Do the military have authority to search a RM vehicle?

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I should say raise your voice instead off screaming.Also yes.you can break the side window too gain access,as long as you put that poxy card on the windscrean,so the driver can see it,as reason is,he may be deaf.Also states on the order cards that army personel can carry out the action.

'Poxy card' isn't the sort of language one might expect of one holding a job that surely demands a great deal of tact.
And surely extra care should have been taken by all service personnel not to offend after the actions of the army in the Bogside area of Londonderry on 30 January 1972.

Poxy in this term could mean cheap, or of inferior quality - certainly the cards I used were exactly that. As to extra care, well that was constantly impressed upon me as a serviceman in Northern Ireland, Bosnia and any other places I served where there was some friction caused by our presence. However, as serviceman are individuals, despite assertions to the contrary, some listen and do their best, others don't, and it would unfair to condemn all by the actions of one, or a minority.

[Lounge Lizard]

I should say raise your voice instead off screaming.Also yes.you can break the side window too gain access,as long as you put that poxy card on the windscrean,so the driver can see it,as reason is,he may be deaf.Also states on the order cards that army personel can carry out the action.

'Poxy card' isn't the sort of language one might expect of one holding a job that surely demands a great deal of tact.
And surely extra care should have been taken by all service personnel not to offend after the actions of the army in the Bogside area of Londonderry on 30 January 1972.

Poxy in this term could mean cheap, or of inferior quality - certainly the cards I used were exactly that. As to extra care, well that was constantly impressed upon me as a serviceman in Northern Ireland, Bosnia and any other places I served where there was some friction caused by our presence. However, as serviceman are individuals, despite assertions to the contrary, some listen and do their best, others don't, and it would unfair to condemn all by the actions of one, or a minority.

No, I'm certainly not one to 'condemn all', but had understood 'poxy' to mean suffering from pox or sickening rather than unsatisfactory or of inferior quality.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

I should say raise your voice instead off screaming.Also yes.you can break the side window too gain access,as long as you put that poxy card on the windscrean,so the driver can see it,as reason is,he may be deaf.Also states on the order cards that army personel can carry out the action.

'Poxy card' isn't the sort of language one might expect of one holding a job that surely demands a great deal of tact.
And surely extra care should have been taken by all service personnel not to offend after the actions of the army in the Bogside area of Londonderry on 30 January 1972.

Poxy in this term could mean cheap, or of inferior quality - certainly the cards I used were exactly that. As to extra care, well that was constantly impressed upon me as a serviceman in Northern Ireland, Bosnia and any other places I served where there was some friction caused by our presence. However, as serviceman are individuals, despite assertions to the contrary, some listen and do their best, others don't, and it would unfair to condemn all by the actions of one, or a minority.

No, I'm certainly not one to 'condemn all', but had understood 'poxy' to mean suffering from pox or sickening rather than unsatisfactory or of inferior quality.

I understood that lounge, and he is right they were poxy - I thought I had better add the rest with your mention of Derry, its a very sore subject still, for both sides of the troubles.

[Lounge Lizard]

I should say raise your voice instead off screaming.Also yes.you can break the side window too gain access,as long as you put that poxy card on the windscrean,so the driver can see it,as reason is,he may be deaf.Also states on the order cards that army personel can carry out the action.

'Poxy card' isn't the sort of language one might expect of one holding a job that surely demands a great deal of tact.
And surely extra care should have been taken by all service personnel not to offend after the actions of the army in the Bogside area of Londonderry on 30 January 1972.

Poxy in this term could mean cheap, or of inferior quality - certainly the cards I used were exactly that. As to extra care, well that was constantly impressed upon me as a serviceman in Northern Ireland, Bosnia and any other places I served where there was some friction caused by our presence. However, as serviceman are individuals, despite assertions to the contrary, some listen and do their best, others don't, and it would unfair to condemn all by the actions of one, or a minority.

No, I'm certainly not one to 'condemn all', but had understood 'poxy' to mean suffering from pox or sickening rather than unsatisfactory or of inferior quality.

I understood that lounge, and he is right they were poxy - I thought I had better add the rest with your mention of Derry, its a very sore subject still, for both sides of the troubles.

That shows the incompetance of the Ministry of Defence - countless billions of pounds well documented as wasted on procurement disasters, and then a vital card to show motorists in a troubled province is 'poxy' rather than fit for purpose. and, yes, I don't doubt that Derry is a very sore subject still for both sides of the troubles, but lets hope that progress in recent times continues.

[DB1100]

Lounge Lizard,you mention Bloody Sunday as something the British Army should be ashamed off,can I just remind you that the inquiry hasn't reached its conclusion yet,just because this prime minister apologised for it doesn't mean anything,don't forget this prime minister thought that we came into the second world war after the Americans.The i.r.a committed far worse atrosicites than bloody sunday have you forgottten the M62 coach bomb where women and children were the targets? or the 2 pubs in Guildford,I was in Aldershot when they went off and the troubles in Northern Ireland continue its just not reported as much.I have very strong feelings about this.

[brothermagrew]

However DB1100 the Principal Conclusions and Overall Assessment of the Bloody Sunday Inquiry can be viewed at:

http://www.official-documents.gov.uk/do ... 0/0030.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[DB1100]

However DB1100 the Principal Conclusions and Overall Assessment of the Bloody Sunday Inquiry can be viewed at:

http://www.official-documents.gov.uk/do ... 0/0030.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

brothermagrew,I sincerely believe that they would have held inquiry after inquiry until a satisfactory verdict was reached,the labour government under bliar bent over backwards to appease the i.r.a,do you remember the Lee Clegg fiasco?,they were determined to find that lad guilty and just about ruined his life,how do you think the lads that were involved in Bloody Sunday feel? this has been hanging over their heads for 40 years,whereas the Guildford pub bombers did a bit of jail and were released with compenstation after proclaiming their innocence,same as the Birmingham bombers,this is not a dig at labour because I think this tory goverment is just as bad

[NWpostie]

While are about it, when are we going to have an inquiry about IRA atrocities including those on people of their own communities who have been taken away in the middle of the night, tortured and shot, also the IRA don't take prisoners, any British servicemen can expect to be shot out of hand after a long torture session, Captain Nariac was abducted, tortured (he never talked) before being shot in the head and put in a meat mincer at a dog food factory, this is the type of people we are dealing with,

The same people who were shot march at Londonderry would just as easily have assisted the IRA gunmen to escape from the British Army, it was believed the IRA started shooting from the flats near the march, not an uncommon tactic, organise a rent a mob use it as a "come on"then shoot at the soldiers turning up to deal with it, it is highly likely the IRA could pass up an opportunity to shoot at the Paras, whose mistake was to shoot before positively locating the enemy.

I know I will get flamed for this, I stand by my views.

[NWpostie]

Jean McConville was a particularity sad story, I also have heard of a Catholic Mother who helped a dying soldier in the street, she was also abducted by the IRA and shot so much for the righteousness of their cause, if a United Ireland is bound by blood, I would not want to live in it.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_McConville" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[TrueBlueTerrier]

While are about it, when are we going to have an inquiry about IRA atrocities including those on people of their own communities

Apart from the criminal trials I can't see there ever being one, they are after all a criminal organisation. You could have Truth Trials like they did/do in South Africa, in fact a peace organisation that operates on both sides of the divide has suggested this regularly.

Now I am a serviceman that served for over 3 year in NI and I sympathise with your views, however, I can never see it happening. After all there are too many skeletons in the cupboard on the "Loyalist" side. There was always talk of collusion between the RUC, Army and UVF and UFF, there were even rumours that the "amateurish" Red Hand Commandos (apparently 1 of their cells got lost on a mission to Dublin) were actually a front organisation for an Intelligence gathering force. I also personally know of 2 servicemen that were kicked out of NI for connections with the UVF, and one of them was caught in a UVF pub in the Shankill and was returned to the mainland before closing time.

[DGP1]

When did this turn into a NI discussion??

From someone who lives here..............it's over, it's finished, we don't want to go back to those days, it really needs to be left for historians now and not used by politicians to try to score points with some small section of the electorate.

[DB1100]

While are about it, when are we going to have an inquiry about IRA atrocities including those on people of their own communities who have been taken away in the middle of the night, tortured and shot, also the IRA don't take prisoners, any British servicemen can expect to be shot out of hand after a long torture session, Captain Nariac was abducted, tortured (he never talked) before being shot in the head and put in a meat mincer at a dog food factory, this is the type of people we are dealing with,

The same people who were shot march at Londonderry would just as easily have assisted the IRA gunmen to escape from the British Army, it was believed the IRA started shooting from the flats near the march, not an uncommon tactic, organise a rent a mob use it as a "come on"then shoot at the soldiers turning up to deal with it, it is highly likely the IRA could pass up an opportunity to shoot at the Paras, whose mistake was to shoot before positively locating the enemy.

I know I will get flamed for this, I stand by my views.

Another less well known case was of a Sergeant in the RCT who was kidnapped and murdered by the ira he was with them for 3 days before his body was found in a Derry graveyard this was in April 1977,there was a rumour that a certain politician was carrying a thompson at bloody sunday and allegedly used to boast about his heroic escapades at the time and like NWpostie says I don't care if you flame me.The good Friday agreement was a shambles.

[fishtank]

When did this turn into a NI discussion??

From someone who lives here..............it's over, it's finished, we don't want to go back to those days, it really needs to be left for historians now and not used by politicians to try to score points with some small section of the electorate.

Well said DGP.
If NI can try to move on it's really time those with no experience of the situation did as well.
A great deal of Central Scotland for a start.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

When did this turn into a NI discussion??

From someone who lives here..............it's over, it's finished, we don't want to go back to those days, it really needs to be left for historians now and not used by politicians to try to score points with some small section of the electorate.

Well said DGP.
If NI can try to move on it's really time those with no experience of the situation did as well.
A great deal of Central Scotland for a start.

to both of you.

[Lounge Lizard]

Lounge Lizard,you mention Bloody Sunday as something the British Army should be ashamed off,can I just remind you that the inquiry hasn't reached its conclusion yet,just because this prime minister apologised for it doesn't mean anything,don't forget this prime minister thought that we came into the second world war after the Americans.The i.r.a committed far worse atrosicites than bloody sunday have you forgottten the M62 coach bomb where women and children were the targets? or the 2 pubs in Guildford,I was in Aldershot when they went off and the troubles in Northern Ireland continue its just not reported as much.I have very strong feelings about this.

I didn't suggest that Bloody Sunday was something the British Army should be ashamed off but likewise I'm sure you don't claim it's anything they're proud of.
And with 26 unarmed civil-rights protesters and bystanders shot by soldiers of the British Army our Prime Minister surely didn't need await conclusions of an enquiry before apologising.
I totally agree with TBT that "you could have Truth Trials like they did/do in South Africa, in fact a peace organisation that operates on both sides of the divide has suggested this regularly" and with DGP that "it's over, it's finished, we don't want to go back to those days, it really needs to be left for historians now and not used by politicians to try to score points with some small section of the electorate."