna cut off but the b and h will start once again. Everyone coming in on there day off,masks a badly run office also.

[london sub]

Unfortunately moderisation is happening every time their has been an agreement on pay and conditions. Pay and conditions are slowly eroding away to make way for privatisation and the union know this. The union are not the union they once used to be a decade ago but i will not doubt them because they have helped so many people out what ever the circumstances may have been.

I think the way moderisation has happened this time around is brutal to say the least. Its constant pressure from the management from the moment you step in the office. If you cut off you are more likely to be questioned why? and how? when traffic figures are so low? On the other hand claiming over time is a crime as well and still questions are raised as to why you have jotted down 10 minutes on the docket. So the scenario is a lose, lose situation. I want to move with the times and so does every one else in this business but the way its being mishandled and misguided by nearly all management is no way to run its people (especially in to the ground).

[Sharkeyes]

So in the same way a Motor company will say to their workforce we are no longer building the Capri we are now doing the cortina an Company can change the way it does things and no union has a veto on that .

This is more like watching Ford stop making the Focus and start making the Model T......out of used parts....with no instruction manual.
Couldn't someone from the union have at least stuck their hand up and said,by the way Mr H your plans are s**t,maybe you should ask those who have been building cars for years how to build a car?

Love it Fishtank, well said, couldn't have put it better.

[Sharkeyes]

I have long held the belief that the juggernaut that is the EU would like rid of National Institutions like RM, a symbol of National pride and identity.How much of this is engineered by our own Europhile
Civil servants I don't know.It is hard to guess the motivations and actions of those further up the food chain.
I don't know whether I'm overly paranoid but I sometimes wonder whether cuts to our Armed Forces are the precursor to calls for a single European Army ? One for a different forum I suppose.

Wessex, you have hit the nail on the head there.

Here are some facts about the 'EU' commanding of our country by Europhiles.
All of the 3 main parties are servants to the EU because not only do they have 'elected' MEP's they also have NON Elected commissioners such as Baroness Ashton, who decide on EU policy behind closed doors in smoke filled rooms in Brussels.

You are right when you mention about these cuts to our armed forces.
At some point in the not too distant future, The EU will come into political conflict with NATO over this very issue of a 'EUROPEAN ARMY'.

History has dictated that ONLY ONE single nation is worthy of the governance of a main player ARMY in Europe and that is the UK, but under the EU, ironically it would the one nation who, at the moment has restrictions on its military capabilities and world wide roles and that is.....,
Germany!
There is no way on this Earth that the USA, Canada and Turkey would be sidelined from the rest of the European NATO members by a splinter force set up by the EU.
For one , Canada is Commonwealth and came to our aid in the Second World War, as to the USA. There is far too much history of infighting, bitterness and bloody minded self centered territorial desires by European nations on their own neighbours, that none of them could ever be trusted to support another nation in their time of need.
Just look at the Falklands in 1982, the bloody French were still selling Exocet missiles to the 'Argies' to kill our Navy personnel, while we were both EU members. The whole EU thing stinks and is rotten to the core.
Our jobs are f****d purely because of the EU, no one else, but as you will see from the rise of UKIP, people are beginning to realise the truth about the EU and how it DOES AFFECT all of us as individuals.
Again you are right about their plans, which are frightening.
Come 2025, do you expect to be driving on the RIGHT HAND SIDE OPF THE ROAD?
do you expect that the UK will no longer be known as a COUNTRY but instead will be referred to and identified on a map as a REGION in the NORTH WEST STATE, which will comprise of the UK, Ireland, Belgium, Holland, Luxembourg, Northern Germany and Normandy & Brittany in France.
Miles will have to be replaced by KILOMETERS.
A new EUROPEAN COAST GUARD will replace the ROYAL NAVY to police EU WATERS, currently our own but everyones territorial waters will be accessed and policed by ALL EU members under one NAVAL banner of the EU. That is why the EU want Turkey to come in, to protect the EU's Eastern Region. They couldn't give a stuff about Turks or their posties either.
As posties, we are the ones who are bearing the brunt of the reality of the EU's EVIL PLANS in full. What is written above isn't 'folly', it is very very likely to actually happen within the next 15 to 20 years, if not sooner. That is why they want the Euro to NOT FAIL, because if it does, so too are the EU's plans for a European Super State.

[mccoop]

Fundamental markerting mistake!
"customers come first"Whats the point having a robust networking infrastructure if the product is recived to late in the day.
Bring back early starts,early post!Keep the customer happy.