Infinity and Beyond

[Steviea34]

We have been told the revision will go ahead, but it cannot worsen the office run rate,
so if it saves hours fine, if it means putting hours in, it wont, simples and yes the area
rep is aware of it.

...but it's not about savings stevie.
It's about using the agreed tools and if that means your office needs hours then so be it.
You remember the flannel...don't you?

Do not disagree Fishtank, i am only saying what i know to be true and this is not from the floor or DOM
but higher up the food chain.

[Martin Walsh]

Quality post Tamsky

No doubt Dingo and his like will be on soon to say all is fine with the agreement and you and your office are just weak!

Not at all, the BTA National Agreement was based on Royal Mail"s business plan which has now failed. In fact their plan is now going to take an extra two years to achieve. The Intregrated revisions are not going well , some have collasped and the savings they expected from the tools are not being achieved. Revenue is falling quicker than hours are coming out. Not a great postion for the company. However they signed into the deal with the union which was linked to pay rises , and lump sums and was for three years not five.

So of course disucssions are needed and have begun. In addition Royal Mail have indicated a futher business plan which is another issue which the union needs to discuss.

So if you ask me whether the agreement has problems then I would say yes it has. However the problem is that Royal Mail"s plans are not working. We all know why the model week being too low , 100 EP both indoors and outdoors and the fact that park and loop is the biggest change in deliveries in a generation.

Royal Mail have a real problem , what is going to be their next move. We can all guess that but the union can argue that we have a national agreement and is their new plan going to be in or out of line with this agreement. Lets see how things develop.

[fishtank]

So of course disucssions are needed and have begun. In addition Royal Mail have indicated a futher business plan which is another issue which the union needs to discuss.

Why is the HQ's default position always to keep the membership in the dark?
Royal Mail's position has changed,that is obvious to all.
What is our position? and why are the members always the last to know something that affects them much more than it does those who are doing the "discussing"?

[Martin Walsh]

It seems that there is finally a grass roots upsurge in dissatisfaction with the way the union is being managed, long overdue in my opinion. For far too long the leadership have been treating the membership as a cash cow with scant regard to their wishes. It would appear now that even the likes of Dingo realise that things cannot continue as they are if the union is to survive as an independent body.

The TUC also has to shoulder some of the blame as there has been very little in the way of concerted attacks on Government policy especially of the last Labour government.

Dvbuk Its been an hobby horse of mine for years to be fair. As one of the authors of taking the union forward , I do believe there needs to be reform of CWU Headquarters but also in Branch"s. Now this years conference will be intresting, in my view we have 90 000 less members than we did in 2000 yet we have the same number of departments at headquarters. In my view there should be less but the moment you mention a cut in the number of central service department then you have Health and Safetys , Equal Opps reps , Union learning or Tutors etc or organsing reps arguing that we need to protect those departments. But at the end of the day most members join the union for reprsentation in the workplace and thats where more of the unions money should be targeted not in keeping seperate departments. Remember when we merged the treasurers departments with senior deputy secretarys role did we stop doing union finaces , when we merged the Legal and Medical department with the Employment department did we stop doing ETs. When we merge the Indoor secreatrys job with the other postal officers jobs will we stip represneting members in mail centres of course not.

[Martin Walsh]

So of course disucssions are needed and have begun. In addition Royal Mail have indicated a futher business plan which is another issue which the union needs to discuss.

Why is the HQ's default position always to keep the membership in the dark?
Royal Mail's position has changed,that is obvious to all.
What is our position? and why are the members always the last to know something that affects them much more than it does those who are doing the "discussing"?

Fishtank thats not my call , I think the information I have given is subject to the highest level of talks and that is how the agreement was structured ie National Deployment Group with ACAS and Roger Poole. There have been an exchange of correspondence and Moya Greene is due to meet our Postal Executive next week. In terms of comms and information to the members I think the union needs Royal Mail to answer a number of points before they can explain to the members what has changed and how.

[fishtank]

So of course disucssions are needed and have begun. In addition Royal Mail have indicated a futher business plan which is another issue which the union needs to discuss.

Why is the HQ's default position always to keep the membership in the dark?
Royal Mail's position has changed,that is obvious to all.
What is our position? and why are the members always the last to know something that affects them much more than it does those who are doing the "discussing"?

Fishtank thats not my call

I didn't think it was was dingo and i appreciate the information but HQ has to understand that the members are aware that there are major issues and obviously management aren't talking,not that they are a reliable source anyway so to be faced by silence from their own union is doubly frustrating.
I know that there is a need to find out just what direction Royal Mail intend to take but if it is non-compliance with the agreement they will attempt to string the union and ACAS along for as long as possible.
Can the members be kept in the dark that long?

[Lincox]

When is an agreement not an agreement. When Royal Mail enters into an agreement and it doesn,t turn out in their favour. So can you tell me Dingo, is there any more point into going into discussions with these liars, cheats and whatever else you want to call them. If the cwu has any belly, they will now be in a stronger negotiating position as RM will be ripping up yet another agreement, but does it matter because if it suits they will rip any further agreement up as quickly as they are ripping this one up. The starting point of any negotiation should be immediate payment to all members that have not received the bonuses under the current agreement. No payment, no discussions.

[DirtyHarry]

The question is whether it is a revision which provides the tools for the job, reducing weight on the shoulder with achieveable workload and delivery spans and achieves one in four Sats off or whether it is a revision based on taking hours out through the Capacity plan and Geo route.

I don't deny we need revisions, but change will only succeed with the consent of the staff.

This is where postal workers get it fundamentally wrong, we should all deny Royal Mail's request/order for revisions.
The more we say to them, "yep, you have a point there," the more they will take the pisss out of us.
Cost-cutting, under whatever guise, will only serve to crucify an already demoralised army of physical wrecks, which is what postal workers by and large are.
Cost-cutting under whatever guise, will also only serve to fill the pockets of DOMs only too willing to bang in the nails while we're being crucified, with completely unwarranted, totally undeserved, bonuses.

[hans solo]

Quality post Tamsky

No doubt Dingo and his like will be on soon to say all is fine with the agreement and you and your office are just weak!

tamsky,s offices are most definately not weak just ask their mgmt in the local offices
they haven,t been able to roll us over for years and it aint going to happen anytime soon they must be sick of the way we can stick together .
thanks for the support with the issues raised by your members tam
await your opinion and comments
remember brothers out there we / you are the union not hq make demands of them ,make them do their job properly dont wait for hq , we tell them what we want regardless be strong
i think we might have to be