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new proposals

Postal workers discussion forum. Discuss the day to day life in a Blue Shirt.
fishtank
Posts: 19732
Joined: 28 Sep 2007, 17:22
Gender: Male

Re: new proposals

Post by fishtank »

mclovin wrote:
DGP1 wrote:
dingo wrote:For the record the agreement says the vast majority will be finished by 2.30 with most by 2. 3pm is the default postion.
Bollox, my office at the minute finishes later than that so I'd expect times to be nearer 4pm in my office.
You're being stiffed then. Currently last letter is 2pm town, 3pm rural.

Why did your office agree to it in the first place??

mclovin there are huge areas of the country that work past 2pm
Last letter time ,if it even means anything does not and never has meant duty finish time.
good times, bad times you know I've had my share
not me
Posts: 2735
Joined: 10 Aug 2007, 15:07
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Re: new proposals

Post by not me »

fishtank wrote:
mclovin wrote:
DGP1 wrote:
dingo wrote:For the record the agreement says the vast majority will be finished by 2.30 with most by 2. 3pm is the default postion.
Bollox, my office at the minute finishes later than that so I'd expect times to be nearer 4pm in my office.
You're being stiffed then. Currently last letter is 2pm town, 3pm rural.

Why did your office agree to it in the first place??

mclovin there are huge areas of the country that work past 2pm
Last letter time ,if it even means anything does not and never has meant duty finish time.

same for our office and im sure many others will be heading the same way
eg if you have 2 in a van then you can do packets after the letter delivery
then theres return to office etc etc

all i can say is follow the rules and your hours of work
i wish they would hurry up and get this 39 hour week in
ive heard rumours our DIM wants to knock an hour off Tuesdays however i will be pushing for a daily reduction
fishtank
Posts: 19732
Joined: 28 Sep 2007, 17:22
Gender: Male

Re: new proposals

Post by fishtank »

DGP1 wrote:
dingo wrote:For the record the agreement says the vast majority will be finished by 2.30 with most by 2. 3pm is the default postion.
Bollox, my office at the minute finishes later than that so I'd expect times to be nearer 4pm in my office.
It is bollox DGP.
How can you work a 4 day week around a 2pm finish...unless you start at 4am :chuckle ...or you don't "utilise all paid hours". :hmmmm
If an office moves to a 0700 start which will have to happen in offices that don't get their second batch until 0900 how do they finish at 1400?....travel back in time. :crazy:
good times, bad times you know I've had my share
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POSTMAN
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Re: new proposals

Post by POSTMAN »

I'm currently 3:30 'duty' finish time on my 4 day week.
If i get my last coach at 9ish then i can keep my 4 day week,my last coach atm is 8ish.
We would have top up our indoor work which would not be a prob.

And yes,there are some offices like mine and others in London that do not mind the later finish for the 4 day week,and yes,even Saturdays.
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It's good to get these types of threads, the ridiculous my manager said bollox, so we can reassure ourselves that while the world is falling apart, Royal Mail managers are still being the low-life C***S they have always been.
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Martin Walsh
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Joined: 19 Sep 2007, 20:12
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Re: new proposals

Post by Martin Walsh »

Fishtank you dont do your self any favours by not knowing what your talking about.

Remember the 1st wave of work on walk sequncing is now in a lot of offices by walk sequencing before 0500 . If you finish on your delivery at 2.30 then you add your travelling back time and then appoxmately 15 mins for returning your undelivered packets , any sign offs and any other work you have then it will be 3 oclock.

Remember that flats and packets and d2d will all be in your office from 0600 so you will have a in the main your 60% of walk sequencing mail and all your packets ,flats and door to door in your office early. What your acutally then waiting on is your remianing 40% of walk sequencing.

The delivery span indicator will anaylise what your office can then do as a delivery span.
Lincox
EX ROYAL MAIL
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Re: new proposals

Post by Lincox »

Well Dingo, you need to come to our office. We receive a sweeper van anytime after 9am that can contain as many packets as the original run and boxes of flats as well as letters. The flats could all be left to the following day but they are sent out to us in the name of Clearing the Decks from the DO. In some cases we are receiving just a few boxes of flats which could easily be left to the following day as in general they are advertising blurb. We are kept waiting for the sweeper, and it is a joke to send a van and driver out in some cases with such little and unimportant mail. Things may seem to work like clockwork in your workplace, but that is not the case throughout the country, and perhaps the CWU heirarchy should get mobile and see what is happening in areas outside of the South East.
fishtank
Posts: 19732
Joined: 28 Sep 2007, 17:22
Gender: Male

Re: new proposals

Post by fishtank »

Fishtank you dont do your self any favours by not knowing what your talking about.
Cheap shot,moving on.....
dingo wrote:. If you finish on your delivery at 2.30 then you add your travelling back time and then appoxmately 15 mins for returning your undelivered packets , any sign offs and any other work you have then it will be 3 oclock.
Yes it will be 3 o'clock.....not 2o'clock when the agreement says "most" will be finishing...or 2.30 when the agreement says the "majority" will be finishing but....3 o'clock.
Is that not the point we were trying to make ,it will not be feasable in most case to keep a 2pm duty finish time.? The confusion lies with the spin put on the agreement that completion of delivery meant completion of duty which you and i always knew was not the case...but it didn't hurt to let the members think that "most" of them would still be popping of home at 2pm.
Remember that flats and packets and d2d will all be in your office from 0600 so you will have a in the main your 60% of walk sequencing mail and all your packets ,flats and door to door in your office early. What your acutally then waiting on is your remianing 40% of walk sequencing.
Why will all of your other stuff suddenly be in the door earlier than it is now?....is that part of the plan?....if it is how are the mailcentres going to achieve this when they haven't been able to up to now? ......just curious that's all.
good times, bad times you know I've had my share
iamnotadoormat
Posts: 125
Joined: 02 Apr 2010, 10:26
Gender: Male

Re: new proposals

Post by iamnotadoormat »

No rurals in my office, and if you dont want a rural you can always pick another in the resign.
Will this happen, or is it down to local agreement. i know a lot of guys in our office who have "easy" rurals are proposing no re-sign..........
mclovin
Posts: 1106
Joined: 11 Feb 2009, 18:39
Gender: Male

Re: new proposals

Post by mclovin »

It will happen in the revision. They wont get a choice about it.
Mobster
Posts: 12
Joined: 28 May 2007, 17:56

Re: new proposals

Post by Mobster »

dingo wrote:For the record the agreement says the vast majority will be finished by 2.30 with most by 2. 3pm is the default postion.

Trial offices like Gatwick are now able to put 70% of the mail on the first wave and 30% on the second wave rather than the planned 60/40 split.

Remember every MPU ( mails processing unit where the sequencing machines are ) will serve a number of other delivery units called satellite office. The normal rule of thumb is for the furtherest office away to get their second wave of work first and it will depend on how many walks they have and firms as to how many batches that office will have. A batch can be up 6800 delivery points. Each batch of work has to run through the machines 3 times so it works 19 x 19 x19 = 6859 items.

This is normally done with 45 mins and normally there are a number of other machines. Obviously the nearer you are to an MPU the later you will get the mail and of course the MPU will recieves theirs the last.

Now the batch planner when you have the walk sequencing revison will ensure that any firms are on the first batch and that any cdvs are paired up on the batch and again batches are designed as a principle the walks furtherest from the office will get their mail first.

Now in terms of what time people get the mail certainly the ones in London which I have been involved in the latest an office has had their mail is 0900. Equally on a monday a different arrival pattern is used as a mail centre has a different workplan so in the main arrives earlier.

Now I know a lot of people believe that the savings derived from Squencing is small beer as you only assume its about saving 19 mins off 1000 items of mail. However sequencing is only one part of a jigsaw which incudes one outward plan which means a mail centre now only sorts to the other mail centres rather then breakdown the items to the recieving mail`s centres catchment areas ie the old PHG job so for example the whole of the manchester area will now go to manchester to break down their inward therefore saving hours in a mail centre and on network runs.

Then there is the one inward plan which reduces a mail centres inward and therefore allows further closures of mail centres.
Dingo,
Not true. A batch is 6859 delivery points and 10,200 items of mail. The 60/40 split means that 6000 items can be processed on Wave 1 (this should take a maximum of 45 minutes) and 4000 items on wave 2 (this should take a maximum of 30 minutes)

The steer on the latest arrival times of Wave 2 mails into D.O's is 10:00 and not 09:00 as per your steer in London. We have some large MPU's that are processing 18 batches and do not complete until 10:00. This results in major revisional activity in the affected D.O's. You are corrrect that some Mail Centres can achieve better than the 60/40 split. We have Gatwick, Southend and Bristol that are all achieving better than 60/40. This results in D.O's receiving more mail when they open and receiving final Wave 2 mails earlier. However, not all Mail Centres have sufficient capacity to process all MS2, MS3 and DSA mails before 22:00 so this is not achievable in all Mail Centres.

Unfortunately, this means that we do not have a solution that fits every Mail Centre and, indeed, we have different plans in each Mail Centre that commences one-pass mech plans (Inward and Outward) and Walk Sequencing. Local issues means that each Mail Centre is planned differently.

You state correctly that this is just one strand of modernisation and results in various longer term initiatives in terms of Mail Centre efficiencies and modernisation. Walk Sequencing also allows Royal Mail to change current mech kit in Mail Centres (CFC'c, LSM's and MTT's) to fewer and more efficient mech kit (IMP's and iLSM's)
Martin Walsh
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Joined: 19 Sep 2007, 20:12
Location: neverland

Re: new proposals

Post by Martin Walsh »

Mobster the point I was making is that so far in London we have the following MPUs Whetstone , Leytonstone, West London premier Park site will be deployed within the next few weeks and Stratford are having 4 new CSS machines.

All of the wave 2 mail is due to be in before 0900, we are pehaps luckier in London as the distances are not so great whereas Gatwick to Eastboune is a fair old distance.

In terms of whether mail centres can clear to 10 is dependent on a number of factors at the moment the London have a 45/55 split and therefore no where near achieving the 60 /40 split .

Now in terms of clear mail centres obviously LSMs and MTTs are going to be phased out and replaced with ilsms and upgraded imps. Clearly the single sort plan then makes it easier to process the mail .

At the moment Gatwick is on a 70 /30 split , and at a presntation by Richard Moor last week so are Manchester , Bristol and Covertry.
Geezer
EX ROYAL MAIL
Posts: 1347
Joined: 19 Jun 2007, 21:01

Re: new proposals

Post by Geezer »

Well in my office Towns and rural have been on a 3'0clock finish for about 2 years now. we were forced with exec action to a start time of 7 0'clock even though were the furthest office from the mail centre.
In fact an office 14 miles closer gets their mail at 05:30 which seems to go against the ruling of the offices furthest away get their mail run through the machines and sent out of the mail centre first seem like pie in the sky.