Atos

[phronsias]

Hi
Thanks for all the help!!!!!!!!!
I've just submitted a Bullying and Harassment complaint for what its worth,also atos has awarded me 2 more visits to the physio. that's 3 in all. if I need more how do I request them?
Regards
Frank

[phronsias]

Hi
I just had a phone call from HRSC, she said it was a case of my line manager not following procedure rather then bullying, I said my line manager telling me it was up to him when I returned to work and not my GP, and he would consider stopping my sick pay , if I didn't return before my sick note ended was bullying, she said "I'm not going to argue with you, it is not bullying" and she will return my complaint and I should put in a grievance. The bullying and harassment line sent me the Bullying and Harassment complaint form in the first place. What is the point of the HRSC if they wont deal with your case? Any ideas on what my next move should be?

Regards

P

[TeeferTiger]

Hi
I just had a phone call from HRSC, she said it was a case of my line manager not following procedure rather then bullying, I said my line manager telling me it was up to him when I returned to work and not my GP, and he would consider stopping my sick pay , if I didn't return before my sick note ended was bullying, she said "I'm not going to argue with you, it is not bullying" and she will return my complaint and I should put in a grievance. The bullying and harassment line sent me the Bullying and Harassment complaint form in the first place. What is the point of the HRSC if they wont deal with your case? Any ideas on what my next move should be?

Regards

P

So it's not bullying... it's harassment

[phronsias]

Hi
I just had a phone call from HRSC, she said it was a case of my line manager not following procedure rather then bullying, I said my line manager telling me it was up to him when I returned to work and not my GP, and he would consider stopping my sick pay , if I didn't return before my sick note ended was bullying, she said "I'm not going to argue with you, it is not bullying" and she will return my complaint and I should put in a grievance. The bullying and harassment line sent me the Bullying and Harassment complaint form in the first place. What is the point of the HRSC if they wont deal with your case? Any ideas on what my next move should be?

Regards

P

So it's not bullying... it's harassment

Hello again
No not harassment, she said its not following procedure. She made it clear she didnt want to know.
Regards
P

[TeeferTiger]

Hmmmm... so a grievance then?

[phronsias]

Hmmmm... so a grievance then?

Hi
What is the point in having a Bullying and Harassment complaint procedure if they wont entertain bullying or harassment complaints? I submitted 5 pages of dates,times and threats but to no avail,,,,,,,,,management can do and say what they want with immunity........
Regards
P

[General Mannerheim]

Hmmmm... so a grievance then?

Hi
What is the point in having a Bullying and Harassment complaint procedure if they wont entertain bullying or harassment complaints? I submitted 5 pages of dates,times and threats but to no avail,,,,,,,,,management can do and say what they want with immunity........
Regards
P

It's to tick boxes and get a pat on the back ...look how much bullying has gone down down in our fabulous company arn't we good.
Next they will be publishing that job satifaction is up.

[TeeferTiger]

Hmmmm... so a grievance then?

Hi
What is the point in having a Bullying and Harassment complaint procedure if they wont entertain bullying or harassment complaints? I submitted 5 pages of dates,times and threats but to no avail,,,,,,,,,management can do and say what they want with immunity........
Regards
P

You don't have to tell me about it, I've been there. My complaint was partly upheld though.

[bogstandard]

Hi
I just had a phone call from HRSC, she said it was a case of my line manager not following procedure rather then bullying, I said my line manager telling me it was up to him when I returned to work and not my GP, and he would consider stopping my sick pay , if I didn't return before my sick note ended was bullying, she said "I'm not going to argue with you, it is not bullying" and she will return my complaint and I should put in a grievance. The bullying and harassment line sent me the Bullying and Harassment complaint form in the first place. What is the point of the HRSC if they wont deal with your case? Any ideas on what my next move should be?

Regards

P

re submit the complaint. their opinion is theirs and your is yours. in your opinion and the vast majority of people i would guess the financial threat was designed to intimidate.
if she makes contact by phone again ask for confirmation in writing. cc in your rep your area rep and branch secretary and anyone else you can think of.

[bogstandard]

as they are working for and on behalf of RM i am sure they would have no problem in confirming this in writing so demand written confirmation. tell them otherwise you expect the procedure to be continued. The phrase "as could be reasonably perceived by A.N.Other". Is it not reasonable to have perceived threat? is it not reasonable to have perceived intimidation?
Are you being unreasonable to add together intimidation and threat and come up with bullying? i don't think you are.
Get their name and take a grievance out against them, if they don't do as you ask. the B and H procedure is on here somewhere and tbh i don't recall reading claims can be rejected over the phone without written confirmation of the decision.
if you follow this line of thought and possibly expand for your benefit, the manager gets trained to a certain level, i am confident that they are not then let loose onto the staff to do as they see fit just because they have passed a test. The line "if in doubt call xxxx for advice/clarification/opinion" will have been given to them during training at some point by somebody, because lets be honest only teenagers know everything without training, and you cannot teach every possible scenario and learn all policy documents during training. Now when this manager spoken to you it is not unreasonable to expect that the "threat" they made was confirmed as correct by somebody even themselves by having read the relevant RM policy.

Did they seek advice?
if not why not?
if yes then from who?
Did they find the advice as threatening?
If not why not?
If yes did they question it?
if not why not?
if yes what was the response?


The question would now be how many others have returned to work because of this threat only to relapse and possibly find themselves sacked.
Get a witness to EVERYTHING from now onwards

[phronsias]

as they are working for and on behalf of RM i am sure they would have no problem in confirming this in writing so demand written confirmation. tell them otherwise you expect the procedure to be continued. The phrase "as could be reasonably perceived by A.N.Other". Is it not reasonable to have perceived threat? is it not reasonable to have perceived intimidation?
Are you being unreasonable to add together intimidation and threat and come up with bullying? i don't think you are.
Get their name and take a grievance out against them, if they don't do as you ask. the B and H procedure is on here somewhere and tbh i don't recall reading claims can be rejected over the phone without written confirmation of the decision.
if you follow this line of thought and possibly expand for your benefit, the manager gets trained to a certain level, i am confident that they are not then let loose onto the staff to do as they see fit just because they have passed a test. The line "if in doubt call xxxx for advice/clarification/opinion" will have been given to them during training at some point by somebody, because lets be honest only teenagers know everything without training, and you cannot teach every possible scenario and learn all policy documents during training. Now when this manager spoken to you it is not unreasonable to expect that the "threat" they made was confirmed as correct by somebody even themselves by having read the relevant RM policy.

Did they seek advice?

Hi
Thanks for your help, when I get the complaint form back I'll try again.
Regards
Frank
if not why not?
if yes then from who?
Did they find the advice as threatening?
If not why not?
If yes did they question it?
if not why not?
if yes what was the response?


The question would now be how many others have returned to work because of this threat only to relapse and possibly find themselves sacked.
Get a witness to EVERYTHING from now onwards

[phronsias]

apologies for the delay. Ideally you inform work that you are coming off the sick and that you will be taking your a/l, also that you will be returning to work after this. You can tell them just for your own clarification that upon return you will be doing whatever you have agreed to do. Your return to work plan commences when you return to work.

Hi again
I returned to work this morning and my line manager told me the atos report says I can do 50% indoor and 50% outdoor for 4 hours this week, he wanted me to do part of my walk, I told him this is not what I agreed with atos over the phone and I was unfit to deliver mail, he took me to see the DOM ( temp) Ive never seen this person before and she said the atos report says Im fit to deliver mail, I said my fitness for work note from my GP said I should not do any outdoor work, this went on and on, I said I wanted to see an Atos GP, the DOM said she couldnt refer me and if I disagreed with the atos report I should put in a complaint, I rang atos and was told I could be referred by management, I rang my line manager and told him and he said he would talk to me in the morning, This is not the end of matter.
Regards
P

[phronsias]

[quote="phronsias"][quote="bogstandard"]as they are working for and on behalf of RM i am sure they would have no problem in confirming this in writing so demand written confirmation. tell them otherwise you expect the procedure to be continued. The phrase "as could be reasonably perceived by A.N.Other". Is it not reasonable to have perceived threat? is it not reasonable to have perceived intimidation?
Are you being unreasonable to add together intimidation and threat and come up with bullying? i don't think you are.
Get their name and take a grievance out against them, if they don't do as you ask. the B and H procedure is on here somewhere and tbh i don't recall reading claims can be rejected over the phone without written confirmation of the decision.
if you follow this line of thought and possibly expand for your benefit, the manager gets trained to a certain level, i am confident that they are not then let loose onto the staff to do as they see fit just because they have passed a test. The line "if in doubt call xxxx for advice/clarification/opinion" will have been given to them during training at some point by somebody, because lets be honest only teenagers know everything without training, and you cannot teach every possible scenario and learn all policy documents during training. Now when this manager spoken to you it is not unreasonable to expect that the "threat" they made was confirmed as correct by somebody even themselves by having read the relevant RM policy.

Did they seek advice?

Hi
I resubmited my complaint by email and got this reply...

Dear .......
I reiterate that your complaint must be investigated via the grievance
procedure, if after investigation under the grievance procedure your
complaint is not upheld then you have the right to appeal and your
complaint will then be heard at the next level.

What is the point of this complaint system?????????
All the best
P

[bogstandard]

do as they ask but seek advice from branch, and in you grievance put down that in your opinion you were bullied threatened and intimidated into returning to work.
In the what practical steps would you like you could put something like this not to happen again. B and H only has to happen once don't forget.

[mazza111]

I would have to state, you should always ask for a copy of the report by ATOS(sers) too. So you know exactly what's being asked of you. I didn't, but the told me no out door work at all.