Big call for the Postal Executive

[chunk]

The only way that i can see the CWU getting a mandate for I.A, is if the proposed raid on the pension assets are tied in
with all other grievences. talking to members on the floor,the pension is the one area that is worrying everyone across the board.
To me,the pension should never have been seperated from the 2010 agreement.

Agree
The level of grievance as high if not higher than a year ago.
Unfortunately the level of trust in the union is at an all time low.
In order to unify for action there must be clearly listed grievances and clear aims.

As you suggest the different arms of rm have widely different issues.
i no more expect a mail center worker strike over say... the length of my delivery?
or i to slow mail center closures.
pensions is defiantly a unifying issue.
trust is also an issue.

[Glenno]

Keep to BTA, except long hold put on World Class Mail (everyone knows its shite except Higson who's fallen for the Professor) were still in but just postponing. An argument that although CWU had a say in mail centre closures every one Royal Mail wanted closed is to close. Vote for industrial action on compulsory redundancy/redundancy terms being increased, possibly joining forces with CMA on this. Drawn out strikes by function-day each (Deliveries, Mail Centre; earlies, lates, nights, RDC's/Network, Weekends/Airport/Heathrow) dragging on and on but only one days strike per person per fortnight also with pauses. Also use of action alternative to striking, but in addition to, agreed formally by CWU and notified to Royal Mail, if any alternatives exsist.

Without any evidence to the contrary this looks like a good short term strategedy, to take us into better times when the fight is right, and the pressure will be once again firmly at RM's door

[hertsman0]

Dingo has Roger Poole and Acas been contacted with regard to Royal Mail breaking any part of the agreement? Also Ed davy knows full well there is an agreement with the CWU what does he have to say?
I dont agree with selling off the Royal Mail but from a Government point of view IA will put off any new owner.

[oldrangersW12]

100 industrial action, couldn't give a monkey's about public support.
It's the support of the members that count.

[Martin Walsh]

Those who say the union will not get a yes vote well the union will only go to ballot after sounding out the Branch"s and doing telephone polls of the members etc. The ballot if that is decided will not be imminent in any case and certainly not till after our conference. Now in terms of London and the offices which are due to recieve London"s mail the ballot timetable will be annouced next week.

Now I have been around for 25 years in Royal Mail , the Dras dispute when we went out non stop for 3 weeks heard a lot of people saying they would never go out again , then we had some long unofficial disputes including the one where the union was charged with contempt of courts , then 1996 the Employee Agenda , then in 2003 when the rest of the UK go a no vote then we had two London weighting stikes before it spiralled into the biggest unofficial dispute since the miners when places outside London also joined in like Warrington Covertry , Postmouth and Southend. This led to the pay and major change agreement being reached including the 3.5 hour span , 5 day week and the £26 pound rise. Off course in 2007 we had the Pay and Mod dispute and in 2009 we had localised disputes some having over 20 days on top of the two days of National Action.

So if the union does decide to ballot people have a choice , as they do everytime. However the choice is even more stark as if you vote no then you are accepting that Royal Mail can introduce their new buisness plan without agreement which will deman further savings in your office , allow them to introduce their 5 year plan without further benefits including the removing of colleague share , allow complusory redundancies , remember MTSF only lasts 3 years when their new bussiness plan lasts 5. Plus allows CPI on pensions rather than RPI and opens the door for further pensions changes.

So if the union do ballot then it will be the make or break ballot for everyone, but I believe that we are fast reaching the make or break time for the workforce and Royal Mail.

[brandydoguk]

The one thing that really bothers me about any cal for IA is the perceived apathy among many members. I can only speak from the experience of what happened in my office the last time we went out. A large number of members had no idea what we were striking about and in deed it seemed that when it came time to vote on the 2010 "agreement" they didn't understand what it was all about. I would suggest the blame for this lies with the CWU, we had little or no information from them during the strikes and even when given the vote on the so called agreement many didn't understand whar it entailed. All they saw was they were worse off and doing more work (D2D uncapped and no payment, longer deliveries etc).

To be honest I remember thinking last time we were out the final agreement seemed to have no bearing on why we were out in the first place.

If IA does come around then for God's sake is it too much trouble for the CWU to keep us informed about how negotiations are going (none of the secret meetings from last time, spell out at each stage what has been said by all parties during negotiations) and spell out in simple terms what any agreements actually mean.

I would also suggest if there is any IA could the CWU keep Billy Hayes of the TV. He comes across as a bungling imbecile, regardless of whether he is in fact good at what he does.

[ronpetetrevchris]

Maybe i have missed a thread or two but can somebody explain CPI and RPI and the relevance please.

[clashcityrocker]

CPI = Consumer price index
RPI = Retail price index.

They want to use the lower figure thus devaluing the value of your pension.

[Martin Walsh]

Roger Poole has been involved and is still involved in the situration. Roger is commited to trying to resolve the issues as is Peter Harwood the Chief facilitator for ACAS. They are both working behind the scenes including talking to Royal Mail and the CWU. However remember they facilitators and cannot make either the CWU or Royal Mail do something which they dont want to do.

We do not have legally binding agreements so there is no recourse to court etc on the agreement.

Now this is what the quandry is , Royal Mail do not believe the agreement has achieved the savings on their business plan which they thought it was especially in deliveries where out of the 700 revisons which have been introduced only 120 have been intregrated and vast majority have bought a worse service and has not achieved the savings they thought it would. Some of the Hardliners the Hawks mainly the operational managers want out of the agreement and by their actions are hoping that the union walk away from the agreement and therefore Royal Mail do not get the blame.

The CWU know that walking away from the agreement allows a new owner to have an open goal interms of their new steps rather than being tied into the agreement which the Minster has said. However a lot of members do not like the delivery revison process which is contained within it and will not respond to a dispute to defend the agreement on its own.

So the next steps the union make is a massive call and the union has to listen to the members views as well as tell them what Royal Mail are doing.

[Martin Walsh]

Maybe i have missed a thread or two but can somebody explain CPI and RPI and the relevance please.

Royal Mail have announced that from April 2011 pensions for those who joined before 1987 will be based on CPI which is lower than RPI which will reduce lump sums and your future pensions. In addition all retired members and those with defered pensions will also have their pensions cacluated on CPI.

Those who joined after 1987 Royal Mail are currently considering their next steps and could also include CPI.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

So if the union does decide to ballot people have a choice , as they do everytime. However the choice is even more stark as if you vote no then you are accepting that Royal Mail can introduce their new buisness plan without agreement which will demand further savings in your office

Problem is that some offices are introducing change with the agreement of the Union, despite the local offices disagreeing - members will not support IA wholeheartedly unless that is addressed.

allow them to introduce their 5 year plan without further benefits including the removing of colleague share , allow complusory redundancies , remember MTSF only lasts 3 years when their new bussiness plan lasts 5. Plus allows CPI on pensions rather than RPI and opens the door for further pensions changes.

All good reasons as long as the Union engage with the membership and do not decouple ANY issue from the whole package without grass roots agreement.

So if the union do ballot then it will be the make or break ballot for everyone, but I believe that we are fast reaching the make or break time for the workforce and Royal Mail.

They all are - hopefully the CWU don't use the nuclear option (Strikes) without being pushed to the limit every time.

I will support any strike that has been mandated by a vote, I just hope that the National side of the CWU engage with the membership below area level and try to address the problems members are facing on a daily basis, rather than concentrating on national issues - if they don't then I think it will be a close call come the ballot. I also think that if the case for London is pushed too much that it will be a strategic mistake. The arguments that are put forward to get a backing for a national dispute should be put forward in a National context and not a localised one.

[ronpetetrevchris]

It seems almost laughable that RM only now realise that the savings arent going to happen, have we not been telling them from the very start that despite the weight off the shoulder being a good decision there was going to be very little benefit to business or service, why do they continue to ignore the experienced postie on the ground?

The operational side of the revision i am for and have been involved from the start in my office. I am pleased to be in a position to oversee and the team we have at our D.O is (for now at least) on the same page,as in we want it to work. But i warned from the start to DOM and DSM there would be no savings from this and that IS becoming the case.

I do want IA becasue this company is a liar, however i do believe if i bail out now of the revision it would just give RM chance to arrange it so it does make savings.

[hans solo]

if the agreement is not legally binding why oh why do mangmt insist we play by parts they like
rip it up and get a legally binding contract for all
by the way if rm can ignore agreement wtf are the executive going to do resign they ratified this and should stand or fall by this
absolute joke
and please what is the 5 YEAR PLAN you go about cwu have a duty to inform members what are they hiding from
the whole lot stinks
i sense being called into new agreements cash short term incentive to erode our rights even more with cwu backing
and thats looking at it positively

[dvbuk55]

The rank and file of the union need to be involved every single step of the way if new negotiations are to go ahead.........and I do mean rank and file.....not branch lead cohorts who have in the past seen to be less concerned about the shop floor and more concerned with their own agenda. That is what lead to this last disaster.

No secret meetings, no "localised" special treatment, no side issues involving the national organisation of the CWU but an open, honest and frank discussion on what any agreement involves IN DETAIL, not some nebulously worded agreement which really hadn't had the i's dotted and the t's crossed before the ballot on the agreement AND a free vote with all the information at hand................lets not take 6 months about it this time. Clearly set out the agenda and stick to it.

[clashcityrocker]

Some of the Hardliners the Hawks mainly the operational managers want out of the agreement and by their actions are hoping that the union walk away from the agreement and therefore Royal Mail do not get the blame.

So how many "hawks" are there?
And are there any doves?