Simple Question Deal or no Deal

[robd]

Simple answer Dingo....Local agreement.

[TrueBlueTerrier]

Just about to go out and meet friends for a few and to bring in the new year. But I will leave you with this !!

Happy new year hope you had a good time.

The agreement does not have executive action , it has full involvement and it has a sign off to get the money why did some offices agree a revision which they thought would fail ?

Perhaps the No Plan B approach to the BT2010 has had an unforeseen impact and to be honest its a bit rich blaming members when they had very little knowledge of the fine print of the agreement when they are presented with a "done deal" by local managers and reps. Is anyone at HQ actually checking the revisions or are they all leaving it at local levels where the agreement/impacts and tools are not FULLY understood.

You can blame the union for loads but why did no one go through the disagreement procedure ? No revision can be introduced by Executive action as it has to be discussed at national level in the event of no resolution at stage 3.

- if its presented as the only deal on the table by FT release (and some have been) then what can an ordinary member do. Perhaps the focus and power at Branch Level needs to be reviewed as it does not seem to be working well especially concerning the BT2010 agreement.

So the conclusion has to be that you are not using the agreement to prevent Royal Mail introducing unacceptable things .

The conclusion I get from this statement is that the ordinary members are to blame - which when most did not even get a copy of the agreement, a briefing on the various tools and parameters used and briefing by HQ that there was no Plan B seems on a par to blaming a pedestrian for walking on a path when they get knocked over by a speeding car.

Imagine if we did not have an agreement some of you would have got seriously rolled over.

and some are anyway IMHO - the people who are out doing deliveries have lost - You say that to loose out you have to be delivering to over 400 DPs well guess what with the new park and loop 90% of delivering posties will be.

The Union does not begin or end at 150 The Broadway it is about every unit standing up in unity getting the right deal. Some areas do this very well and some dont.

Your right it doesn't it starts at the lowest common denominator the ordinary member and if Reps keep harking back to past sacrifices which have been fully acknowledged then the CWU will continue to alienate them. We need reps of all levels to work in the current reality and address members concerns. Some do this extremely well others don't. I still firmly believe that you can only understand members concerns about agreements/methods if you actually experience them. Being briefed or holding a meeting helps but to believe you get a real understanding is misguided IMHO. Our ADR actually came out on delivery on Christmas Eve and it was much appreciated by members, perhaps this could be done during the Xmas pressure period evey year. If 50% of full time release reps did this every year then I am sure that it would increase membership, improve communication and make the CWU stronger at local level.

Some decide to go into the blame game blame everyone for their offices lack of bottle to stop things. Other ensure that offices do not get picked off and isolated and that's why some areas get better agreements. It really is stand up and fight or get rolled over.

You don't want to go into the blame game yet you blame weak units - Isn't the Union there to protect and defend the weak.

[london sub]

The agreement does not have executive action , it has full involvement and it has a sign off to get the money why did some offices agree a revision which they thought would fail ?

No one actually thought it would fail as both the RM & CWU agreed to working with some software that calculates the walks. If the software is spitting out unrealistic targets then what chance does any one have when it actually comes to delivering the mail?

[worktotime]

Just about to go out and meet friends for a few and to bring in the new year. But I will leave you with this !!

The agreement does not have executive action , it has full involvement and it has a sign off to get the money why did some offices agree a revision which they thought would fail ?

You can blame the union for loads but why did no one go through the disagreement procedure ? No revison can be introduced by Executive action as it has to be discussed at national level in the event of no resolution at stage 3.

So the conclusion has to be that you are not using the agreement to prevent Royal Mail introudcing unacceptable things .

Imagnine if we did not have an agreement some of you would have got seriously rolled over.

The Union does not begin or end at 150 The Broadway it is about every unit standing up in unity getting the right deal. Some areas do this very well and some dont.

Some decide to go into the blame game blame everyone for their offices lack of bottle to stop things. Other ensure that offices do not get picked off and isolated and thats why some areas get better agreements. It really is stand up and fight or get rolled over.

Enjoy your new year !!

wise words dingo , but in the real world weve had no input at all in p&l and delivery methods which we started in nov , we knew the dutys where impossible to complete in there time , the worse x mas i have ever had with these new ways , talked to the area rep who was released for 6 mths on full pay to sort this out with dom and (idiot planner) who actualy told us that they would not work so why has he aloud this to happen ? surely he is there to listen to us and act on it am i right or wrong

[JaneM]

Dingo happy new year keep posting ,it is always worth reading your concise rational thoughts plus it inspires debate my friend !

[dvbuk55]

Dingo happy new year keep posting ,it is always worth reading your concise rational thoughts plus it inspires debate my friend !

Good party was it?

[DGP1]

Dingo happy new year keep posting ,it is always worth reading your concise rational thoughts plus it inspires debate my friend !

Good party was it?

Must've been a great one..............good job they still had the energy after a 5 hour delivery to party all night

[arnold cheshire]

just work 8 hrs then simples

[POSTMAN]

I just want to know,all theses bad revision getting in,and i think there's a thread on this somewhere how the f**k did they get voted in?

[DGP1]

I just want to know,all theses bad revision getting in,and i think there's a thread on this somewhere how the f**k did they get voted in?

Money and reps pushing it through with the promise of reviews, I know it'll not be voted in in my office but there will be underhanded tactics used to make it go through (maybe ending up in EA).

[bunkerland]

I just want to know,all theses bad revision getting in,and i think there's a thread on this somewhere how the f**k did they get voted in?

Us posties will vote for anything when offered a few quid as a bribe,thought you would have realised that by now!

[fishtank]

I just want to know,all theses bad revision getting in,and i think there's a thread on this somewhere how the f**k did they get voted in?

How do the members know if the revision will fail if it's based on the lowest traffic week and we are in the middle of the highest?
It's not even designed to work at this time of year and even management didn't know and still don't know if it will work.
Obviously money played a part as did extra full-time jobs,attendance patterns and new delivery methods.
Many members in my D.O. also followed the recommendation of the Area Rep who had his own agenda.

Plus...as dingo pointed out we are weak and feeble.

[Glenno]

I just want to know,all theses bad revision getting in,and i think there's a thread on this somewhere how the f**k did they get voted in?

How do the members know if the revision will fail if it's based on the lowest traffic week and we are in the middle of the highest?
It's not even designed to work at this time of year and even management didn't know and still don't know if it will work.
Obviously money played a part as did extra full-time jobs,attendance patterns and new delivery methods.
Many members in my D.O. also followed the recommendation of the Area Rep who had his own agenda.

Plus...as dingo pointed out we are weak and feeble.

Almost 24hrs after after your original post Dingo ( happy new year )
Here is the answer that totally sums things up
Think.. re-think.. engage brain

[dvbuk55]

No deal!

Our traffic figure was queried by the Rep but to no avail, the consequence of which culminated in the worst Christmas ever preceded by failures due to the revision 7 weeks prior.

It will be interesting to see how many offices have succeeded in their delivery method revision and if RM/CWU learn anything from the failures.

[Glenno]

No deal!

Our traffic figure was queried by the Rep but to no avail, the consequence of which culminated in the worst Christmas ever preceded by failures due to the revision 7 weeks prior.

It will be interesting to see how many offices have succeeded in their delivery method revision and if RM/CWU learn anything from the failures.

There Beggith the Q&A
common Dingo ......How much did u drink last nite???