POLL:BILLY HAYES vs BOB CROW ?

[Big Daz]

Billy's role is nothing more than a national political officer. A overpaid role at that.

All officers should be paid the whatever the average wage is for CWU mbrs

The real power is at conference and in the NEC.

[clashcityrocker]

..... action of the Dras dispute in Liverpool police horse charging the picket lines at Liverpool with Billy leading the pickets.

So i googled images of Dras dispute.................
But which one is Billy?

[stokes11eg]

If Big B led any pickets, he must have stumbled to the front by mistake! Actually, in the one or two shots of him taking part in 'action' he's lookind towards his sidekick as if for reassurance.

[dvbuk55]

..... action of the Dras dispute in Liverpool police horse charging the picket lines at Liverpool with Billy leading the pickets.

So i googled images of Dras dispute.................
But which one is Billy?

You know ccr - I didn't find that at all funny........

[andy2007]

I know Bob and I obviously know Billy. They are two different chacters , both have been involved at the coal face in the past and Billy was certainly a hard left activist in Liverpool and led many a strike and there is still some video action of the Dras dispute in Liverpool police horse charging the picket lines at Liverpool with Billy leading the pickets.

Now the question I have for you is that Bob is a great speaker and a very funny indivdual and great company but in the RMT he has just as many critics some call him not left enough and certainly some of the left in the RMT tried to get indivduals to run against him. Billy Laws and Pat Swatoka were very strong a few years ago on the left.

Now what Bob is very good at is his threatening of the use of industial action and then more often then not doing the deal. Now this has made him unpopular in some quarters of the RMT as they wanted to take the strike action rather than the deal.

So whilst it may be easy to vote for BOB and dont get me wrong he is a good leader he too has his critics in the RMT , just as much as Billy has in the CWU.

Yes, one of my colleagues knew him well in those days too. And he really doesn't like me complaining about Billy. In fact, he won't hear a word against him. Aparently he was quite impressive in those days. But we can't live in the past.

Let's look at the facts here: When he first took over from Keggie, he did a great job IMHO. But as time has gone by, he's become more and more detatched from the realities of being an OPG. And it shows, in the way he handles disputes. I've nothing against him personally. But the fact is that he's out of touch. Perhaps there sould be a time limit on how long someone can hold a "top" job in the CWU, before doing a couple of years in uniform. There'd be nothing to stop someone going back to a senior position afterwards. But at least they'd gain first hand kowledge of what the job is really like.

[andy2007]

Please could someone post a link to some video of the dispute. All I can find are articles about it. No pictures or videos. But for anyone who wants to read about it. Here's a link to an article about the dispute: http://www.workerspower.com/index.php?i ... 99,0,0,1,0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Can anyone spot the similarities between that dispute, and what we've seen over the last few years?
I think this is another case of history repeating itself. What do you think?
Thanks for the "heads up" Dingo. It was before my time in RM, so I didn't know the Details. Just what had been in the Press at the time.

[fishtank]

The job has changed completely in the last 10 years.Billy,Bob and Dave wouldn't recognise it.
The biggest change by far has been in management style...we have gone from "light touch" management where offices more or less ran themselves to an overbearing "micro management" style where every single thing is judged,commented on and interfered with.
It is very difficult to get across to senior union reps just how difficult and stressful an environment this has created.
I'm afraid this new agreement shows that this message was not received...it's a micro-managers wet dream.

[MinisterofCucumber]

To be fair to Billy, he does kick union officials' arses if they stray from the rules or spirit of the union.

The trouble is that not many members are aware of the existence of the rule book. How many Unit reps treat their Area rep as if he/she is their line manager? How many Area reps try to push through local agreements that their members don't want?

Reading some of the posts on this site, it seems that in some parts of the union, Unit, Area, Territorial and National reps have been manipulated into ignoring the wishes of their members and following the management's agenda.

Who pays our Area, Territorial and National reps, and how much do they get?

[dvbuk55]

Well, I am one of the union detractors, and although I am critical of Billy - it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age. In my case it is totally immaterial but when you have the welfare, working conditions, pay and pension of thousands riding on the decisions made, then it is crucial. It is also true that I believe that he has received poor advice,coloured by local conditions and not national. The union structure, as it is, does not work and requires a thorough overhaul and most certainly a shake up of its finances and the manner in which finances are raised.

[BELIAL]

it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age.

pussy

[dvbuk55]

it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age.

pussy

OK - but just the one, I'm not as vigorous as I once was

[BELIAL]

it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age.

pussy

OK - but just the one, I'm not as vigorous as I once was

Wear and tear

[dvbuk55]

it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age.

pussy

OK - but just the one, I'm not as vigorous as I once was

Wear and tear

You're going to have to qualify that a bit B..............wear what and tear what exactly

[BELIAL]

it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age.

pussy

OK - but just the one, I'm not as vigorous as I once was

Wear and tear

You're going to have to qualify that a bit B..............wear what and tear what exactly

I wish to remain tight lipped

[dvbuk55]

it would be true to say that we all, including me, mellow with age.

pussy

OK - but just the one, I'm not as vigorous as I once was

Wear and tear

You're going to have to qualify that a bit B..............wear what and tear what exactly

I wish to remain tight lipped

Ah............I see, afraid of the naughty room then