Are we now fighting the CWU as well as RM?

[motherhubbard]

I'm still a proud member of the Trade Union movement, not an idiot.
What are you? The lone prophet? Although your posts are starting to resemble the ramblings of an old man howling at the moon.
As Belial asks you - What is leaving the CWU actually going to achieve?

[dvbuk55]

I'm still a proud member of the Trade Union movement, not an idiot.
What are you? The lone prophet? Although your posts are starting to resemble the ramblings of an old man howling at the moon.
As Belial asks you - What is leaving the CWU actually going to achieve?

You say that like it means something and is important and I didn't say you were an idiot what I said was only an idiot would call this agreement progress - now is it progress or regression.

I am a poster on this forum just like you whose opinion is equal to yours though different.

Leaving the CWU was a matter of principle for me something sadly lacking in todays modern values, where there is tendency to a winners and losers mentality and a blind faith in the obviously flawed.

[motherhubbard]

What is it going to achieve? - apart from giving you a sense of moral superiority

[fishtank]

I'm still a proud member of the Trade Union movement, not an idiot.
What are you? The lone prophet? Although your posts are starting to resemble the ramblings of an old man howling at the moon.
As Belial asks you - What is leaving the CWU actually going to achieve?

What is it that makes you a proud member of the Trade Union movement?....paying £3 to the CWU....i think you can be one without the other.
You can certainly be a member of the CWU and not have the faintest idea what the Trade Union movement stands for....that has been well documented.
So i presume that it works in reverse.

[fishtank]

What is it going to achieve? - apart from giving you a sense of moral superiority

Why must everything come with an achievement?
Can't you do something because you feel it is right?
I just don't understand some peoples craving for an end result.

[pickaname]

London Weighting...now theres a farce for sure.

If London gains due to geographics or demographics then why doesnt the north east or scotland get paid less?

All on the same pay rate....yea right.

[motherhubbard]

To answer the first post- you are perfectly right that paying £3/week doesn't make you a good trade unionist per se. Perhaps the reverse is also true.
As to the second - the question isn't so much one of achievement but consequences. Leaving the CWU weakens the CWU. Is that good for us?
My answer is No.
I don't believe Billy and Dave are corrupt.
I don't think their main concern is the CWU "gravy train".
I think given the present situation of declining revenue streams and increased mechanisation that this is a good deal.
You can disagree but the problem is you then climb into bed with reactionary voices who are not simply anti this agreement, or anti CWU but anti the trade union movement and all that it represents and has represented.
Encouraging people to leave the CWU either overtly or covertly (by presenting your action as a shining moral example) is only helping those with an anti-progressive agenda.
What next - bragging about how you crossed the picket line?

[fishtank]

To answer the first post- you are perfectly right that paying £3/week doesn't make you a good trade unionist per se. Perhaps the reverse is also true.
As to the second - the question isn't so much one of achievement but consequences. Leaving the CWU weakens the CWU. Is that good for us?

I agree members leaving the CWU weakens the union but
Members leaving the CWU does not in itself cause members to leave the CWU
Failure to engage,listen to,protect and communicate with members causes members to leave the CWU,

I don't believe Billy and Dave are corrupt.
I don't think their main concern is the CWU "gravy train".

Those are personal opinions....I personally think corrupt may be a bit strong but maybe inept,out of touch and to be fair it is only human nature to have at least one eye on your personal circumstances.

I think given the present situation of declining revenue streams and increased mechanisation that this is a good deal.

It is in my opinion anything but a good deal...perhaps the best available...perhaps inevitable but never good,

You can disagree but the problem is you then climb into bed with reactionary voices who are not simply anti this agreement, or anti CWU but anti the trade union movement and all that it represents and has represented.

Definitely not mh otherwise the counter claim would be that agreeing with the deal puts you in bed with Royal Mail management.

Encouraging people to leave the CWU either overtly or covertly (by presenting your action as a shining moral example) is only helping those with an anti-progressive agenda.
What next - bragging about how you crossed the picket line?

Again you submit that this deal represents progression...i disagree...i believe that it represents a step backwards in the progression of our beloved Trade Union movement.

[motherhubbard]

Are you leaving the CWU?

[fishtank]

Are you leaving the CWU?

Is that a serious question motherhubbard?

[dvbuk55]

What is it going to achieve? - apart from giving you a sense of moral superiority

Why would I need to achieve anything from standing by MY principles and a sense of moral superiority?, nonsense, people are only considered superior by those who question their own values.

[motherhubbard]

Are you leaving the CWU?

Is that a serious question motherhubbard?

Why not?

[motherhubbard]

What is it going to achieve? - apart from giving you a sense of moral superiority

Why would I need to achieve anything from standing by MY principles and a sense of moral superiority?, nonsense, people are only considered superior by those who question their own values.

HOWL

[fishtank]

Are you leaving the CWU?

Is that a serious question motherhubbard?

Why not?

Then no mh,i will not be leaving the CWU however i completely respect and understand why others would choose to and if my circumstances were different i almost certainly would.
I don't buy into this "change from within" nonsense...it is a private party,always has been and you and i are not on the list.


P.S. what does HOWL mean?

[dvbuk55]

What is it going to achieve? - apart from giving you a sense of moral superiority

Why would I need to achieve anything from standing by MY principles and a sense of moral superiority?, nonsense, people are only considered superior by those who question their own values.

HOWL

Is that the cry of the she wolf guarding the trade union movement?