ROYAL MAIL PUTTING PROFITS BEFORE YOUR FUTURE

[DirtyHarry]

Royal Mail really is a terrible company to work for.
Tens of thousands of postal workers, no longer proud to work for the nation's postal carrier, any pride having been long since knocked out of us, are praying for a chance of VR/early retirement.
The CWU strategy over the last decade and a half, has been a calamitous disaster for front-line postal workers.
Daily, the health of postal workers is paid scant regard by senior management.
Even DOMs, who should know better than anyone, push the "less staff, more work" agenda to it's absolute limit.
There is now no limit to the amount of walking we're expected to do every day, nor is there a limit to the workload we're expected to deal with, no matter how ridiculous that workload is most of the time.
I don't care what anybody says, but when a company, any company, declares war on it's own workforce. Disrespects that workforce at every turn. Insults that workforce in the most blatant manner, then the union representing that workforce fights for a just outcome. Fights to ensure that the management/workers don't start to resemble despots/downtrodden peasants.

Management and unions can never become partners. We are natural foes. The time for the CWU playing lapdog to the most backward, 19th century minded, despotic bunch of scumbags to disgrace any company boardroom, must stop, and stop now.

[feduppostie]

we had this 2 years ago - all filled it in - nothing happened

preference exercise to see how the land lies

but then again we weren't in London so I guess it didn't matter

[dvbuk55]

There has been a total lack of reading the situation from the CWU London Brigade.

It was quite obvious that with the closures there would be a level of over manning and no amount of bluster and sabre rattling could possibly protect every job. If the full time union reps are so au fait with the feeling at shop floor level, then they should have taken a straw poll of ALL London areas, affected or not, to get a rough guide as to exactly how many WOULD take VR within a reasonable distance of travel - that in itself would give a guide figure on what the expected compulsory redundancies would be.........if anyone is scaremongering then it is the CWU.

I have asked the question time and time again without any response from those who are supposed to be the guiding light for the membership and received no response and the question is:

If there is insufficient work to sustain the present workforce and there are too few volunteers for VR - THEN WHAT IS THE ANSWER?

As for RM ignoring the CWU whenever has it been any different in the last five years, especially with the CWU trumpeting how there is now full inclusion and a new partnership based on trust......................yeah right!!!!! Perhaps even those who chose to go to the Dark Side now see the error of their ways.

[Martin Walsh]

Dvbuk for the life of me I dont get you at all. You argue that Royal Mail are lying on traffic in deliveries yet you take for gospel that Royal Mail are correct in their predictions for traffic in London.

We have proven that traffic has not decreased anywhere near what Royal Mail have said. So what do they now resort to saying that traffic will halve by 2013 now unless you can see the future then how can you say that traffic has decreased in those mail centres. Its a lie by Royal Mail to con indivduals to not support those London postal workers who face complulsory redundanices. If would seem that you have took it hook line and sinker.

The reality is that there are only 3 mail centres in London , Royal Mail"s plans close 2 of them and reduces staffing levels in the one that remains open by 57%, Royal Mail offer of jobs in the outer London offices are based on produtivity levels which are both unfair ie the fact the new automation has not been installed in London whereas it has in Romford , Croydon , Greenford and Jubilee and the fact that London weightng is being used which disadvantages the inner London offices. In addition the Mount deals with 26000 priorty services items per night and more packets so Royal Mail"s weighting is not fair to compare productivity levls. The outer London offices have already had VR exercises so there is no chance that Royal Mail can find jobs for indivuduals. Everyone who looks into this knows that if Royal Mail reject the unions alternative proposal then it means that Royal Mail are pushing ahead with complusory redundacies and transfers.


Then we will see if people who talk a good fight really mean what they say. Yes I know i speak for the London Mail Centres as I meet with the members even thou Royal Mail refuse to let me inside to speak with them we have the meetings outside. We will not be censored or silenced. So Dvbuk take your anti London blinkers off , dont expect your help or some on here but AS SURE AS NIGHT BECOMES DAY IF THEY GET AWAY WITH IT IN lONDON THEN THEY WONT BE SHY IN INTRODUCING IT EVERYWHERE KNOWING THAT THE MEMBERSHIP HAS NOT GOT THE BOTTLE TO FIGHT IT.

[colcestrian]

Royal Mail really is a terrible company to work for.
Tens of thousands of postal workers, no longer proud to work for the nation's postal carrier, any pride having been long since knocked out of us, are praying for a chance of VR/early retirement.
The CWU strategy over the last decade and a half, has been a calamitous disaster for front-line postal workers.
Daily, the health of postal workers is paid scant regard by senior management.
Even DOMs, who should know better than anyone, push the "less staff, more work" agenda to it's absolute limit.
There is now no limit to the amount of walking we're expected to do every day, nor is there a limit to the workload we're expected to deal with, no matter how ridiculous that workload is most of the time.
I don't care what anybody says, but when a company, any company, declares war on it's own workforce. Disrespects that workforce at every turn. Insults that workforce in the most blatant manner, then the union representing that workforce fights for a just outcome. Fights to ensure that the management/workers don't start to resemble despots/downtrodden peasants.

Management and unions can never become partners. We are natural foes. The time for the CWU playing lapdog to the most backward, 19th century minded, despotic bunch of scumbags to disgrace any company boardroom, must stop, and stop now.

What a superb post couldnt have put it better myself - any chance the courier might put this in the letters section!!!

[dvbuk55]

Dvbuk for the life of me I dont get you at all.

Well that is one statement that I would never disagree with.

Now it would appear that outer London MCs have already had a VR preference and so the next logical step would be for inner London to also have the same exercise - we had one, where it was a question of VR or buy down and that was almost 6 years ago and no there wasn't a ballot for industrial action, nor any suggestion that we should be treated any differently.

As for me swallowing hook line and sinker anything that Royal Mail say now that is rich from the author of the deal of the century, where everything that RM promised was coming down from the mountain on two tablets of stone according to you - yet when that same agreement is applied to London, it suddenly doesn't seem so good. Particularly when the agreement did NOT say there would be NO CRs it said they would try to be avoided - remember the old adage dingo - the words are the words.

The statement that there will be compulsory redundancies is purely from the CWU, as far as I can tell RM have not categorically stated there WILL be CRs, they are asking for a preference exercise to judge the take up of VRs - which brings me back to the elephant in the room:

If there is insufficient work to maintain the current staffing levels and there are too few willing to take VRs - THEN WHAT IS THE ANSWER? It would appear that London would like to call a ballot on that point but it is simply a fact of life throughout industry - the level of manpower MUST equate to the amount of work in order to maintain profitability.

[Danelectro]

AS SURE AS NIGHT BECOMES DAY IF THEY GET AWAY WITH IT IN lONDON THEN THEY WONT BE SHY IN INTRODUCING IT EVERYWHERE KNOWING THAT THE MEMBERSHIP HAS NOT GOT THE BOTTLE TO FIGHT IT.

If thats the case I would definitely support any IA for the reason mentioned above,im sure others would do the same,what
dosnt seem to be apparent to HQ is that to get more support for that fight and any other fight they need to put a few
things right so to speak.

[Martin Walsh]

Dvbuk I most be bored as I am replying to you , now the fact that all mail centres have lost due to DSA some outward , but inward has not decreased , all mail centres struggled to clear at christmas. Swindon , Manchester, Warrington and South Midlands are all still struggling to clear as a result of other mail centres closurse.

South London has the 2nd most inward of any mail centre , East London the 4th and the Mount the number 1. Now does that seem there is too little work.

Now in terms of perference exercises mail centre staff have had the opportunity to leave on VR for years. The well is dry in the inner London office and they can not get the numbers to go.

Now I dont care whether you support us or even care about this fact , however what I do care is for those members in London who have supported every dispute both legal and unlegal have refused to do other mail centres work and taken action to support them and yet some on here could not care less if they are forced out of a job. I say shame on you and shame on those who believe the way to get back at the union is to not support those people being made complusory redundant.

[fishtank]

I say shame on you and shame on those who believe the way to get back at the union is to not support those people being made complusory redundant.

Your missing the point here dingo.
No-one has been made compulsory redundant or even threatened with it.
What you are asking or what i should say is that HQ will be asking the membership to make a leap of faith,trust the opinions of the leadership and respect their decision to call a ballot before a single member has been issued with a notice of compulsory redundancy.

That is where you have your problem....not that the members would not support each other...of course they would if members were issued with notices but those 3 words of faith,trust and respect for the opinions of the leadership are a different matter.

[dvbuk55]

Dvbuk I most be bored as I am replying to you , now the fact that all mail centres have lost due to DSA some outward , but inward has not decreased , all mail centres struggled to clear at christmas. Swindon , Manchester, Warrington and South Midlands are all still struggling to clear as a result of other mail centres closurse.

South London has the 2nd most inward of any mail centre , East London the 4th and the Mount the number 1. Now does that seem there is too little work.

Now in terms of perference exercises mail centre staff have had the opportunity to leave on VR for years. The well is dry in the inner London office and they can not get the numbers to go.

Now I dont care whether you support us or even care about this fact , however what I do care is for those members in London who have supported every dispute both legal and unlegal have refused to do other mail centres work and taken action to support them and yet some on here could not care less if they are forced out of a job. I say shame on you and shame on those who believe the way to get back at the union is to not support those people being made complusory redundant.

It does you credit that you DO reply because mine is an opposite opinion to yours and if you are right, then it will be justified. If there has been VRs for years then that in itself tells a tale.......I can tell you that in my delivery office there has not been a single VR in over 20 years.....absolutely true and that too tells a tale - that the workforce has been matched to workload.

You talk about supporting industrial action which has not been balloted for on a cause which has not yet been proven and I reserve judgement on whether or not that cause is worthy of support. You consider me to be anti union and anti London, in the one instance I believe the cause justifies the reaction to poor union communication and management and as for London perhaps I am overly sensitive to what some consider as special cases when I consider that a national union is just that and not some platform for vested local interest.

Perhaps you misunderstand! My reaction is one of facing reality and not trying to drum up support for something which has not yet happened BUT if it should come to compulsory redundancies then that too has to be met, in my opinion, not with strike action but with trying to get the best possible terms.

You still do not explain how you can reconcile manpower to workload if there are insufficient VRs. If there is enough work then CRs would not be an issue and so, at least to my mind, there must be some justification for the preference exercise and potentially CRs under the modernisation agreement.

[Martin Walsh]

Dvbuk there is world of difference between a mail centre giving VR and a delivery office. VR is easy to achieve in mail centres as you can introduce revisions or lasping in a bigger way whereas in deliveries you have to ensure you can achieve the USO.

For example in a mail centre they often have mini revisons and I know in all 3 London offices last year over 450 went on VR but in both South and East London there were no enough takers.

Royal Mail want out of MTSF it costs them far to much that is without doubt. Now in terms of the union forcing Royal Mail to pay more for those who want to leave well I personally believe that we should be forcing Royal Mail to ensure that everyone who wants a job shall have a job even if that intially alters their producitivity target in the recieving mail centre. Now I think everyone who has seriously reviews the London changes know it that it will lead to complusory redundancies.

Thats why Royal Mail are still considering the unions alternative proposition. Its a big call for them as well. However if they do push ahead with their plans then I think the agreement is dead. Now I know some on here will be pleased about that but what will replace it , things wont go back to what they were , neither will that mean they change their plans it will simply mean that we either tackle their new plans on an office by office basis or we fight it together.

Its a big call for both sides hence the fact they have not phased any work out and we have not gone to the media giving the ballot timetable. The next two weeks are going to be the make or break weeks for all members. This is not a London issue this is far bigger

[rockytony67]

This is what dvbuk had to say on the National Briefing which took place on the 29/3/11. He made these comments on the 31/3/11.

I am the unions worst critic because I believe they should have been more proactive in dealing with RMs duplicitous management instead of the appeasement that has been evident for a number of years. That has weakened the unions position and it is now critical that they make a stand, not over colleague shares, but over the callous way that RM have treated its workers across the land. If the CWU call a ballot I will rejoin immediately I am certain that this time it's for real, no interim agreements, no lip service to terms and conditions but a concerted attack on what has became a vicious managerial structure.

There you go the great man(woman) has spoken I'm just waiting for his mate to turn up with the fishing rod

[dvbuk55]

This is what dvbuk had to say on the National Briefing which took place on the 29/3/11. He made these comments on the 31/3/11.

I am the unions worst critic because I believe they should have been more proactive in dealing with RMs duplicitous management instead of the appeasement that has been evident for a number of years. That has weakened the unions position and it is now critical that they make a stand, not over colleague shares, but over the callous way that RM have treated its workers across the land. If the CWU call a ballot I will rejoin immediately I am certain that this time it's for real, no interim agreements, no lip service to terms and conditions but a concerted attack on what has became a vicious managerial structure.

There you go the great man(woman) has spoken I'm just waiting for his mate to turn up with the fishing rod

There you go rocky - across the land - not south of watford. If the union ballot on a NATIONAL issue with benefits FOR ALL then I will rejoin the union
but a set of circumstances that has no proven merits is a non-starter.

[dvbuk55]

Dvbuk there is world of difference between a mail centre giving VR and a delivery office. VR is easy to achieve in mail centres as you can introduce revisions or lasping in a bigger way whereas in deliveries you have to ensure you can achieve the USO.

For example in a mail centre they often have mini revisons and I know in all 3 London offices last year over 450 went on VR but in both South and East London there were no enough takers.

Royal Mail want out of MTSF it costs them far to much that is without doubt. Now in terms of the union forcing Royal Mail to pay more for those who want to leave well I personally believe that we should be forcing Royal Mail to ensure that everyone who wants a job shall have a job even if that intially alters their producitivity target in the recieving mail centre. Now I think everyone who has seriously reviews the London changes know it that it will lead to complusory redundancies.

Thats why Royal Mail are still considering the unions alternative proposition. Its a big call for them as well. However if they do push ahead with their plans then I think the agreement is dead. Now I know some on here will be pleased about that but what will replace it , things wont go back to what they were , neither will that mean they change their plans it will simply mean that we either tackle their new plans on an office by office basis or we fight it together.

Its a big call for both sides hence the fact they have not phased any work out and we have not gone to the media giving the ballot timetable. The next two weeks are going to be the make or break weeks for all members. This is not a London issue this is far bigger

What you are really suggesting is that regardless of workload then everyone who wants a job should have a job regardless of cost. Is that a realistic approach? I just wonder what the next owners of Royal Mail will think of that as part of their business plan. Like it or not this is now a business and dumbing down the figures to fit everyone in is, in my opinion, an absolute non-starter for a profit making organisation. Is there another way to raise revenue to offset over inflated manpower?

[rockytony67]

This is what dvbuk had to say on the National Briefing which took place on the 29/3/11. He made these comments on the 31/3/11.

I am the unions worst critic because I believe they should have been more proactive in dealing with RMs duplicitous management instead of the appeasement that has been evident for a number of years. That has weakened the unions position and it is now critical that they make a stand, not over colleague shares, but over the callous way that RM have treated its workers across the land. If the CWU call a ballot I will rejoin immediately I am certain that this time it's for real, no interim agreements, no lip service to terms and conditions but a concerted attack on what has became a vicious managerial structure.

There you go the great man(woman) has spoken I'm just waiting for his mate to turn up with the fishing rod

There you go rocky - across the land - not south of watford. If the union ballot on a NATIONAL issue with benefits FOR ALL then I will rejoin the union
but a set of circumstances that has no proven merits is a non-starter.

OK thanks for clearing that up any more pearls of wisdom keep them coming dvbuk as the French say C'est la vie