This weeks Courier front page

[bigcol]

Sod that mate. Not correctly addressed, I kill it off. Sticker on it ticked with address incomplete.

[chunk]

Sorry you were out cards,
"complaints soar over cards put through doors by postmen while residents were actually in" ......Daily Mail

Yes sometimes customers ARE in but they have to answer the bloody door !!
Everyday I have one person who is in but doesnt answer the door.
WHAT THEY DONT TELL YOU IS :-
1/They had heaphones on and were singing at the top of their voice and couldnt hear you knocking and ringing the bell.
2/They were hoovering upstairs
3/Sunbathing in the garden
4/ asleep on the sofa
5/ Having a bath or shower
6/ doing Zumba upstairs to loud music
Do they actually think us postmen like writing a docket out and carry a packet for the rest of the loop rather than deliver the parcel ?

Its a crazy non story .why would you choose? to post a card and then take the packet away again.
. you need the info from the item item in order to fill in the red card.
in theory its possible to fill in red cards in the office in the morning but then why would you would leave the packets behind? if
your intending to deliver the red cards? where would you hide the packets or leave them on your frame/ how would you explain that if challenged by a manager or if your frame was spot checked while you were out.
also the red carded packets have to be delivered to the callers office at the end of your delivery.

nobody has shown me any clear gains/benefits of this mythical practice that would justify the lengths you would need to go.
like im going to walk up a path with a red card card and no packet in my possession ...how would i explain that if met at the door.

[Mr Rush]

Not correctly addressed, I kill it off. Sticker on it ticked with address incomplete.

I'm on a tenement walk and I've started taking a hardline on incompleted addresses. If I recognise the name I'll put it in the frame, but I'm not doing an investigation - it's not Christmas. There's a lot of short-term renting here, so there's a combination of incomplete addresses and no names on either the door entry system or the doors. RTS-ing a payslip or a giro usually gets that dealt with.

[clashcityrocker]

in theory its possible to fill in red cards in the office in the morning but then why would you would leave the packets behind? if
your intending to deliver the red cards? where would you hide the packets or leave them on your frame/ how would you explain that if challenged by a manager or if your frame was spot checked while you were out.

nobody has shown me any clear gains/benefits of this mythical practice that would justify the lengths you would need to go.
like im going to walk up a path with a red card card and no packet in my possession ...how would i explain that if met at the door.

Perhaps you work in an office where the packet area is not accessible to postmen.
If it isn't you don't have to leave them behind on your frame, you just go and put them away. Sometimes because you don't want to carry that particular packet due to its size/weight. Sometimes because you "know" they won't be in anyway.
Sometimes you 739'd a packet the day before. If they've got to come for that one, you may as well leave the next one as well.

The benefit is reducing weight on delivery. I thought that was one of the goals of BT2010.
Not that I do any of that. But I know it goes on.

[banner18]

in theory its possible to fill in red cards in the office in the morning but then why would you would leave the packets behind? if
your intending to deliver the red cards? where would you hide the packets or leave them on your frame/ how would you explain that if challenged by a manager or if your frame was spot checked while you were out.

nobody has shown me any clear gains/benefits of this mythical practice that would justify the lengths you would need to go.
like im going to walk up a path with a red card card and no packet in my possession ...how would i explain that if met at the door.

Perhaps you work in an office where the packet area is not accessible to postmen.
If it isn't you don't have to leave them behind on your frame, you just go and put them away. Sometimes because you don't want to carry that particular packet due to its size/weight. Sometimes because you "know" they won't be in anyway.
Sometimes you 739'd a packet the day before. If they've got to come for that one, you may as well leave the next one as well.

The benefit is reducing weight on delivery. I thought that was one of the goals of BT2010.
Not that I do any of that. But I know it goes on.

It's a load of junk. Why are you gonna do this when it will definately result in complaints and awkwardness when you will at some point inevitably bump into customers on there doorsteps. Maybe a few rogue postmen do this, but the vast majority do not and all the complaining is the result of an unreasonable subsection of the public.

I deliver packets all day and every other day get complaints that I didn't knock, knock loud enough or didn't wait etc... Well, let's break it down. The vast majority of items I get rid of, so either I am knocking and waiting correctly, or the customers at all these addresses happen to be walking out or see me from their windows every time I deliver. It is beyond reason for this to be true.
So, the answer is that we are knocking correctly and taking the parcel and the much more likely reason is that some people are distracted at the time of knocking. There are so many attention consuming distractions in the modern world it would be stupid to try and list them all.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard showers running, seen people on exercise bikes with earphones, heard the vacuum. The customer isn't always right!

[bigcol]

If the Area Manager tells me to do it, that's good enough for me.

[Zootsuit]

It irritates me when your'e delivering at the same time as a bunch of Jehovah's Witnesses or Mormons are in the area. Funny how often the door opens after you've had to slip someone then. ' Oh sorry I was in the bath, loo, loft or whatever'. How tempting it is to respond in a truthful manner....................

[chunk]

in theory its possible to fill in red cards in the office in the morning but then why would you would leave the packets behind? if
your intending to deliver the red cards? where would you hide the packets or leave them on your frame/ how would you explain that if challenged by a manager or if your frame was spot checked while you were out.

nobody has shown me any clear gains/benefits of this mythical practice that would justify the lengths you would need to go.
like im going to walk up a path with a red card card and no packet in my possession ...how would i explain that if met at the door.

Perhaps you work in an office where the packet area is not accessible to postmen.
If it isn't you don't have to leave them behind on your frame, you just go and put them away. Sometimes because you don't want to carry that particular packet due to its size/weight. Sometimes because you "know" they won't be in anyway.
Sometimes you 739'd a packet the day before. If they've got to come for that one, you may as well leave the next one as well.

The benefit is reducing weight on delivery. I thought that was one of the goals of BT2010.
Not that I do any of that. But I know it goes on.

Your right! our packet area is secure and only the phg can access it ,leaving packets there unobserved is almost impossible
maybe this is the answer to stopping this practice as if the packets are prevented from entering the callers office/packet storage section without first going through the phg (certainly in the morning ) job done!! a rm exec couldn't think this through because they haven't the hands on.
I still say posting a card with no packet in possession is Russian roulette surely and not something id ever do

[pahoehoe]

Ring the doorbell, knock on the door, fill out p739, walk away. If the occupant is too busy, lazy,noisy, on the toilet or knocking one out in front of the computer, it's not my problem.

[TheCobra]

in theory its possible to fill in red cards in the office in the morning but then why would you would leave the packets behind? if
your intending to deliver the red cards? where would you hide the packets or leave them on your frame/ how would you explain that if challenged by a manager or if your frame was spot checked while you were out.

nobody has shown me any clear gains/benefits of this mythical practice that would justify the lengths you would need to go.
like im going to walk up a path with a red card card and no packet in my possession ...how would i explain that if met at the door.

Perhaps you work in an office where the packet area is not accessible to postmen.
If it isn't you don't have to leave them behind on your frame, you just go and put them away. Sometimes because you don't want to carry that particular packet due to its size/weight. Sometimes because you "know" they won't be in anyway.
Sometimes you 739'd a packet the day before. If they've got to come for that one, you may as well leave the next one as well.

The benefit is reducing weight on delivery. I thought that was one of the goals of BT2010.
Not that I do any of that. But I know it goes on.

It's a load of junk. Why are you gonna do this when it will definately result in complaints and awkwardness when you will at some point inevitably bump into customers on there doorsteps. Maybe a few rogue postmen do this, but the vast majority do not and all the complaining is the result of an unreasonable subsection of the public.

I deliver packets all day and every other day get complaints that I didn't knock, knock loud enough or didn't wait etc... Well, let's break it down. The vast majority of items I get rid of, so either I am knocking and waiting correctly, or the customers at all these addresses happen to be walking out or see me from their windows every time I deliver. It is beyond reason for this to be true.
So, the answer is that we are knocking correctly and taking the parcel and the much more likely reason is that some people are distracted at the time of knocking. There are so many attention consuming distractions in the modern world it would be stupid to try and list them all.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard showers running, seen people on exercise bikes with earphones, heard the vacuum. The customer isn't always right!

I'm with you fella, I cannot really see the gains to be made in doing this, especially on P&L where you have a trolley/van to carry heavy packets. End of the day I wouldn't have the bollocks to write out red cards and just post them through without knocking, as you say, what if someone is there and comes running out after you, just not worth the hassle and complaints.

Can only think that maybe around 5% or less of postmen would actually do this. We live in a complaints culture, a certain percentage of complaints are gona happen no ,matter what we do, I just wish the company would chill out a bit with all these Courier articles which are pretty much coming from one point of view.

[wallop]

My own little theory about this problem is that it seems to have increased since people started getting cordless doorbells.
I must admit that when i pressed the bell and the little green light came on i presumed it was working this was before i even realised they were cordless it was only after i twigged that the people that appear after you've put the 739 through all seem to have the same doorbell.

[mclovin]

If the customer is always right how come mine are now complaining about late times of delivery but that complaint falls on deaf ears?

[clashcityrocker]

If the customer is always right how come mine are now complaining about late times of delivery but that complaint falls on deaf ears?

It's not so mich that the customer ia always right.
What they mean is - you are always wrong.