Royal Mail trying to avoid liability for snow

[BIG MICK]

The weather in the North East of England is atrocious today. The managers went out this morning to 'assess' the conditions - and returned to tell staff that they were expected to take 3/4 of their delivery today. As far as I am concerned, this is negligence on a grand scale.. the DOM knows that accidents are CERTAIN to occur in thick snow and ice, but is still not prepared to keep his staff safe. Im telling you now, if it was the middle of February, there is no way we would be allowed to deliver in this current weather..but as it is 3 weeks before Xmas, the pressure is on him to get the backlog sorted asap. Putting Mail before safety is out of order, someboby will have an accident today, and he will not be accountable. Shame on Royal Mail.

[Wiggins79]

Having slogged through the snow for the last 4 days, going into OT each day, finally got a phone call this morning from the subpostmistress telling me not to come in as all deliveries had been cancelled. Not surprising really as there was 2 feet of snow outside. She then said that we would be getting paid, but that they would be clawing back the time owed as unpaid OT over the next month! I don't care if they have "agreed this with the union" I want to know legally where they stand for doing this? Can they do it under EU law? To my mind they are really taking the michael as they stopped us delivering on bikes on Saturday, meaning most of us had a long, long walk to the start of our duties and conditions meant it was really tough going. I personally went over my time each day, but in our office the hours are carried over each day of the week until Saturday which is when the OT starts getting added. So now, they will be attempting to claim back at least a full 7 hours (at least in my case) for a day not worked, even though I've worked more than my 7 hours per day for the last 2 days of this week. And it wasn't as if we got a choice as I was phoned at home and told not to attempt to come in, so couldn't at least sit in the office to fill my hours out!
There has been no let up in the snow today, more forecast for tonight/ tomorrow- are they going to keep us home tomorrow and then expect 14 hours unpaid OT? Where will it end?
Rural suboffice in the DN area by the way.

[da'bunny]

I guess they'll let it build up, then try and get rid of it on the docket.

Got told this morning after being told not to deliver, we will NOT be getting any o.t to clear the lot , have to do it and i quote "as a good will gesture" wtf as if the snows OUR fault

[taurus88]

I guess they'll let it build up, then try and get rid of it on the docket.

Got told this morning after being told not to deliver, we will NOT be getting any o.t to clear the lot , have to do it and i quote "as a good will gesture" wtf as if the snows OUR fault

Ha ha ha.

Ha ha.

I hope they tell me that when I get back. I'll have to make them aware of my very 2010 interpretation of good will .

[Erith 'Erbert]

weve been sent home today and told that any hours unworked today will be banked and used over the rest of the week !!!!

I had exactly the same argument with my managers this morning. They can't do this. Please see this post:
http://www.royalmailchat.co.uk/communit ... 15&t=31925" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[ziggy]

I guess they'll let it build up, then try and get rid of it on the docket.

Got told this morning after being told not to deliver, we will NOT be getting any o.t to clear the lot , have to do it and i quote "as a good will gesture" wtf as if the snows OUR fault

We have had no mail since Saturday , despite that we have all been expected to turn up for work everyday . They were thinking about sending us out today with the sky mags ffs When the mail does come in then I will either cut off or they will have to pay me overtime to do it

[da'bunny]

Ive no intention of working past my time if its not done ile be cutting off simple as that!

[BIG MICK]

They always try it on regarding posties being 'expected to clear the backlog', and 'expected to work over at Xmas', etc.. it's all bollocks, you just need to practice the word 'NO'. Just keep saying it.. come in on your time, and cut off on your time. Xmas pressure or nowt in on a Tuesday in the summer hols, contracted hours do exactly what they say on the tin. Front it out, make sure it's not all fags, tea and biscuits for those pen-pushin' Managers!

[dados]

to all that are stuck in this snow period,both at home & at work, to the management putting deliveries before safety,disgraceful,keep safe people

[Markh9217]

Never mind walking,what about rural drivers,worst duties ever when its snowing.

Debatable whether they are the worst...the van is warm and you shouldn't be going anywhere risky anyway.
Also they are usually the first to be cancelled when SWOP kicks in.

Yeah but managers have to know and do something about SWOP, which aint happening here in Fife.
Even if it does kick in then rural posties will team up with town posties to clear the town but
will still have all the rural sh*t to deliver another day.

Thats what happend to us in Hull today,and i think we will be doing it again tomorrow my frame is bursting now with 4 DTDs and DSA shite but hey i got a nice new set of spikeys today!!!

[Wiggins79]

I've scrutinized the doc linked on here about the severe weather operating procedure, but it is about as clear as mud when it comes to explaining the situation regards managment claiming that days/ hours not worked due to managment declaring deliveries are unsafe to make and them claiming the hours back in unpaid OT. Can someone please tell me for sure one way or the other if they can or cannot do this?
Not sure what is happening in other spdo's but I've now got to wait until the morning to find out if the situation will be the same tomorrow as all signs point to it being just as bad for snow. In fact, I'm not even sure I'll be able to get the car out of the garage it's that damn high. I tried to clear a path with a shovel but gave it up as a bad job in the end as after a good 30 minutes of shoveling it was filling in behind me nearly as fast. Even then, being at the end of a culdesac, unless I shovel the entire street out (and believe me I'd be doing it on my own as no-ones curtains even twitched as I shovelled away) I've still got a fair way to go through at last check 10 inches of snow and my car certainly isn't a 4X4! I'm not trying to shirk my job, in fact it made me kind of proud to be out in it the past few days (I know, saddo) when others just stayed at home, but if management once again cancel deliveries what can you do?

[POSTMAN]

I've scrutinized the doc linked on here about the severe weather operating procedure, but it is about as clear as mud when it comes to explaining the situation regards managment claiming that days/ hours not worked due to managment declaring deliveries are unsafe to make and them claiming the hours back in unpaid OT. Can someone please tell me for sure one way or the other if they can or cannot do this?
Not sure what is happening in other spdo's but I've now got to wait until the morning to find out if the situation will be the same tomorrow as all signs point to it being just as bad for snow. In fact, I'm not even sure I'll be able to get the car out of the garage it's that damn high. I tried to clear a path with a shovel but gave it up as a bad job in the end as after a good 30 minutes of shoveling it was filling in behind me nearly as fast. Even then, being at the end of a culdesac, unless I shovel the entire street out (and believe me I'd be doing it on my own as no-ones curtains even twitched as I shovelled away) I've still got a fair way to go through at last check 10 inches of snow and my car certainly isn't a 4X4! I'm not trying to shirk my job, in fact it made me kind of proud to be out in it the past few days (I know, saddo) when others just stayed at home, but if management once again cancel deliveries what can you do?

CWU HQ made the following statement:
There is no provision within the Pay & Modernisation Agreement for the clawback of any time as a result of what is tantamount to an 'act of God' i.e. the severe weather conditions that the UK is currently experiencing.

So in a nutshell,no banking or claw back of hrs period.

[Wiggins79]

Cheers postman, only just found the link to the CWU HQ statement. I was referring to the RM SWOP document as being very unclear. I've printed the CWU one out so I can be armed with it for the inevitible arguments. What do you do though if they claim your local rep has agreed to it one our behalf (which I don't doubt he will have done as he is a spineless management suck-up)? What about Dingo the 2010 king? What does he have to say about all this?