D2D:Voice:Vocal Minority

[dvbuk55]

And the biggest back stabbing of all - paying part timers pro rata for doing exactly the same as a full timer - delivery wise that is - and it is a DELIVERY Supplement - even if you don't deliver As with most things poorly thought out and poorly handled like most of the 2010 agreement.

[Rennie]

So if there's no going back then how about trying to move forward with fresh negotiations that will enhance the product and reward staff fairly.
How about this.... just a thought.....
my delivery usually takes about the same time every day wihin a call rate range of 70% - 90% I suppose we speed up a bit when we're busy or the fact you cover pretty much the same ground explains this.
When the call rate is 100% it adds about 15 -20 minutes to my delivery span.
It takes me 20 minutes + to prep my D2D's each day.
How about this and please don't all shout at me
it's only a thought...
We take D2D out of indoor workload and add it to outdoor worload.
100% call rate every day taking a maximum of two D2D per day mon - fri, max 10!
all D2D over current levels (6) paid at enhanced rate.
D2D would not be prepped to frame but simply added to small (laptop siz) bag and taken out with normal delivery carring a very small amount at any one time and using the dead time between delivery points to extract one or two D2D's. Easy!
The increased call rate time would account for loss of D2D prep time and protect jobs.
every delivery would be 'set in stone' in terms of call rate/time and be protected from future reductions in mail volumes.
Savings should only be made through new technology (indoor work) and not in vain hope for mail/call rate volume reductions! managers are only happy when mail is light and they can absorb deliveries! This favorite bullying tactic may reduce!
I am told food outlets (indians, chinese, kentucky ect) are not allowed to be delivered together which means we lose work. In large towns and cities this type of system would have a massive impact as the D2D would be more attractive being delivered as one instead of being part of six!
Companies will be able to 'choose' a particular day for there mailshot (maybe the day before a promotion) allowing RM to enhance and market the D2D product.
Some offices may choose to opt for a saturday D2D at a premium rate maybe.
Just a few thoughts to ponder!!

Yes I hate doing them
yes the payment doesn't seem enough especially when we get six heavy D2D's that could have earn't me £50+
But hey ho I want to move on and If we attract more work then surely thats a good thing?
It just needs thinking about and trying to work on new ideas that may benefit us all.....

[POSTMAN]

RM will not allow us to have a 100% call rate every day,they are silly and very silly,and it's hard to actually type this but,not that silly.

[Dorset Plodder]

And the biggest back stabbing of all - paying part timers pro rata for doing exactly the same as a full timer - delivery wise that is - and it is a DELIVERY Supplement - even if you don't deliver As with most things poorly thought out and poorly handled like most of the 2010 agreement.

I hate that bloody "P" word DV! And it's going to happen again with the Christmas Bonus..because the DOM won't make PTers up temporarily (just in-case it effects his bonus). However the only glimmer at the end of the tunnel is...if you're on a Delivery Only duty is...you don't have to prep them..just delivery them! Which is great when you hear the others moaning about them.

What I can't understand is that some PTers are still throwing them off if they come back early!....and they're on a Delivery Only Duty!...WTF We really are our own worst enemy.

[Martin Walsh]

I know this argument has been done to death but tell me following an integrated revision how many postman or women remain on the times you have needed to have been paid for the early shift allowances ? I would expect very few. So was it expected that Royal Mail just continue to pay that allowance regardless of what time people started in the future ? it was only at the 11th hour during the unofficial strike by Liverpool and London in 2007 that the union secured the statement that the early shift allowance would be protected on a reserve rights basis or used in a restructuring pay deal.

Now it was always going to be used in a resturcuting deal. Since 2007 over 15 000 employees have joined Royal Mail inferior pension scheme and if we continued to with the reserved rights payments for early shift 1 & 2 then you would have people who joined since 2007 not receiving a shift payment and others who were employed prior to 2007 receiving a reserved rights payment. The bizare thing would be that hardly anyone would be working prior to 0500 or 5:30. Equally every time someone left who was in reciept of a reserved payment would have meant Royal Mail saved the entire supplement. Under the supplement every new recruit gets that supplement.

Now the supplement has already increased under last years pay deal and is now part of your basic pay as it is a permanent addition to basic pay. Royal Mail have requested that they bring forward the review of the pay deal and they want to discuss next years pay deal as well.

Now those who have called for part timers to get more of the supplement need to think very carefully , the supplement is part of your basic pay and the union at the pensions forum in Manchester carried the policy to get the supplement fully pensionable which is easier to do under a care scheme as each year is ring fenced. If your give part timers more of the supplement then you have part timers on a higher hourly rate than full timers which would not be acceptable.

Fish tank I can assure you that very senior managers believe the door to door strategy has not worked , it has not grown the product as they had hoped and quality is not good due to individuals not getting sufficient time under revisions and of course some treating the product still as an after thought.

[fishtank]

Fish tank I can assure you that very senior managers believe the door to door strategy has not worked , it has not grown the product as they had hoped and quality is not good due to individuals not getting sufficient time under revisions and of course some treating the product still as an after thought.

No you can't.
You can assure me that very senior managers have told you they believe the door to door strategy has not worked.
Whether it's actually true is a different question but since it's completely within their remit to deal with the issue of quality and providing enough time my question would be why are they giving the union the "it's not working,it's not growing" speech when their time would be better spent addressing the issues?

The truth behind that is the truth behind Royal Mail's overall pay bargaining strategy and has been for years.
They paint a terrible,armageddon style picture of the company's finances and future prospects,convince certain members in HQ and beyond of the company's frailty and suck the union in to accepting unpopular concessions in the name of protecting the long term future of the company and by definition the long term future of the CWU.

You said yourself Royal Mail have requested that they bring forward the review of the pay deal and they want to discuss next years pay deal as well.
Let's wise up and not sell the members short....again.

[Cut Off King]

Of course RM want to bring forward the pay negotiations

That way they can paint a bleak picture and get the CWU to soften up the members for another CR*P deal.
They want the deal out the way before they cook the books the other way, and far from being a basket case, hey presto we're into mega-profit area.....just before the sell-off
The balance sheet looks good and the next pay deal is pegged at a low level, ( just until TUPE duration runs out, then wages / conditions can be reduced to the minimum )

Or have I got RM management all wrong ?

[Martin Walsh]

For the record and let's get this crystal clear was said from Dave Ward from the platform to every Branch in the UK that CWU will not accept anything less than the what the agreement states and if needed they will ballot for strike action.

So no fudge is coming , the question is whether the members vote yes ! Let's be clear Royal Mail andnthe Government are not up for another row in Royal Mail this side of the EU decision andnthe don't want it until after privitisation which BISS have said will not happen until 2013 at earliest.

[fishtank]

For the record and let's get this crystal clear was said from Dave Ward from the platform to every Branch in the UK that CWU will not accept anything less than the what the agreement states and if needed they will ballot for strike action.

Fair enough but the agreement said that the 2012 pay rise would be revisited if RPI was outside 2-3%.
Well it's currently so far outside that it's almost double so in my mind at least 3.5% is not good enough because in real terms it's a pay cut.

[dvbuk55]

If everyone is now aware that the Delivery Supplement is no longer anything to do with delivery or D2D, which I would suggest from experience IS increasing and can be easily proven by RM opening the books, then stop calling it the delivery supplement.

Instead, under the new pay deal arrangements, take the DS pot, share it out evenly, add it to the % increase -which should be greater than the 3.5% under the circumstances, take the bonus money for revisions not yet paid out and give the workforce the pay rise they truly deserve.

What we have is the union accepting the RM statement that they are poor and cannot afford to pay the staff a decent increase because they have lied and squandered the money on totally useless initiatives which have done nothing whatsoever to improve the service to the customer.

As for Dave Wards statement from the platform - exactly what the troops wanted to hear - what's he saying to RM behind closed doors - probably exactly what they want to hear.

[Martin Walsh]

Fish your forgetting there were two reopening clauses the first was about inflation levels which we certainly we can argue strongly on , however the second was the state of the Business and thats where they can argue that without state aid they have big problems.

Now like I said the CWU will not accept any attempts to not pay 3.5% flowing through to everything including the supplement , I would guess that to have a row over whether we get a top up is open to debate. Every .5% is worth about 35 pence now if people wanted to fight for inflation it would depend on whether CPI or RPI is being used but at the moment its probably worth a couple of pound over the 3.5%, so I doubt whether people will have a strike over this unless Royal Mail did not pay 3.5 %.

Now if state aid is granted Royal Mail suddenly have an additional 300 million in which we can demand a share off. But I think we have bigger issues to fight rather than on the back of asking for a rise above the 3.5% on its own.

[fishtank]

Fish your forgetting there were two reopening clauses the first was about inflation levels which we certainly we can argue strongly on , however the second was the state of the Business and thats where they can argue that without state aid they have big problems.

by dingo » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:31,pm

Relying on this site and your precieved understanding of the agreeement is not the same as having those words and meanings explained. Remember these talks took 4 months and the every section was debated with assistance from Roger Poole and Peter Harwood from ACAS. Some posters are concerned about the 3rd year pay rise being open for re negoation but it was the CWU who wanted that clause because inflation may go up. Royal Mail have already agreed their financial plan with 3.5 in the last year.

[dvbuk55]

Fish your forgetting there were two reopening clauses the first was about inflation levels which we certainly we can argue strongly on , however the second was the state of the Business and thats where they can argue that without state aid they have big problems.

by dingo » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:31,pm

Relying on this site and your precieved understanding of the agreeement is not the same as having those words and meanings explained. Remember these talks took 4 months and the every section was debated with assistance from Roger Poole and Peter Harwood from ACAS. Some posters are concerned about the 3rd year pay rise being open for re negoation but it was the CWU who wanted that clause because inflation may go up. Royal Mail have already agreed their financial plan with 3.5 in the last year.

Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to "conveniently forget" what was once posted

[POSTMAN]

I can assure you that very senior managers believe the door to door strategy has not worked , it has not grown the product as they had hoped and quality is not good due to individuals not getting sufficient time under revisions and of course some treating the product still as an after thought.

And this is ALL managements fault,just like it was last time,especially local managers with the QOS of it.
Have these 'senior' managers not learnt from last time,and what are they prepared to do about it.
Have they no idea what really happens on the shop floor ffs,and who is f***ing it up,they know RMC is biased tho.

[dvbuk55]

I can assure you that very senior managers believe the door to door strategy has not worked , it has not grown the product as they had hoped and quality is not good due to individuals not getting sufficient time under revisions and of course some treating the product still as an after thought.

And this is ALL managements fault,just like it was last time,especially local managers with the QOS of it.
Have these 'senior' managers not learnt from last time,and what are they prepared to do about it.
Have they no idea what really happens on the shop floor ffs,and who is f***ing it up,they know RMC is biased tho.

Well not everyone is biased POSTMAN - I mean, remember the deal of the century? Or at least not biased in the same direction.