whats your view on the cwu

[dvbuk55]

Unfortunately the PEC is populated by the very same people who spawned the likes of the present leadership. Lets be realistic here, the favourite "faces" on here are of the same ilk as the leadership. It is time that people understood that the CWU is a seperate entity to the rank and file who financially support it.
The CWU is interested only in its survival and has scant regard for the terms and conditions of the very people who make it possible.

[gb93]

Who would of thought from the high brow posts last night on this thread, that it would sink so low today
Some interesting points & thoughts posted, but will they make a scrap of difference .
It is easier to moan and critise, rather than come up with workable solutions for all.
I don't have the answers but sure know moaning & apathy isn't one.

[fishtank]

.
I don't have the answers but sure know moaning & apathy isn't one.

Moaning does no harm at all except maybe bore the arse of some.
Apathy,however is the terminal disease that may finish the union altogether.

[dvbuk55]

You've more chance of being elected as an MP than being voted to the top table of the union.

[Cut Off King]

There have been a lot of heartfelt honest posts on both sides of this topic

BUT IN THE END NOTHING WILL CHANGE

[dvbuk55]

There have been a lot of heartfelt honest posts on both sides of this topic

BUT IN THE END NOTHING WILL CHANGE

D'you know COK, that is the most true statement on this board. There is only one way to express dissatisfaction as an individual and it isn't a vote.

[Body Beyond Repair]

Lack Communication............

[andy2007]

There have been a lot of heartfelt honest posts on both sides of this topic

BUT IN THE END NOTHING WILL CHANGE

D'you know COK, that is the most true statement on this board. There is only one way to express dissatisfaction as an individual and it isn't a vote.

Not neccessarily. It's incredibly difficult to get change "at the top", but it's not impossible. Those of us with a long enough memory, remember the improvement, when we got, when we got rid of Keggie. It didn't last. But that could be sorted, by reducing the length of the term, from 5 to 2 years.

[gideon 60]

There have been a lot of heartfelt honest posts on both sides of this topic

BUT IN THE END NOTHING WILL CHANGE

D'you know COK, that is the most true statement on this board. There is only one way to express dissatisfaction as an individual and it isn't a vote.

Not neccessarily. It's incredibly difficult to get change "at the top", but it's not impossible. Those of us with a long enough memory, remember the improvement, when we got, when we got rid of Keggie. It didn't last. But that could be sorted, by reducing the length of the term, from 5 to 2 years.

was keggie that bad?

[andy2007]

I don't know what he was like at the start. But by the time I joined RM in the late '90's, he was. Perhaps someone who's been a Postie longer, could tell us what he was like in the early days at the top.

[peterloo]

There have been a lot of heartfelt honest posts on both sides of this topic

BUT IN THE END NOTHING WILL CHANGE

D'you know COK, that is the most true statement on this board. There is only one way to express dissatisfaction as an individual and it isn't a vote.

Not neccessarily. It's incredibly difficult to get change "at the top", but it's not impossible. Those of us with a long enough memory, remember the improvement, when we got, when we got rid of Keggie. It didn't last. But that could be sorted, by reducing the length of the term, from 5 to 2 years.

was keggie that bad?

Keggie was a hell of a lot better than billy hayes. I once saw Keggie change the minds of a whole conference floor when they were debating if seniority should be transferable or not and i mean the whole conference floor it was awesome!
I THINK LOSING KEGGIE WAS A HUGE MISTAKE BY THE MEMBERSHIP

[taurus88]

I've only been with RM for a short while so I like to think I've looked at the CWU with an open mind. Initially, I thought that they were useless and said as much on here. It is clear that they struck a deal with RM that greatly favoured the upper echelons of the work force, leaving the vast majority with more work and weight for less money. The agreement was vaguely worded and should not have been agreed to by anyone without clear and concise wording - i.e. x WILL do this on condition that y agrees to this. There are clear and obvious faults with the CWU and the 2010 and Beyond Agreement was robbery.

HOWEVER, the CWU is on to a hiding to nothing. They are looking after a work-force who cannot look after themselves, who, for the sake of five minutes, would willingly undermine each and every agreement that was put in place for their benefit, then WHINGE about it afterwards. The minority of people who do the job properly loathe the CWU, with some justification, because their job has been rendered unworkable because of the agreement and the various revisions. But there are those, an irritating majority, who refuse to bow to the advice of intelligent people and consequently get exactly the union that they deserve.

If you're not prepared to help the union help you, you can hardly sit there and complain about their uselessness. Many of the people who complain about the CWU have completely disregarded their advice on various issues, particularly in terms of doing the job properly. For the CWU it's like banging a million heads against a brick wall, but they still won't listen. I have my objections to the CWU, but my local area rep is very good and is trying his absolute best to help the workforce, and to help the workforce help themselves. Unfortunately for him he too is on a hiding to nothing as, no matter what he does, nobody listens to his common sense.

So, blame the CWU, but much more than the CWU it's fellow workers who have made a mockery of the job. Cut-ups, frak-ups, greedy bastards, they're all the same. And they're not just ruining the job on a personal level, they're encouraging the youngsters coming in to do the job the same way - they're the work place coaches, they're the loudmouths getting in other people's ears. At our place, newbies are coming in and inheriting the same weaknesses; using their own cars, running around to get the job done, coming in early to finish on time. They're doing it not because they want to but because they don't know that there's an alternative.

Managers, of course, are in no rush to educate these individuals because they know that by exploiting them in just such a way, they are ensuring that the mail gets out, that walks are cleared, and without the overtime that should in actuality be required in order to clear the office. On all levels this job is a complete mess - and it stems from the complete selfishness of (unfortunately) a majority of workers more concerned with themselves than with any kind of benevolent desire to help other people, including their comrades and 'the customer'. I understand where the mentality comes from, but it belongs to the Royal Mail of yesteryear. And it's not the CWU's fault.

I look at it now and I think that the CWU gave the majority of the workforce the agreement that they deserved.

[hubbahubba]

There's a lot of speculation on this,and other threads as to why the 60,000 didnt vote.My own personal opinion is that most didn't have enough,or even any information on what they were voting on!(kind of hard to have an opinion on something when you haven,t go a clue what it is eh?).Maybe people heard the speel of "no plan B"and thought,"i don't like plan A,so i'll just do nothing!".Anyway,why doesn't the CWU put a survey out,asking members why they didn't vote on such an important issue?This could be a postal survey,or even a confidental note dropped in a ballot box in the union room at work.At least this way the CWU may have some idea of the average posties feelings on these matters?

[fishtank]

I don't know what he was like at the start. But by the time I joined RM in the late '90's, he was. Perhaps someone who's been a Postie longer, could tell us what he was like in the early days at the top.

Keggie was in all honesty too close to Labour..strange that we now think about Billy in the same way,he was also not shy about playing power games and playing one region off against another to suit his own agenda...i think in the end he just got a bit power happy.
To be fair Billy was not much better...they were both responsible for the Way Forward even if Billy tried to distance himself afterwards...it was a close vote in the end if i remember correctly.
Keggie sealed his fate when he wouldn't support the LDC over London Weighting...a schoolboy error if you ask me.

[Body Beyond Repair]

I've only been with RM for a short while so I like to think I've looked at the CWU with an open mind. Initially, I thought that they were useless and said as much on here. It is clear that they struck a deal with RM that greatly favoured the upper echelons of the work force, leaving the vast majority with more work and weight for less money. The agreement was vaguely worded and should not have been agreed to by anyone without clear and concise wording - i.e. x WILL do this on condition that y agrees to this. There are clear and obvious faults with the CWU and the 2010 and Beyond Agreement was robbery.

HOWEVER, the CWU is on to a hiding to nothing. They are looking after a work-force who cannot look after themselves, who, for the sake of five minutes, would willingly undermine each and every agreement that was put in place for their benefit, then WHINGE about it afterwards. The minority of people who do the job properly loathe the CWU, with some justification, because their job has been rendered unworkable because of the agreement and the various revisions. But there are those, an irritating majority, who refuse to bow to the advice of intelligent people and consequently get exactly the union that they deserve.

If you're not prepared to help the union help you, you can hardly sit there and complain about their uselessness. Many of the people who complain about the CWU have completely disregarded their advice on various issues, particularly in terms of doing the job properly. For the CWU it's like banging a million heads against a brick wall, but they still won't listen. I have my objections to the CWU, but my local area rep is very good and is trying his absolute best to help the workforce, and to help the workforce help themselves. Unfortunately for him he too is on a hiding to nothing as, no matter what he does, nobody listens to his common sense.

So, blame the CWU, but much more than the CWU it's fellow workers who have made a mockery of the job. Cut-ups, frak-ups, greedy bastards, they're all the same. And they're not just ruining the job on a personal level, they're encouraging the youngsters coming in to do the job the same way - they're the work place coaches, they're the loudmouths getting in other people's ears. At our place, newbies are coming in and inheriting the same weaknesses; using their own cars, running around to get the job done, coming in early to finish on time. They're doing it not because they want to but because they don't know that there's an alternative.

Managers, of course, are in no rush to educate these individuals because they know that by exploiting them in just such a way, they are ensuring that the mail gets out, that walks are cleared, and without the overtime that should in actuality be required in order to clear the office. On all levels this job is a complete mess - and it stems from the complete selfishness of (unfortunately) a majority of workers more concerned with themselves than with any kind of benevolent desire to help other people, including their comrades and 'the customer'. I understand where the mentality comes from, but it belongs to the Royal Mail of yesteryear. And it's not the CWU's fault.

I look at it now and I think that the CWU gave the majority of the workforce the agreement that they deserved.