Union walking limit

[CORTINA]

Fishtank will know spot on

Under the last agreement I think its a max of 5 hours delivery per day.

But what is the max milage walked limit... that is the important question asked.. not the time limit

5 hours can mean any length or distance.....

One 5 hour walk can be 8 miles and another can be 6 miles.... nearly 500 MILES difference in a year .... between 2 posties.
5000 MILES difference in 10 years ...for the same pay.. someone needs to wise up ...where is the union when need them.

[Cut Off King]

where is the union when need them.

[fng]

where is the union when need them.

[CORTINA]

I take it that there is no official agreed walking daily limit...

Crazy really when the job is mainly involved in walking miles per day.....

With the loss of cycles and even more walking.... it would seem be a logic issue for the union to establish a limit, being the thoughtful caring union that we have and pay subs into ....

[Himaggen]

At last you've got it; There is no agreed limit for walking.

I'm intrigued to know why you think there would be and if it did exist what exactly you feel that limit should be.

<EDIT />
I am aware however that 'CWU Branch' is currently interested in a list of any duties which will generally have an outdoor delivery element in excess of five hours.

[CORTINA]

At last you've got it; There is no agreed limit for walking.

I'm intrigued to know why you think there would be and if it did exist what exactly you feel that limit should be.

<EDIT />
I am aware however that 'CWU Branch' is currently interested in a list of any duties which will generally have an outdoor delivery element in excess of five hours.

If having a lorry driving job there is a ...driving limit .......posties walk so why not a walking limit ....look after your legs they are not machines.... no other job I know has 6 - 8 mile daily walk attached to it...

Limits are there to stop injustice and people being taken advantage of.... 1 - 2 miles a day extra add and imposed this year to walks since cycle removal... 10 miles extra a week...?...any extra pay...?

Time worked limit for health and safety to avoid being over tired etc....

Walking distance limit is an obivous and health and safety point and of course the major fact that as you get older it will impact on your legs and joints .. for you to happily suffer from in your retirement.... as it stands now. A nice thankyou retirement present from RM

Put a walking limit to avoid some leg pain issues...its not rocket science ..just plain commonsense in this day and age... RM goes on about health and safety enough ...if you get leg issues, it is to late for you to turn back time after Viens and Muscles start giving you trouble.

Now say nobody suffers now with knee and leg problems... prevention is better than cure, as many walk more since cycles have been removed.... 1 - 2 miles to walk a day extra now....

Don`t say get another job that just passes the issue onto another worker and does not achieve anything...as you get older you realise the stupidity of not having a walking limit.... 5 miles a day is ....25 miles a week a good limited way to look after your body .....to walk more should be a choice..... who only as part of their job walks 30,000 miles in 25 years..only a postie.... think about it..... set a limit...or may well be 40,000 in 10 years time....?

Time changes everything and regrets leg trouble can not be reversed.......

Ignorance creates extra work .....

[ElvisGaddafi]

The lorry driving guidelines are surely there to stop the driver falling asleep at the wheel. I hardly ever fall asleep during my walk.

[CORTINA]

The lorry driving guidelines are surely there to stop the driver falling asleep at the wheel. I hardly ever fall asleep during my walk.

Quite so...

But different situations and jobs....

One is safety of tiredness at the driving wheel ..very dangerous to anyone in car or truck or coach etc..

So when does a distance of imposed job related walking kick in to being to much.... and health then becomes an issue to a postie now or later in life...... anything beyond the norm is to an excess ..... excess drinking, smoking or walking...

If you are happy to walk 8 miles a day now... does that mean in 5 years time things change and more is required from posties and they have to walk 12 or 15 miles a day... you will still be happy....

Bearing in mind that as you get older and your body joints start to wear.... Everything in life has a limit, go past that limit problems occour.... a walking limit threshold is different from one person to another.... when you get to that point of having a joint problem...you will really know about it.... to late then...you suffer the rest of your life.

What is your exceptable walking daily limit ...8, 10, 12, OR 15 or a mad 20 MILES EVERYDAY.....?

[scoobydo79]

Well it wasnt that long ago on the front of our union newspaper was a sweaty exhausted postman and they were saying we shouldnt deliver for more than 2.5 - 3 hours so what the F-- happened?Since P& L it seems to be unlimited

[rolf]

I did a walk about 3-4 years ago it was 14 miles, normally all walks in our d.o it's around 8-10 miles

[Himaggen]

.... a walking limit threshold is different from one person to another....

Exactly; How then can a limit be imposed?

If the planners look for an average 6 loops of 45 minutes for van shares, (4½ hrs) and use an average walking speed of 3½ miles per hour, (LWT 3.47 rounded up), then I suppose your looking at a potential average walk distance of 15¾ miles. Is that what you wanted to hear?

[CORTINA]

.... a walking limit threshold is different from one person to another....

Exactly; How then can a limit be imposed?

If the planners look for an average 6 loops of 45 minutes for van shares, (4½ hrs) and use an average walking speed of 3½ miles per hour, (LWT 3.47 rounded up), then I suppose your looking at a potential average walk distance of 15¾ miles. Is that what you wanted to hear?

Maybe planners and posties need to look at walks from a different point of view.....not based on how many houses or time....

Start from a max walk distance of say an example of 6 miles and then fit in amount of delivery calls .....

Simpley test each walk and when 6 miles is reached ...thats the end of the walk..and amount of calls ...everyone then walks the same ...simple

Instead of now...whether it be 400 calls or 600 calls no matter what the distance walked..everybody now walks different distances....some 5 miles others could be 8 or 10 miles...25 or 40 or 50 miles a week....for the same pay...?

Some walking twice as much as another postie, one could be walking 1200 a year, and you could be walking 2500 a year...thats 12,000 and 25,000 over 10 years, with you walking twice as much, an extra 13,000 miles extra for same pay...... happy with that....?....you therefore walk 13,000 miles for nothing over 10 years...25 years over 30,000 miles walked for nothing..... compared to some else walking half on their walk......is my point clear now..?

I am suprised that nobody has realised that they could working twice or three times harder that someone else for the same pay...... having pointed this fact out to you all ...why has it not been picked up by the union or indeed posties themselfs.

If you disgree with my point ...and are then happy to be possibly walking 2,000 miles a year or more than someone else in the same depot....for nothing... then theres no problem then....

[TrueBlueTerrier]

In a way there are already limits on the distance you can walk. The various methods of delivery have a set time limit and or speed built into planning.

There is also a problem with setting a set distance. The actual distance does not matter but if we take 6 miles in a high density housing area (like back to back council estates for instance) and compare it to a low density leafy suburb, then the estate will get more houses if measured by distance (as now) but the leafy suburbs mail profile means they get heavier volumes and are therefore carrying more weight a longer distance (even if not breaking the weight guidelines).

One of the problems in Deliveries is that Royal Mail seems have fixed parameters in everything they do and don't accept that reality has an effect. If the Union went down that line and had a set distance for delivering on foot eventually you would have people complaining that the limit is unfair because some duties get done up to an hour before another, yet they have the same limit on distance.

Royal Mail cause their own problems because they have fixed attendance call rates for the whole country, rather than by type of delivery (based on density and profile). They also suffer the same problem with failed deliveries for the same reasons.

RM have problems because they plan for an 65 year old to a duty in the same time as an 18 year old.

But RMs main problems are because they plan for 100% efficiency 100% of the time with 100% commitment and 100% accuracy. When in reality nobody, unless they are called Data, can be that good even for a short time.

The Union in my estimation made a mistake accepting BSI for the same reasons. If you are manufacturing a car its easy to time and plan for each component in the process - after all every car gets the same components and it takes the same amount of time to fit it. In delivering post though, each customer is different, every house is different, every duty is different, every packet is different, and the letters aren't exactly identical either.

BSI - Pick your own definition.

Bull s**t Index
Bosses Shouting Indicator
Bonus Share Increment (for managers)

[CORTINA]

In a way there are already limits on the distance you can walk. The various methods of delivery have a set time limit and or speed built into planning.

RM have problems because they plan for an 65 year old to a duty in the same time as an 18 year old.

But RMs main problems are because they plan for 100% efficiency 100% of the time with 100% commitment and 100% accuracy. When in reality nobody, unless they are called Data, can be that good even for a short time.

The Union in my estimation made a mistake accepting BSI for the same reasons. If you are manufacturing a car its easy to time and plan for each component in the process - after all every car gets the same components and it takes the same amount of time to fit it. In delivering post though, each customer is different, every house is different, every duty is different, every packet is different, and the letters aren't exactly identical either.

-----------------------------

RM have problems because they plan for an 65 year old to a duty in the same time as an 18 year old. ...SAYS IT ALL..no consideration what so ever........ a massive union failure not to have challenged this every duty fits all system ...it needs to be addressed as P&L has created even more walking..... increase the walking and some are going to suffer if not now then in a few years ... and more so depending on your age...where is the care for your workforce... come into these changes...

Same old story those at the top do not do the job...

Maybe Mora Greene should look at the tv program .." UNDER COVER BOSS " and I challenge her to have a go ...and work along side and do a postie round for a week......... She maybe walking around a office ankle deep in £10 notes... while posties are walking the street in pouring rain and cold......... for less than £10 an hour.... I think that sums up the reality of it all to a point......

Like I say the TUC are so inactive on so many points and issues and injustices ...... I often wonder are they guttless, stupid or ignorant ...as they take our subs.......this 2012 not 1912...morale of your workforce is paramount....according to many business meetings ...... well if long walking distance walks, fit for 25 year olds are given to 55 year olds says it all ..the union should recognise this fact is not helping the amount of sickness ...as in our area ....maybe the union are blistfully unawhere of the reality of the job involved as a postie..... or more to the point can not be bothered to find out an start dealing with the many issues occuring.........union fit for purpose....score 3 out of 10..based on past 10 years results acheived for past postie agreements..very poor record....... because of where we are now.... and the amount of conversations in depots accross the UK....... MORALE IS THAT BAD.......SAYS IT ALL....Still ...M. Greene is ok

[CORTINA]

I think a growing amount of posties must be waking up to the fact that they our being conned by the extra walking involved by the new P & L.......

How much extra walking are you doing since changing over to P & L.......