timetable for ballot

[Big Daz]

Thats the problem,I wouldnt have a clue as to how good or bad this is for other functions/grades.

I would love to hear the case for balloting us alltogether as one.

The job of local rep in a D.O will be a lot harder if this is voted in without majority support from deliveries.

[clashcityrocker]

You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/ week worse off and I will vote no.
You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/week better off and I will vote yes.
You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/week worse off but I think this is the best possible deal in the circumstances and I will vote yes.
You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/week better off but I don't believe this is a good deal for the members of the CWU and I will vote no.
(£10,£20,£30 - put in whatever takes your fancy.)

I would hope that people look further than the bottom line on their payslip next week before considering what to vote.
It is possibly one of the biggest agreements, bringing far-ranging changes, that people will see in their working lives.It ain't just about pounds and pence.
Because to be perfectly honest I am tired of reading "there's this bloke in our office with 1900 drops and he gets 3 D2D every week......."

[dvbuk55]

You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/ week worse off and I will vote no.
You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/week better off and I will vote yes.
You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/week worse off but I think this is the best possible deal in the circumstances and I will vote yes.
You can look at the deal and say I will be £10/week better off but I don't believe this is a good deal for the members of the CWU and I will vote no.
(£10,£20,£30 - put in whatever takes your fancy.)

I would hope that people look further than the bottom line on their payslip next week before considering what to vote.
It is possibly one of the biggest agreements, bringing far-ranging changes, that people will see in their working lives.It ain't just about pounds and pence.
Because to be perfectly honest I am tired of reading "there's this bloke in our office with 1900 drops and he gets 3 D2D every week......."

Some will be substantially more than 10 quid worse off and if you happen to be the bloke with 1900 drops and 3 lots a week it would be substantially even more!

However levity aside, there are far more reaching changes afoot that haven't been adequately explained.

What is the new financial arrangement? What is the restructuring of the CWU entailing? And what does "Both parties are fully committed to all elements of this national agreement and neither will sanction any local negotiations which seek to change the principles or spirit of this agreement and/or make their deployment less effective and/or delay implementation." actually mean. How about management executive action and local industrial action will no longer be necessary - now does that MEAN necessary or does it mean sanctioned.

What about the tools for revision? Any ideas on what an "enabled" delivery will be? How about the workshops?-longer WTL sessions?

Oh yes there is indeed more to this proposed agreement than meets the eye.

[patio1]

well if people on here are sick of hearing 1900 calls this and that .
then why are they on here. this is a site to gather imformation about what is and what is going to happen to our working lives.

i thank the moderators and workers of this site very much and so do plenty of my colleagues who work in my office because if it wasn,t for this chat we would of heard nothing from rep and manager because the manager has told us he is not allowed to discuss agreement for 2 weeks at least. and as for the rep he is so far behind the manager there is no room for manouvre lol.

p.s i am a posty on foot with 20 years behind me. i have walked /rode/ ran/ jumped/ drove/ skipped.

p.s i have a lot more walking to do by the looks of things .

[studmuffin]

It won't start on 29th.


6th April is new date for dispatch.

When will we all know the result MAY 6th

yep, when the tories win on may 6th, it will be the beginning of the end of royal mail, deal or no deal...........

There is no date set for the election yet, mate.

when the tories win on whatever date, deal or no deal, it will the last rites for royal mail...

[dongash]

either way the staff in delivery are the biggest losers, and everybody gets to have a say in the " more work, less money" s**t!!!!!!!

[BELIAL]

well if people on here are sick of hearing 1900 calls this and that .
then why are they on here. this is a site to gather imformation about what is and what is going to happen to our working lives.

i thank the moderators and workers of this site very much and so do plenty of my colleagues who work in my office because if it wasn,t for this chat we would of heard nothing from rep and manager because the manager has told us he is not allowed to discuss agreement for 2 weeks at least. and as for the rep he is so far behind the manager there is no room for manouvre lol.

p.s i am a posty on foot with 20 years behind me. i have walked /rode/ ran/ jumped/ drove/ skipped.

p.s i have a lot more walking to do by the looks of things .

Good post and good points. It seems like our union operates as an old boys network with the same old familiar faces in their cosy little niches taking a dim view of anyone who questions the leadership line.
Democracy and wider participation is the last thing these cosseted union lardarses want.

[headscrewedon]

either way the staff in delivery are the biggest losers, and everybody gets to have a say in the " more work, less money" s**t!!!!!!!

Tell that to the 50% of mail centre staff who will lose their jobs if this deal is accepted.

It could just as easily be argued 'How come delivery staff get to vote on a deal that could leave MC staff with NO work and NO money ???'

Well, like it or not, the union is a collective, and unless you want a series of local agreements and no national bargaining, we are stuck with a system where members are voting on agreements that have whole swathes of changes in parts of the businesss that they aren't employed in.

People should be voting on the merits of the deal as a whole, but realistically, many will vote solely on how it affects them personally.

About 30% of members will note even use their vote , if past ballot results are anything to go by.

MC workers - like my husband - could be forgiven for saying 'so, basically, I lose my job because 1000's of delivery staff couldn't be bothered to put a X on a ballot paper and post it?'

[dvbuk55]

either way the staff in delivery are the biggest losers, and everybody gets to have a say in the " more work, less money" s**t!!!!!!!

Tell that to the 50% of mail centre staff who will lose their jobs if this deal is accepted.

It could just as easily be argued 'How come delivery staff get to vote on a deal that could leave MC staff with NO work and NO money ???'

Well, like it or not, the union is a collective, and unless you want a series of local agreements and no national bargaining, we are stuck with a system where members are voting on agreements that have whole swathes of changes in parts of the businesss that they aren't employed in.

People should be voting on the merits of the deal as a whole, but realistically, many will vote solely on how it affects them personally.

About 30% of members will note even use their vote , if past ballot results are anything to go by.

MC workers - like my husband - could be forgiven for saying 'so, basically, I lose my job because 1000's of delivery staff couldn't be bothered to put a X on a ballot paper and post it?'

You do have a point about not being bothered to vote, each and every person entitled to vote should do so, however, the vote itself will not save the MCs slated for closure, which has already been accepted by the CWU so in that respect this vote is irrelevant.

[headscrewedon]

the vote itself will not save the MCs slated for closure, which has already been accepted by the CWU so in that respect this vote is irrelevant.

So, following that line of argument, it's pointless voting Yes or No then ?

You seem to be arguing that if the PEC of the CWU have accepted this deal, everything in it is coming in regardless of whether WE ratify the agreement ?

I expect RM management to dole-out the 'Resistance is futile' argument. I didn't realise that the PEC have the power to change our lives regardless of whether WE actually vote for / against what they have negotiated

[dvbuk55]

the vote itself will not save the MCs slated for closure, which has already been accepted by the CWU so in that respect this vote is irrelevant.

So, following that line of argument, it's pointless voting Yes or No then ?

You seem to be arguing that if the PEC of the CWU have accepted this deal, everything in it is coming in regardless of whether WE ratify the agreement ?

I expect RM management to dole-out the 'Resistance is futile' argument. I didn't realise that the PEC have the power to change our lives regardless of whether WE actually vote for / against what they have negotiated

You either misunderstand me or I failed to explain clearly. The closures have already been discussed prior to this agreement and indeed some of the MCs already know their fate. The only sop I would suggest is the new rules for EVR and the travelling expenses - relevant only to those who will be subject to closure.

[Big Daz]

Dvbuk speaks wise words

MC closures are hear to stay,they were dooomed from the second Richard Hooper published his report

What the CWU can do and have done, is to ensure the exit package is above the legal minium and improve terms for staff travelling to new locations. They have also forced RM to use more logic in deciding which MC's close. The RM way is to put on a blindfold and point to a location on a map.

I can see RM proposing to close Pboro or Cambridge MC and there is allready a massive empty building at a location aprox half way between the two MC's.

[dongash]

BEEN TO A UNION MEETING THIS MORNING ATTENDED BY APPX 15 PEOPLE ( OUT OF A DELIVERY OFFICE OF ABOUT 135/140 STAFF) THE REP RECKONED THAT ALTHOUGH IT WASN'T THE BEST DEAL IN THE WORLD, IT WAS THE BEST THEY COULD GET IN THE PRESENT CLIMATE. HE RECKONED ROYAL MAIL WERE AFTER THE DOOR TO DOOR AS PART OF THE WORKLOAD FOR NO PAYMENT, AS WELL AS THE PROTECTED EARLY START MONEY. HE SAYS WE SHOULD VOTE YES AS THERE IS NO "PLAN B". IF WE VOTE NO, THEN A LOT OF THE PROPOSALS COULD BE BROUGHT IN ANY WAY?

[Just_My_Opinion]

BEEN TO A UNION MEETING THIS MORNING ATTENDED BY APPX 15 PEOPLE ( OUT OF A DELIVERY OFFICE OF ABOUT 135/140 STAFF) THE REP RECKONED THAT ALTHOUGH IT WASN'T THE BEST DEAL IN THE WORLD, IT WAS THE BEST THEY COULD GET IN THE PRESENT CLIMATE. HE RECKONED ROYAL MAIL WERE AFTER THE DOOR TO DOOR AS PART OF THE WORKLOAD FOR NO PAYMENT, AS WELL AS THE PROTECTED EARLY START MONEY. HE SAYS WE SHOULD VOTE YES AS THERE IS NO "PLAN B". IF WE VOTE NO, THEN A LOT OF THE PROPOSALS COULD BE BROUGHT IN ANY WAY?

I'd rather let them bring/force their proposals in knowing I had voted no and stuck up for myself. I'm not going to vote yes in because there is no plan B. That's no reason for voting yes.

[BELIAL]

BEEN TO A UNION MEETING THIS MORNING ATTENDED BY APPX 15 PEOPLE ( OUT OF A DELIVERY OFFICE OF ABOUT 135/140 STAFF) THE REP RECKONED THAT ALTHOUGH IT WASN'T THE BEST DEAL IN THE WORLD, IT WAS THE BEST THEY COULD GET IN THE PRESENT CLIMATE. HE RECKONED ROYAL MAIL WERE AFTER THE DOOR TO DOOR AS PART OF THE WORKLOAD FOR NO PAYMENT, AS WELL AS THE PROTECTED EARLY START MONEY. HE SAYS WE SHOULD VOTE YES AS THERE IS NO "PLAN B". IF WE VOTE NO, THEN A LOT OF THE PROPOSALS COULD BE BROUGHT IN ANY WAY?

I'd rather let them bring/force their proposals in knowing I had voted no and stuck up for myself. I'm not going to vote yes in because there is no plan B. That's no reason for voting yes.

I agree it smacks of "do as we say or else" . Not only is it a very crude attempt at coercion but it could be viewed as the desperate actions of a bullying clique. It is not their role to say "if you disagree with us and vote NO we will take our ball home". If our leadership do not want to represent our views and fight for them then perhaps they should seriously consider their positions. If you don't like the job you can always resign