What happens If its a No Result

[pcb]

Well one thing is for certain Mandy will definitely not be talking about pensions when deliveries bring in a no vote. Plus when the TXXY scum get in all hell will break loose! 20 years time posters like "Remember the Posties" will hang on student walls lamenting the demise of the CWU! Because we could'nt get our heads around basic and weekly supplements which could be taken away!

[MinisterofCucumber]

pcb,

You sound like you are trying to associate a vision of Armegeddon with voting no.

If there is a no vote, the world will not end. We have been working in limbo for the past five months and we are still here. Maybe the vote should be "Do you want to carry on as you have been for the last few months or do you want to work under the proposed agreement?"

The contentious issues in the proposed agreement are longer Saturdays, unlimited junkmail, working to the top ten per cent workrate, no cap on delivery spans, discrimination against part-timers, closure of half of all Mail Centres etc.

Getting our heads around basic and weekly supplements which can be taken away is the least of our problems with this trecherous proposal.

[dvbuk55]

pcb,

You sound like you are trying to associate a vision of Armegeddon with voting no.

If there is a no vote, the world will not end. We have been working in limbo for the past five months and we are still here. Maybe the vote should be "Do you want to carry on as you have been for the last few months or do you want to work under the proposed agreement?"

The contentious issues in the proposed agreement are longer Saturdays, unlimited junkmail, working to the top ten per cent workrate, no cap on delivery spans, discrimination against part-timers, closure of half of all Mail Centres etc.

Getting our heads around basic and weekly supplements which can be taken away is the least of our problems with this trecherous proposal.

Bravo MrC .

There has never been a comittment by the labour government to rectify the deficit, they wouldn't do it at 3 Bn and they are certainly not going to touch it at 10Bn.
Ther are long term problems with this agreement and they aren't about reward you are perfectly correct.

[Big Daz]

It was Mandy Pandy that linked modernisation and pension deficit together, he is now being put on the spot to keep his word. Perhaps it was a con trick from the Lord of darkness.

That said there is no modernisation as yet , just a set of words.

[andy2007]

but anyone who believes that Royal Mail are simply going to stump up more money and put on hold their plans then really have no idea of the financial postion of Royal Mail.

if people dont think the reward part of the package is right then they have to be prepared to fight for a bigger pot of money.

All through the strike the union kept pushing forward that this had nothing to do with pay but about conditions that we are expected to work in and work to.

I wish they would make up their bloody minds because it is quite evident they do not have a clue what goes on in the rank and file.

We want an agreement that is water tight not one that is as water tight as the Titanic,

An agreement that stops managers riding rough shot over the workers,

Working conditions that are not based on ludicrous computer programs done by people who have never stepped out on a delivery round or are ever likely to.

To be able to come to work and finish at a reasonable, sensible, family orientated time which allows people to actually have a life outside of Royal Mail.

Not have an agreement which when it is agreed will be twisted and manipulated to suit mangers whims and woes from day to day.

An agreement that has a specific delivery span, not one which, when mangers get their way, will potentially have us out for ridiculous lengths of time because of some stupid wording that it is an "enabler". The numpties that allowed that one to get in there want parading in front of the membership to receive what they deserve....

Bravo Ricky!

This is exactly the problem with these secrecy clauses! The negotiating team decided that it would be acceptable for us to suffer worse terms and conditions, in exchange for extra money. THEY WERE WRONG!!!!! And they didn't even get that right. There are many who'll be out of pocket!

We should be concentrating on our T&Cs, and IF we also get some money. Then we should ensure that it's given out FAIRLY! The fact that I'll be one of those who'll actually gain financially if this gets voted in, is IRRELEVANT. I will NOT sell my Collegues down the river for financial gain. I will NOT accept vague promises, in leu of protection of my T&Cs. I will NOT accept an agreement which legitamises WCM, without protection from it continuing to be abused!!!!!

[OnAFlyer]

Our manager said he thinks a No vote won't stop the changes going ahead, and that RM will introduce them via EA. He's not a scaremonger btw, just a straight talker unlike some managers. He also said he can't realistically think of how we are going to get 1 Saturday off in 4 unless it's some sort of collapsing arrangement

If he's right would there be enough people left willing to strike again?

[dvbuk55]

Our manager said he thinks a No vote won't stop the changes going ahead, and that RM will introduce them via EA. He's not a scaremonger btw, just a straight talker unlike some managers. He also said he can't realistically think of how we are going to get 1 Saturday off in 4 unless it's some sort of collapsing arrangement

If he's right would there be enough people left willing to strike again?

There is no doubt RM will try to implement change by EA as they have done in the last 18 months with some success, but they will not accomplish the savings if they have an unwilling workforce carrying out the changes. As the changes would not be agreed then it would go to disagreement and the process would begin all over again.

The reason why the national ballot was so successful was because some areas were being asked to perform to the 2007 agreement which they had been paid for but didn't want to implement but the main reason was the offices who had had EA exercised on them and was having no more. The union could not have been unaware of the depth of feeling against these imposed changes and chose to do nothing until forced to. Then pulled the plug for the Interim agreement and finally 4 months later come forward with this despicable proposal.

There's something in the region of 1500 delivery offices and to implement change uniformally without agreement would be nigh on impossible. And of course we would have the CWU to defend our existing agreements - PROVIDING THERE IS A NO VOTE - or else it will be


"Both parties are fully committed to all elements of this national agreement and neither will sanction any local negotiations which seek to change the principles or spirit of this agreement and/or make their deployment less effective and/or delay implementation."

[dvbuk55]

but anyone who believes that Royal Mail are simply going to stump up more money and put on hold their plans then really have no idea of the financial postion of Royal Mail.

if people dont think the reward part of the package is right then they have to be prepared to fight for a bigger pot of money.

All through the strike the union kept pushing forward that this had nothing to do with pay but about conditions that we are expected to work in and work to.

I wish they would make up their bloody minds because it is quite evident they do not have a clue what goes on in the rank and file.

We want an agreement that is water tight not one that is as water tight as the Titanic,

An agreement that stops managers riding rough shot over the workers,

Working conditions that are not based on ludicrous computer programs done by people who have never stepped out on a delivery round or are ever likely to.

To be able to come to work and finish at a reasonable, sensible, family orientated time which allows people to actually have a life outside of Royal Mail.

Not have an agreement which when it is agreed will be twisted and manipulated to suit mangers whims and woes from day to day.

An agreement that has a specific delivery span, not one which, when mangers get their way, will potentially have us out for ridiculous lengths of time because of some stupid wording that it is an "enabler". The numpties that allowed that one to get in there want parading in front of the membership to receive what they deserve....

Bravo Ricky!

This is exactly the problem with these secrecy clauses! The negotiating team decided that it would be acceptable for us to suffer worse terms and conditions, in exchange for extra money. THEY WERE WRONG!!!!! And they didn't even get that right. There are many who'll be out of pocket!

We should be concentrating on our T&Cs, and IF we also get some money. Then we should ensure that it's given out FAIRLY! The fact that I'll be one of those who'll actually gain financially if this gets voted in, is IRRELEVANT. I will NOT sell my Collegues down the river for financial gain. I will NOT accept vague promises, in leu of protection of my T&Cs. I will NOT accept an agreement which legitamises WCM, without protection from it continuing to be abused!!!!!

The union sold us the ballot for strikes on T&C`s, just like the 2007 disgrace they again seem to think that we will take a few extra "pennies" all will be well irrespective of how hard we eventually have to work under the managerial hammer. It reinforces my own belief that our union representatives at the higher levels have completely lost touch with those that they are meant to speak for and should be removed from office. They are quite evidently stuck in the dark ages off using a few well used chosen words/phrases to stir the blood of the members then fail miserably in their own endeavours.

We are lions led by donkey`s and Hayes, Ward et al should all go with a new breed of politically, managerial savy leader(s) to help us through this new economical and political climate were big business is allowed to steam roller anything through as long as it is deemed to be "modernisation".

Yes I can see where you have gone wrong, like many of us, you assume the aspirations of the leadership are the same as the membership. How wrong can we be. No you see the object of the strike was not to win good terms and conditions for the membership, no, it was to put the CWU on the Board of Royal Mail to nod through all and any changes they wanted for the next three years, by which time the leadership will either have retired early or taken their place in the labour party. After the election whichever side wins there appears to be a tacit agreement that for the next three years there will be peace and harmony on the industrial front because of this proposed agreement. Well it didn't work for the last agreement.

[belle smith]

It was Mandy Pandy that linked modernisation and pension deficit together, he is now being put on the spot to keep his word. Perhaps it was a con trick from the Lord of darkness.

That said there is no modernisation as yet , just a set of words.

Where did he say this Daz, by the way it is a con trick! WE WILL GET OUR PENSIONS with or without a yes vote, we have a legal entitelment to them. It wont be decided on the f***ing whim of overlord mandelson, or his holiday companion boy george!!!

[MinisterofCucumber]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... g-him.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[belle smith]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... g-him.html

Thats not the boy george that i was reffering to. do you now were mandy :mfo said this??

[MinisterofCucumber]

In the House of Lords.

Mandelson said that the recommendations of the Hooper report should be implemented as a package. He also said that he didn't think the EU would allow the UK government to take on the pension liability as this would be seen as state aid. He must have been aware that the EU allowed the French government to take over the pension liability of its postal service.

[belle smith]

I was meaning this part which looks recent.

That said there is no modernisation as yet , just a set of words.

[fishtank]

I was meaning this part which looks recent.

That said there is no modernisation as yet , just a set of words.

Those words belong to Daz,not mandleson.

[belle smith]

I was meaning this part which looks recent.

That said there is no modernisation as yet , just a set of words.

Those words belong to Daz,not mandleson.

Cheers fishtank...is that twice in 2 days you've had to correct my reading.