CSS question

[malstron]

Hi all just a quick qiestion for any CSS operators out there, was there a contract of time on the CSS machines when use took the job ? in my office we were told 18 month MIN and that if the machines moved we could follow them to a nearby office. Now after 10 and a half month Royal mail are sending our work to another office so we have to go back on nornal 5/6 day week as a postman. I have since working part time on the machines have started my own business which I do on my days off as I am P-Time, I started this as Royal mail said I could follow machines when they move. I have spent £12500 to get up and running now they making me choose between business and Royal Mail as they have now changed there mind and are trying to say they said no such thing. All 8 machine operators have said the same thing about 18 month in our office then we follow machines. I do have an Email stating it is a fixed term contract but it doesn't state the lenght of time.

[pinstripe]

We were told we had to stay on the machines for 12 months, but nothing about following the machines.

Is the work being transferred to another DO/MPU or Mail Centre?

p.s it would just be typical RM if they lied about being able to follow the machines.

[malstron]

We were told we had to stay on the machines for 12 months, but nothing about following the machines.

Is the work being transferred to another DO/MPU or Mail Centre?

p.s it would just be typical RM if they lied about being able to follow the machines.

Moving to another mail center they recon that they can cope with our outgoing mial :-(
Got union to see in the morning.

[Budfrog]

This varied from region to region.

Some regions allowed a 6 week 'cooling off' period after going live within which the operators could revert to their previous roles if they didn't like the job, others did not. I believe some regions insisted that operators stayed on the CSS for a minimum of 12 months or at least until a replacement could be trained.

It really does depend on the MPU manager and above him the DSM who can influence things. There is little value in keeping OPGs on a job they do not like or are not suited to, it is counter productive, but training slots have not always been easy to come by and there is also the cost of selection and training to consider. In some units finding staff who are willing to become CSS operators has also been difficult as it is a job that doesn't suit everyone.

As far as following the machines is concerned I would not know, though common sense would seem to make a case for trained/verified operators being utilised if it is cost effective re; MTSF etc.

[css hartlepool]

what malstron is trying to say is where we work we have 2 css machines with 2 shift patterns . 1 of 4 fulltime staff who work tues/wed/thurs/fri nights 9.75 hour nightshift . The part time staff work sun night/ monday night/ and a delivery on sat morning.
We were told in June that our machines were to be relocated to a nearby mailcentre who's mail centre machines were moving 30 miles away to a bigger mailcentre so they were being downgraded as a mailcentre thus meaning all their operators and drivers were going to either relocate to the new office or take a delivery or redundo. Now the staff were given the oportunity to go to the new mailcentre to do the jobs.

That is when we were told our jobs were going to the mail centre from our delivery office

Now during our interview process for the css machines we were told by 3 different departments of royal mail
1. The css tutors that came from two different mail centres to train us
2. the manager of the area machines
3. our local delivery manager in our 1 to 1 interview.
that was actually a selling point of the job desription that if our machines are ever removed from our office we WOULD be given the opportunity to go with our machines which we accepted just like our neighbours who could travel to their new place of work.

In June we were told by our manager that our machines were going and that we couldnt go with them, we couldnt apply for the jobs in the other office as they would be internal applications only and that we would have to go back on to our deliveres and that there had been some misunderstanding that it was never mentioned about going with the machines.

So basically we have been hung out to dry not only by royal mail but our union too

We told our union rep about what was happening and had telephone calls texts and ...............nothing .
all we can summise is that because he is based in the mailcentre that is getting these jobs of us that he is defending his offices staff and ignoring us which is wrong.
We feeling very hard done by .
In our initial meeting and slide show as an introduction to the machines we had 2 union reps going for the job and about 10 postmen and a manager who all heard the tutor say about going with our machines and will sign a statement to say that is what we were told . All except the union rep from the mail centre who is denying being in the introduction meeting .

As it stands we will lose about 5k a year in wages going back to our deliveries but also our shifts will go from our full time 4 night week full time hours / 2 night and sat delivery for part time back to a five day week . Some of the lads on css took the jobs because they were on flexible working as they have young familes so the hours suited.

DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY ADVICE ON WHAT WE CAN DO PLEASE ??????

[Budfrog]

I worked on the CSS Project for Thames Valley and am familiar with all the project documentation around Comms, I also delivered Induction Workshops and 1-2-1s. There was nothing mentioned about CSS Operators following the machines if they were moved and in my region this question was never raised at any of the workshops that I am aware of. That is not to say that other regions did not make their own agreements with staff.

[swashy]

Hi Malstron,
If you are part time and were made up to full time hours and the manager told you that you would move with the machine - then he/she was wrong to say that but I would add, that I absolutely believe you when you say that this was stated to you.
I have spoken to your union rep and he told me that you and your colleagues were aware that the jobs were temporary and no promise to follow the work was made. Again, on balance of evidence I believe your version of events. I believe that you are unfortunate in that you were misled by management. It may not help but I can tell you that there have been many such instances during the last two years. The mail centre closure you speak of and associated people issues has been handled poorly. CWU rep's and management share responsibility for this. There have been mixed messages and a lack of definitive information which provides clarity for the members/employees. The mail centre closure was announced in 2010 and from that point local DOM's should have been aware that vacancies and upgrades p/t to f/t should only be filled on a temporary basis pending the specific event m/c closure. I don't believe that you were deliberately misled but nevertheless you were. They messed up. I believe they now know they messed up and are covering their tracks. I sympathise mate but please recognise you are in good company lots of your colleagues have been misled also.

[css hartlepool]

In regards to what you said about you spoke to our rep and we were made aware that these jobs were temporary . That is correct . Then you say he said management made no promise that we could go with the machines . That is wrong three diffrent groups of people said it d/o manager in our 1 to 1 , our css tutors and the manager of the css operation.
It was told to us in an induction meeting that the "rep" was present at as he was in for the job too .Although he denies this !!!
we have 2 royal mail managers who were present too who heard it also .

[swashy]

Absolutely believe what you are saying - The Hartlepool issue will now form part of a wider brief from local members to CWUHQ - will keep you informed.

[swashy]

We the local members at middlesbrough would like answers to our questions and we are not getting them locally. We have put a letter to CWUHQ and your concerns are included. We believe if you were told that you would be given the opportunity to move with the work then that promise should be honoured. Hartlepool members can assist by also raising the issue with HQ.

[Talell]

This would be covered by MTSF, wouldn't it?

If so, then your allowances would be protected based on how long you have held them (i.e. you get paid your nightshift and TPM for a little longer than you would have previously), the company would then look for suitable replacement jobs that meet your pay protection (or as close as possible), this is not limited to your local office and could include following the workload to the new MC (if there is a vacancy).

Based upon what you have said, I would assume that the office receiving the workload has no vacancies, meaning the workload is being assimilated to mitigate any surplus that may arise, thus you cannot transfer under MTSF. Your current office might have a vacancy, therefore you are being offered a job there since it is reasonable.

Attendance patterns are not protected, only the contract and any additional earnings.

[pinstripe]

At no time during the selection process, training, or the 2 years since we started operating the machines, has it even been hinted at that, the job is not permanent. Well, as permanent as anything is in RM.

[The happy Postman]

Hi,

I am new to this site and was made aware of it by word of mouth, so I thought I'd take a look at what its all about.

Reading through the posts, I had to write on here as to why you or who ever believe that you need to go to CWUHQ because as you state 'you are not getting anything locally'.

I know people who work in Middlesbrough and who have nothing but praise for the reps who work in there and the wider field. Its all a very emotive subject and it effects a lot of people.

Running off to HQ doesnt help the situation and to be fair only adds to the stress these people are all ready under, surely a meeting with all concerned would have been a better solution? or maybe I am out of touch?

Just something I thought I'd like to add.

[swashy]

Does anyone else detect a faint odour emanating from the previous post. I just happened to be in the neighbourhood etc..

[The happy Postman]

Swashy,

What do you mean by your last post?