Night Tonic wrote:I wouldn't fret and don't see it being a bumpy ride. There will be more YES papers than NO. Lets be real about it, the YES voters won't be hanging around RMC anyway so content here is not representative of the majority. Cast your minds back to 2007 when RMC members were shocked to the core that the majority voted in favour of the modernisation agreement.
I have a feeling NT that it will be you that will be shocked to the core this time.
Run, rabbit run. Dig that hole, forget the sun.
And when at last the work is done. Don't sit down, it's time to dig another one
I think not. What people say and what they do are often different things and what is said here does not reflect the majority any more than it does if one DO has a large percentage against the agreement. As I say, don't fret about it or you're likely to be hit by the same result as 2007 and left smarting. If it was a landslide NO, and can't see it, that wouldn't take us any further forward, as Lovejoy has already hinted. I have never liked the CWU for reasons I don't and can't go in to, but for once I agree with it on this being the best deal achieveable.
You may not agree with that, and thats fine but the only 'breaking' as far as the CWU is concerned will be from its own members who often repeat the same mantra that "we are the union" or something equally meaningless. That then leaves you with no support at all and a scrapped deal. Way to go!
Don't believe everything you're told in the rest room
Night Tonic wrote:I think not. What people say and what they do are often different things and what is said here does not reflect the majority any more than it does if one DO has a large percentage against the agreement. As I say, don't fret about it or you're likely to be hit by the same result as 2007 and left smarting. If it was a landslide NO, and can't see it, that wouldn't take us any further forward, as Lovejoy has already hinted. I have never liked the CWU for reasons I don't and can't go in to, but for once I agree with it on this being the best deal achieveable.
You may not agree with that, and thats fine but the only 'breaking' as far as the CWU is concerned will be from its own members who often repeat the same mantra that "we are the union" or something equally meaningless. That then leaves you with no support at all and a scrapped deal. Way to go!
Have you not thought to change your name to Neville Chamberlain and get yourself a piece of paper and a white flag while you are at it!.
If the agreement gets through i'll be stopping my subs, really i should be voting Yes. Leaving or going part-time to continue studies but anyone voting Yes are off their heads. And I hope they end up with no pension, part-time and working till they die. Be warned. Death behold us!!!!
k979aaa wrote:Have you not thought to change your name to Neville Chamberlain and get yourself a piece of paper and a white flag while you are at it!.
No wonder polls on here are so far out if you can't even tolerate a view different from your own. I suspect I'll have the last laugh in that case.
I don't think so for the truth will be told and not sold out as you so want it to be!.
I am sorry I am a potential NO voter, though my mind is open to be convinced otherwise, but if people rely on the majority of feelings shown on here and don't contemplate that we might be in the minority and therefore don't do anything to promote a "No" from the membership we may very well be surprised and disappointed. We need to stop relying on people to read and understand the proposed agreement as most won't open it. We need to explain to these people why we recommend a "NO" and do it in a calm and polite manner. Tub thumping and declaring what is and what is not the truth is all fine and good, but we need to do more than just that.
We have to present counter arguments when people ask questions, not everyone is interested in the minutiae of the proposal until it actually effects them. You can see that on RMC, 2 years on from the 2007 deal and people are still asking for clarification on it, and the 2010 deal will be exactly the same.
All post by me in Green are Admin Posts. Any post in any other colour is my own responsibility. If you like a news story I posted please click the link to show support Any news stories you can't post - PM me with a link My sharing of news articles should not be interpreted as an endorsement or condemnation of any particular viewpoint or the issues presented. I share them solely for informational purposes.
i can understand ROYAL FAIL not wanting to pay for D2D and for us to work our hours ( i do this most weeks anyway )
but to start straight off with a pay cut for delivery staff is total B/S
if the allowance was put up to a reasonable £35 i would vote yes
But to ask us to take a pay cut its a NO VOTE FROM ME
dvbuk55 wrote:
Take a look at the managers brief the closures have already been ratified by the CWU so if you want a rethink vote NO.
Glenno wrote:This was always going to happen it was going to happen even before this Agreement
I don't like this undertone from the CWU of 'oh well, MC staff are relatively small in number compared to the massive amount of delivery members, so we won't oppose MC closures as the majority of our subs will still be safe'. I don't like the shrug-of-the-shoulders attitude of the above posts much either.
What happened to defending ALL members ? We all pay our subs, don't we ?
I thought RM operated a 'divide and rule' policy. Looks like the CWU is converting to RM's religion, even before the forthcoming marriage that is the 2010 And Beyond agreement
dvbuk55 wrote:
Take a look at the managers brief the closures have already been ratified by the CWU so if you want a rethink vote NO.
Glenno wrote:This was always going to happen it was going to happen even before this Agreement
I don't like this undertone from the CWU of 'oh well, MC staff are relatively small in number compared to the massive amount of delivery members, so we won't oppose MC closures as the majority of our subs will still be safe'. I don't like the shrug-of-the-shoulders attitude of the above posts much either.
What happened to defending ALL members ? We all pay our subs, don't we ?
I thought RM operated a 'divide and rule' policy. Looks like the CWU is converting to RM's religion, even before the forthcoming marriage that is the 2010 And Beyond agreement
I wasn't shrugging my shoulders at the closures HSO - all closures should be justified and if there is a case for it to remain open only a NO vote will bring the issue back to the table.
I wasn't shrugging my shoulders at the closures HSO - all closures should be justified and if there is a case for it to remain open only a NO vote will bring the issue back to the table.
Totally agree DVB ,I also was not shrugging my shoulders All Mail-centres closures should be justified &
if not leave well alone.. the point i was making earlier was we were Never going to get a vote on the
closures as this is in RM/Work-Plan.. which we dont get to Vote on
Glenno wrote:Never going to get a vote on the closures as this is in RM/Work-Plan.. which we dont get to Vote on
So, on that basis, if withdrawing all D2D and ESA payments with NO Delivery supplement were part of RM's 5-year plan, the CWU should have rubber-stamped that too, with no opposition ?
I'm a no-voter, but I'm seriously debating whether I should stay in a union that is so accomodating to RM after my ballot paper has been despatched
